02/15/09 [DMFA #972] - Backstory… words words words words…

[SpottedKitty]

Interesting that she thinks of Dan as "that adventurer's son".

I'm wondering if this helps pin down the time when Edward disappeared and Destania went looking for him. At first, I had the impression (I think it was from the things Alexsi said way back when Dan's headwings first appeared) that it had all happened some time ago when Dan was much younger. The end of the Amazons/DP arc showed Destania at least was still at Lost Lake at the time Dan started out as an adventurer. Have we just been given another clue, or another red herring?

What am I talking about, this is Amber. It's probably both.   

[Naldru]

Actually, I'm wondering if the discussion of the legal system on Furrae could have been a reference to Regina's little escapade.  After all, we are discussing a dozen beings being killed and it would have been reasonable for a family member (Kria) to pay the fines.

[thegayhare]

The speculation seems to be that while she tried to kill Dan's friends she didn't succeed.  This is based on the line that she almost killed Wildy.  Now since Wildy isn't the be all and end all of Dan's freinds how do we know that Regina didn't succeed in part.  Shoe could have killed any number of freinds that we don't know of simply because... they are dead.   Wildy maybe alive now simply because while dan was to late for the others he barely made it there for her.

Regina seems to give off a fatal attraction sort of vibe to me.  I get the feeling she may have been crushing on Dan at one point and wanted him all for her own.  she killed people she  thought  might come between them.  starting with perhapse peole she thought might be giving him the eye, then moving on to his freinds so she didn't have to share his attentions.

[Tapewolf]

She could have killed any number of friends that we don't know of simply because... they are dead.

Excellent point.  It's likely the story would be spun more in that direction if we'd had Regina's Story instead of Abel's Story.

Regina seems to give off a fatal attraction sort of vibe to me.  I get the feeling she may have been crushing on Dan at one point and wanted him all for her own.  she killed people she  thought  might come between them.

Or, she was trying to show how strong she was, thinking that he'd fall for her, demon-style.

[Noone]

Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk. He certainly is a lot better behaved than Regina, but if, assuming for a moment, that his backstory was entirely erased from view, I wonder what fans would think of him. They wouldn't know that he had a lot of traumatic experiences that led him to have the personality he has in present day DMFA.

I wonder if Regina had some similar ordeals that made her what she is. Of course, her behavior is a good deal more 'out of control' than Abel's, but still, it's possible that she wasn't simply born with her personality. It is mentioned that she didn't get along with her parents, maybe adventurers killed most of her immediate friends and she has a grudge against beings and wants to kill every one she can find? I'm not saying that's the case... but it is worthwhile to consider all reasonable possibilities.
I'm wondering if reception to her would be different if Regina's story was written instead of Abel's story.

[Pagan]

I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.

In other news, I hope Dan catches up to her.

[Amber Williams]

*de-lurkus*

I said it once before, but I don't remember if it was in person or on paper...so I may as well step up and say it now.  When it came to backstory war...I once mentioned there was going to be dissapointment for some people regardless of which side won.  Abel's because there was not going to be a mention of the library incident, and Regina's because it wasn't really a backstory for her...but a backstory for Dan where Regina played a major focus.  People who were bidding expecting to get Regina's life and her perspective were going to be incredibly sore since everything was pretty much told from Dan's point of view.  It was set up to be more Dan's backstory and as this comic likely hinted at, was more going to focus on a key event rather than a life-story.

Which ugh...is why I always joke about how Regina's story would have been long since done rather than Abel's Story which is taking narfing forever.  


I have also made it one of those things that when I do DMFA, I try to keep the side stories out of mind in the regard that I write DMFA as if no one actually reads Abel's Story and any of the mini-arcs.  So you can likely expect a similar gloss-over to Abel's backstory at some point.  It puts Devin in a bit of a fun spot since while people who read Abel's Story has a good idea of who he was...as far as DMFA's main canon is concerned, he is still just an Undead that works for Kria.

I will say this much, and likely nothing more.  The update delay between her very first appearance and now was bad pacing on my part. And I apologize if the delay caused her to be a bit overhyped. I have little doubt Regina is going to dissapoint a few people. But at the same time, I also hope many peeps realize she is a new character and the current story has sort of caught her at one of her more unpleasant times.  And much like Dark Pegasus...sometimes it takes a bit of time before a character gets their stride.  I admit my biggest worry, as well as probably the worry of any creative worker person, is that when making a character who has some very unlikable traits...I worry that a character is unlikable not because that is how they were meant to be...but unlikable because I am a bad writer.  

[Tapewolf]

Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk.

That's an interesting point, but I'm not quite convinced.  He was displaying a certain, subdued affection for Dan back before AS kicked off - for example, his reaction when Ink got at Dan.  I wrote a detailed analysis of at back at the time which I can dig up if you're interested, but my conclusion was that nearly everything Abel did for Dan was done for his benefit, even if the results didn't quite pan out the way he'd intended.

He certainly is a lot better behaved than Regina, but if, assuming for a moment, that his backstory was entirely erased from view, I wonder what fans would think of him. They wouldn't know that he had a lot of traumatic experiences that led him to have the personality he has in present day DMFA.

This I beg to differ on.  The scenes in the shopping arc, where Abel sees the paint, and every scene where Abel is asked about his parents.  I believe AS was running at the time of the paint incident, but that was so far before things hit the fan that we could only guess what it meant.  My assumption then was that his family had been massacred.  Now, it's more likely a flashback to Hennya.
Then there's the business about Abel refusing to shapeshift, sleeping and eating habitually, even at the Academy where he's not trying to maintain a disguise.  Again, AS was running but not at the critical point yet.  Even so, it suggested to me that he'd had a rough time of it.

[Janus Whitefurr]

I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.

...it was less about 'ending' the fandom and more that there used to be huge flailings that Regina should have won so she got her story instead of Abel. So of course, with Regina's backstory in condensed form, there might be some flailing.  S'why we're all over here in the snack corner being disappointed at the lack of it. 

Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk.

That's an interesting point, but I'm not quite convinced.  He was displaying a certain, subdued affection for Dan back before AS kicked off - for example, his reaction when Ink got at Dan.  I wrote a detailed analysis of at back at the time which I can dig up if you're interested, but my conclusion was that nearly everything Abel did for Dan was done for his benefit, even if the results didn't quite pan out the way he'd intended.

Strangely, the first thing to come to mind was not the button-pressing quote from Ink, but Abel staring at the "bishounen" test and flailing about how he'd just -made- that outfit for Dan.

(As for Amber delurkingu - never panic! We trust in yoooou~)

[rabid_fox]

I'm just glad to have some frigging insight as to this whole Regina/Dan conflict. Last few updates, it felt like everyone knew but me.

[Tapewolf]

Strangely, the first thing to come to mind was not the button-pressing quote from Ink, but Abel staring at the "bishounen" test and flailing about how he'd just -made- that outfit for Dan.

That would be affection for the outfit, though...

[thegayhare]

Or, she was trying to show how strong she was, thinking that he'd fall for her, demon-style.

Also a likely possibility...

Though I will admit I may be allowing my own situation to taint my veiws of regina here.


she could have simply befreinded Dan and used him to kill alot of people because playing a famous adventures son for a patsey like that would be a real boost to her status as a younger demon

[inuhanyo]

I wonder if Regina had some similar ordeals that made her what she is. Of course, her behavior is a good deal more 'out of control' than Abel's, but still, it's possible that she wasn't simply born with her personality. It is mentioned that she didn't get along with her parents, maybe adventurers killed most of her immediate friends and she has a grudge against beings and wants to kill every one she can find? I'm not saying that's the case... but it is worthwhile to consider all reasonable possibilities.
I'm wondering if reception to her would be different if Regina's story was written instead of Abel's story.

For a demon of her age, Regina's behavior is perfectly normal.  Scary thought, isn't it?

Kria is kind and compassionate, for a demon.  And she eats tour guides.  Her mental list of "how can I cheer Lorendra up" was mostly "lets go kill things".  Reread Kria's explanation of her worldview to Jyrras.  Demons are not nice people.

I'm just glad to have some frigging insight as to this whole Regina/Dan conflict. Last few updates, it felt like everyone knew but me.

When Regina showed up in this arc, Amber updated her cast page.  That's where I was getting my information.  Plus a lot of connecting the dots, which involved a certain amount of interpretation and supposition.  I don't know yet how much of it I got right.  I think I can say now,  that I nailed that Dan does not think well of Regina, and would find any gushing by her towards him to be revolting.  Of course, I got that from the panel where she first appeared.

It's easier now to understand the strength of Dan's reaction to becoming a cubi. 

[Tapewolf]

For a demon of her age, Regina's behavior is perfectly normal.  Scary thought, isn't it?
Kria is kind and compassionate, for a demon.  And she eats tour guides.  Her mental list of "how can I cheer Lorendra up" was mostly "lets go kill things".  Reread Kria's explanation of her worldview to Jyrras.  Demons are not nice people.

From what Amber was saying not too long ago about 'Cubi being treated with suspicion and contempt by Demons, Regina's actions are curious.  What she (Amber) said was that 'Cubi are considered weak because they rely on subterfuge most of the time.  That makes Regina's line about 'using his trust to kill a dozen Beings' rather strange.

[GabrielsThoughts]

  it's too bad Amber decided to make Reggie an unlikable villain. I really can't feel sorry for her, I don't sympathize with her, and other than the fact she's cute...for a demon, I see noting but distance preventing Dan tearing her limb from limb. My only sympathies are for her wasted potential as a character. All that smoke, and no fire.

*grabs popcorn* oh well maybe I'll see some cool pyrotechnics after the slaying.

[M]

Well, the demon philosophy is "might makes right".  Hence the lack of vengeance seeking from a slain demon's relatives.  The moral immaturity isn't just Regina's. 

Running into these kind of Creatures is how Dan got his prejudice.  Perfectly rational.

You're absolutely right. I totally forgot about that.

But it's not about murder that I find her immature about. It's just that the line, "This is like...totally unfair", kind of got to me, like she doesn't think Dan should be reacting to anything at all (even after she lists off all the reasons in her head!).

Also there's her whole spoiled personality (like with Lorenda and her "harem dream"), but that''s a different topic.

[Tyranastrasz]

Regina is Lucky to have Kira as an aunt AND Lorenda as a cousin or else Regina's blood might be spilled in the next few minutes.
Kira may be eccentric in her approach to wooing a guy and her direct approach cough Dan off guard ...but that was bound to happen.

At the end of this I think Regina is going to owe Kira and Lorenda her life.  Dan may be a young cubi but he is a skilled and retired adventurer.

Kira=The guy from Death Note.

Kria=The mass-murdering demon-mare from DMFA

There's a difference, people!

I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.

...it was less about 'ending' the fandom and more that there used to be huge flailings that Regina should have won so she got her story instead of Abel. So of course, with Regina's backstory in condensed form, there might be some flailing.  S'why we're all over here in the snack corner being disappointed at the lack of it. 

It's turned out considerably less interesting than I thought...  

[M]

it's too bad Amber decided to make Reggie an unlikable villain. I really can't feel sorry for her, I don't sympathize with her, and other than the fact she's cute...for a demon, I see noting but distance preventing Dan tearing her limb from limb. My only sympathies are for her wasted potential as a character. All that smoke, and no fire.

I think the general disappointment stems from the fact that most fans of Regina over-hyped her possible back story and her personality.

And I think she's far from wasted potential. I find her personality pretty intriguing in that she's not only a young and inexperienced demon, but she's also like a spoiled child. She's like the complete opposite of what we've seen from pretty much the only (known) villian, Dark Pegasus. And we've only just met her. She has room to grow.

And like it was pointed out to me, it's important to keep in mind that she is, for all we know, a typical demon, and that she's going to have the typical values. She is going to be unlikable to us, because most of us don't agree with her brand of reasoning.

[Sunblink]

CUE THE BUTTHURT CROWD.

I like Regina. Psychopaths are awesome characters; they tend to be more interesting than some heroes. (Although I admit, I'm going more for the "BWARGH Regina's an awesome character but an awful person" love-hate angle than a "STFU SHE'S JUST MISUNDERSTOOD" perspective. Because the latter is just retarded.)

I'm glad for the extrapolation. This makes me more fascinated with her. I pretty much thought she was going to be a ***** to begin with, so I'm not exactly disappointed by the revelation that she really tried to screw up Dan's life.

I mean seriously. After her first appearance, who could think she was going to be a nice character? The idea everyone's so disappointed and whining about her being unlikeable just has me in stitches.

[inuhanyo]

From what Amber was saying not too long ago about 'Cubi being treated with suspicion and contempt by Demons, Regina's actions are curious.  What she (Amber) said was that 'Cubi are considered weak because they rely on subterfuge most of the time.  That makes Regina's line about 'using his trust to kill a dozen Beings' rather strange.

Maybe Regina's use of subterfuge in this case is what got her in bad with her parents.  As a young demon (hence less powerfull), she'd have more excuse for resorting to such "weakling" tactics, but even so...

Well, the demon philosophy is "might makes right".  Hence the lack of vengeance seeking from a slain demon's relatives.  The moral immaturity isn't just Regina's. 

Running into these kind of Creatures is how Dan got his prejudice.  Perfectly rational.

You're absolutely right. I totally forgot about that.

But it's not about murder that I find her immature about. It's just that the line, "This is like...totally unfair", kind of got to me, like she doesn't think Dan should be reacting to anything at all (even after she lists off all the reasons in her head!).

That's the point I was trying to make (sorry I wasn't clear enough).  Because of their might makes right philosophy, demons don't take it personally, so it's natural for them to have a hard time understanding why Beings do.   The whinyness is Regina's immaturity, though.  Aliph just considered "taking it personal" as weak emotionality.  Of course that's a harder attitude to take when you are the one fleeing.

[Jairus]

Oh, don't get me wrong. Regina has an interesting character... from the perspective of getting a viewpoint into the mind of your average demon and that of a nigh-psychopathic character. She is not sympathetic, but I'm going to enjoy watching what happens next.

[Lucheek]

A lot of people don't seem to like Regina....but she reminds me a lot of Kria, and people seemed to like the petty pshycopath Kria. I don't know, maybe I'm missing somethihng.

[Tapewolf]

A lot of people don't seem to like Regina....but she reminds me a lot of Kria, and people seemed to like the petty pshycopath Kria. I don't know, maybe I'm missing somethihng.

Feelings ran a little high over the wallpaper war.  A number of people were put out because she lost.  That's fair enough, but since then she has been hyped up to a standard that she could never possibly live up to.  I'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina per se.

[Sunblink]

I'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina per se.

Well, me too. But I'm pretty tired of the mass whining about something that should have been obvious from the start.

[Jairus]

I'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina per se.

Well, me too. But I'm pretty tired of the mass whining about something that should have been obvious from the start.

Seriously. She had BLOOD. On her HANDS. And she was SMILING. And Dan was afraid of becoming like her. I mean, I didn't even know about the wallpaper war when I was first reading DMFA, but seeing that bit basically told me that she was probably evil, or at the very least not a nice person.

[inuhanyo]

Interesting that she thinks of Dan as "that adventurer's son".

I'm wondering if this helps pin down the time when Edward disappeared and Destania went looking for him. At first, I had the impression (I think it was from the things Alexsi said way back when Dan's headwings first appeared) that it had all happened some time ago when Dan was much younger. The end of the Amazons/DP arc showed Destania at least was still at Lost Lake at the time Dan started out as an adventurer. Have we just been given another clue, or another red herring?

What am I talking about, this is Amber. It's probably both.   

Hmm, starting with Dan's cast page

A bit of Dan's past is shaded but it is known that Edward went missing and Destania left the inn to Alexsi as she went off to look for him. It was soon after that, that Dan first headed off for his starting adventures.

That must have happened very soon after Dan graduated from Adventurer's School and had his first encounter with DP.  It's possible that Edward was away and when his return became overdue is when Destinia left to go looking for him.  Then Dan linked up with an adventuring group and his career began.

He had to have been coming back to Lost Lake now and then, otherwise Alexsi couldn't have observed that he'd stopped needing to eat three years ago.  He's only been retired for a year.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

I'm gonna sit here in the middle of everything and laugh out loud, k? ;-]

i'll order the pizza.

I'll bring the beer.

[M]

That's the point I was trying to make (sorry I wasn't clear enough).  Because of their might makes right philosophy, demons don't take it personally, so it's natural for them to have a hard time understanding why Beings do.   The whinyness is Regina's immaturity, though.  Aliph just considered "taking it personal" as weak emotionality.  Of course that's a harder attitude to take when you are the one fleeing.

Ah, okay, I get you. I agree with you completely. I don't expect that demons understand the why behind the retaliation of beings. But it just seems that they should understand that beings do, because adventurers exist.

I dunno. I just find it kind of hard to believe that Regina could be completely oblivious to repercussions, like what her profile says. It kind of shows creatures are at least aware of them and at least expect something, be it a fine or something, like what Kria got once.

I guess that's what I mean by her immaturity. Along with her whininess.

[inuhanyo]

I dunno. I just find it kind of hard to believe that Regina could be completely oblivious to repercussions, like what her profile says. It kind of shows creatures are at least aware of them and at least expect something, be it a fine or something, like what Kria got once.

I guess that's what I mean by her immaturity. Along with her whininess.

Which brings us around to the reasons why Regina is working for her second aunt as a maid.

Inexperienced, naive, reckless.  Liable to get herself easily killed by some random adventurer.  A need to lie low while a "certain incident" cools off. 

Regina may be too ignorant to understand just how dangerous an enemy "that adventurer's son" is, but I bet that her parents have a much better grasp of the danger.  And she certainly doesn't need to be making any more enemies of Dan's caliber at her age.

[Mao]

Hmm.  I still like her quite a bit.  Maybe even more so now actually.  Odd I know, but that's just the way I am.