Wooo! Backstory!!!! ... ho boy.
You know what? I'm finding Regina less and less likable the more we learn about her. Offhand, I'd say Dan would be totally justified in killing Regina.
Also, I sense that this is Regina's Story in the space of three panels. Wee!
I hate to say it, but that's about all I want to KNOW of her backstory....
Seriously, she isn't really that interesting of a character so far--my only hope is that she either comes to have a better raison d'etre or else isn't seen that much....
Although the fact that she knows Edward is interesting....
I'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
I'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
May I join you?
You know, that one panel where we first met her? Offhand, I'd say that's the straw that broke Dan's back and really pissed him off. Telling him that they'd be perfect for each other after she's killed innocent beings and manipulated him and almost killed his friends? Yeah, that would push him over the edge. And then when he attacks her, she does that whole "destroy you and everything you love" thing. Such a lovely character.
Regina! Put your cast page outfit on and fight Dan already!
Quote from: Jairus on February 15, 2009, 01:27:32 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
I'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
May I join you?
I'll bring the popcorn so we can enjoy watching the Regina fans in comfort!
I predict that panel 971 ruined 64.8% of Regina based fanfics and that panel 942 ruined 58.1% of the remaining ones. I also predict that 86.4% of the ruined ones deal with some relationship between Dan and Regina.
On a more serious note, I wonder what would happen if Lorenda saw Dan and Regina fighting in the open. I know Regina and Lorenda don't get along, but I wonder how far that actually goes.
Black_Angel's vocal reaction!
"Bo - huh - ageh - beh - a-heh-de-beh- ...HUH?" :erk ... :dface No wonder Dan hates demons and cubi and "monsters"!
As I said once before, I don't think I'll end up liking Regina a lot. With her personality and this new knowledge combined, I may end up hating her. But she must be really fun to write for. My inner writer would kill for a character like that.
...Which was probably a poor choice of words given the comic. A-heh.
Quote from: Jairus on February 15, 2009, 01:16:18 AM
Wooo! Backstory!!!! ... ho boy.
You know what? I'm finding Regina less and less likable the more we learn about her. Offhand, I'd say Dan would be totally justified in killing Regina.
Also, I sense that this is Regina's Story in the space of three panels. Wee!
Well, Amber warned us what Regina was like.
Interesting that she thinks of Dan as "that adventurer's son". Does she even realize that Dan is Aliph's slayer? She's scared of him, but her fear seems purely based on her own previous encounter with Dan. Which seems to have gone badly enough.
Quote from: The1Kobra on February 15, 2009, 01:38:33 AM
I predict that panel 971 ruined 64.8% of Regina based fanfics and that panel 942 ruined 58.1% of the remaining ones. I also predict that 86.4% of the ruined ones deal with some relationship between Dan and Regina.
On a more serious note, I wonder what would happen if Lorenda saw Dan and Regina fighting in the open. I know Regina and Lorenda don't get along, but I wonder how far that actually goes.
Yeah, judgeing by the forum comments, there was a lot of shipping speculation going on.
I expect the writers are quite disappointed.
Lorenda stormed away, but was she planning on going back to Jyrrias' or is she just walking to cool off?
I suspect the actual sequence of events went something like this:
- Regina manages to convince Dan she's okay.
- Then kills a dozen people with Dan's unwitting help.
- Dan retaliates to stop her from killing anyone else (or something).
- Regina's vow of destruction may occur here or at any point onward, frankly.
- Regina tries to kill Dan & co.
- They escape however.
Well, isn't she just a ray of sunshine?
I think it's rather interesting just how blasé Regina thinks her actions were. She just seems more and more mentally immature with every strip. I can't wait to see what happens because of it.
Quote from: !KCA on February 15, 2009, 01:53:12 AM
I suspect the actual sequence of events went something like this:
- Regina manages to convince Dan she's okay.
- Then kills a dozen people with Dan's unwitting help.
- Dan retaliates to stop her from killing anyone else (or something).
- Regina's vow of destruction may occur here or at any point onward, frankly.
- Regina tries to kill Dan & co.
- They escape however.
If Dan & co escaped from her, then why is Regina
running from Dan now? She clearly fears Dan enough not to try and face him. So it's more likely Regina managed to escape Dan, than
vice versaQuote from: Marmonstein on February 15, 2009, 02:02:06 AM
Well, isn't she just a ray of sunshine?
I think it's rather interesting just how blasé Regina thinks her actions were. She just seems more and more mentally immature with every strip. I can't wait to see what happens because of it.
Well, the demon philosophy
is "might makes right". Hence the lack of vengeance seeking from a slain demon's relatives. The moral immaturity isn't just Regina's.
Running into these kind of Creatures is how Dan got his prejudice. Perfectly rational.
Her "that adventurer's son" comment indicates that she knows of Edward and his relationshiop to Dan, even if she can't be bothered to remember their names (at least one mere being). Has she realized yet that this is the "cubi representative", and likely an incubus himself? Or in her mind, is he just a prior being encounter that she lost to once already (whether alone or with others' help)? If the latter, how about her reaction when she realizes he's not just a being? If she's scared now, that should escalate it a bit, whether he feeds on it or not (Ink mentioned a negative for fear affinity).
Potential outcome, Regina hides behind Lorenda wanting protection from the "ten levels of angry" adventurer. Yeah, that's it, put cousin between you and danger.
Off topic, while Amber is doing an update of some kind to the whole site, it would be nice if there was an index in the archives pointing to all the reader letters and other non-story strips (Amber and fluffy). As it is, they're hiding among the regular story strips and hard to find (I'm looking for the "neko-kitty" one to show a friend).
----------------
Now playing on Winamp: Johann Sebastian Bach - Cello Suite No. 3 (Classical Minnesota Public Radio) (http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/johann+sebastian+bach/track/cello+suite+no.+3)
via FoxyTunes (http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/)
Has any one noticed how similar Kria and Regina sound in this page. :P
I would have to guess that demons belief that might makes right, makes it seem strange to them when other strong beings don't have the same view and come after them with pointy objects.
Only one thing to say: Exposition! (No need for a 200-page backstory on the one with the curved horns and bone wing.)
Aw... Can't find a miner-Amber image. (From that time where they just hit a whole new vein of awkward.)
By the way, of course she thinks of that adventurer's son, since back then Dan was just a kid, probably not attending Adventurer School yet. His dad on the other hand was probably still known as adventurer. Though I'm rather curious on if the rest of the 2 memory panels from 388 (http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_388.php) are related to the same incident.
PS: Mindset from demons:
QuoteDemonology 101: The Demon Race
...
Demons seem to go by a rule of power.
...
Because of this, most demons don't have a real notion of revenge or vengeance if one of their own kind is slain. After all, by their own belief system, if someone is able to defeat them, that other creature or being is obviously worthy.
Amber took the easy way out again with that backstory- I'm kind of glad though, not sure if I could stomach a sidestory or a lenghtly flashback with that pink harpy! Oh, crap- now Amber is sure to do it!
Quote from: Minishear on February 15, 2009, 01:31:26 AM
Regina! Put your cast page outfit on and fight Dan already!
Fanboy :)
Quote from: AmigaDragon on February 15, 2009, 03:16:51 AM
... Has she realized yet that this is the "cubi representative", and likely an incubus himself? Or in her mind, is he just a prior being encounter that she lost to once already (whether alone or with others' help)? If the latter, how about her reaction when she realizes he's not just a being? If she's scared now, that should escalate it a bit, whether he feeds on it or not (Ink mentioned a negative for fear affinity).
I'm thinking Regina doesn't even realize that "that adventurer's son" is "the fellow who has been killing Aliph". Let alone associated him with the "cubi representative". Petty and ignorant. But her prior encounter with Dan taught her enough that she's the one fleeing. The more she learns about Dan, the more reason she'll have to be scared of him.
While cubi have an affinity for a particular emotion, it appears that they can use other emotions as well, just not as effectively. Abel, for instance, despite having an affinity for misery, prefers confusion. Dan has his clan's affinity for pain, but fighting the good fight is his optimum situation.
Quote from: Michael Chandra on February 15, 2009, 03:33:15 AM
By the way, of course she thinks of that adventurer's son, since back then Dan was just a kid, probably not attending Adventurer School yet. His dad on the other hand was probably still known as adventurer. Though I'm rather curious on if the rest of the 2 memory panels from 388 (http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_388.php) are related to the same incident.
Dan (25) is two years older than Regina (23), that image of her on page 388 can't have been
that long ago. And Dan's first encounter with DP was two days after he graduated from adventurer's school.
Since Wildy was involved, yet didn't belive Dan's "war stories", it would have had to occur while Dan was home, either after he retired or while he was "on vacation".
Regina is Lucky to have Kira as an aunt AND Lorenda as a cousin or else Regina's blood might be spilled in the next few minutes.
Kira may be eccentric in her approach to wooing a guy and her direct approach cough Dan off guard ...but that was bound to happen.
At the end of this I think Regina is going to owe Kira and Lorenda her life. Dan may be a young cubi but he is a skilled and retired adventurer.
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 02:18:35 AM
If Dan & co escaped from her, then why is Regina running from Dan now? She clearly fears Dan enough not to try and face him. So it's more likely Regina managed to escape Dan, than vice versa
You can't escape your enemy by beating them to a bloody pulp?
No. That's when you walk away. :P
Well, unless you're in a panic, that is.
Quote from: AmigaDragon on February 15, 2009, 03:16:51 AM
Off topic, while Amber is doing an update of some kind to the whole site, it would be nice if there was an index in the archives pointing to all the reader letters and other non-story strips (Amber and fluffy). As it is, they're hiding among the regular story strips and hard to find (I'm looking for the "neko-kitty" one to show a friend).
I'll add that to the list of things we might or might not add.
In the mean time, I think you're looking for strip 619.
Slamming someone's face with a tray without any warning is.. unforgivable. >:[
But I have to admit, so far her backstory does not seem to be particularly impressive - I mean, things like that must be somewhat common on Furrae.
Quote from: AmigaDragon on February 15, 2009, 03:16:51 AM
Off topic, while Amber is doing an update of some kind to the whole site, it would be nice if there was an index in the archives pointing to all the reader letters and other non-story strips (Amber and fluffy).
http://dmfa.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_%22Questions_from_the_Readers%22_and_other_informational_comics
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
I'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
Last Anthrocon, Amber was heard to say something like "Why are people so obsessed with Regina? She's just a psychopath." So I'm tempted to join you in that.
May I just compliment Amber of the recent backgrounds, they have been amazing and have completed the scenes perfectly! :mowwink
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
I'm gonna sit here in the middle of everything and laugh out loud, k? ;-]
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 07:16:14 AM
Last Anthrocon, Amber was heard to say something like "Why are people so obsessed with Regina? She's just a psychopath." So I'm tempted to join you in that.
True, but she is also a new (ish) character and an
interesting psychopath.
This is more than enough to get her many fans, serious, If you look back far enough there are probably entire topics devoted to characters with one panel appearances and/or shallow personalities.
That and she is a way to further explore the backgrounds of other, more established characters.
But ultimately there are many fanboys and girls out there.
Simple explanation for the fear Regina feels:
DAN IS A KEANU REEVES!! (cookie4ref)
Also. WE. WANT. ANGRY DAN! WE. WANT. ANGRY DAN!!
All I can say is I'm glad this wasn't a Friday (well, Monday now) update. If we had had to wait two whole days to find out what's going to happen next, I would
not be able to concentrate on my work.
Quote from: Tyranastrasz on February 15, 2009, 01:37:12 AM
Quote from: Jairus on February 15, 2009, 01:27:32 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
I'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
May I join you?
I'll bring the popcorn so we can enjoy watching the Regina fans in comfort!
Is there room for me over there? I have soda...
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on February 15, 2009, 07:29:52 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AM
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
I'm gonna sit here in the middle of everything and laugh out loud, k? ;-]
i'll order the pizza.
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 01:24:51 AMI'm sure her fans will cry that she deserves a better story extrapolation than that, with all their expectative buildup of such a 'beautiful' character.
Now I'm going to go off into a corner and quietly laugh.
I don't think a whole lot are dissapointed. How many people are fans of Darth Vader compared to how many people are fans of Luke Skywalker?
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 01:52:45 AM
Interesting that she thinks of Dan as "that adventurer's son".
I'm wondering if this helps pin down the time when Edward disappeared and Destania went looking for him. At first, I had the impression (I think it was from the things Alexsi said way back when Dan's headwings first appeared) that it had all happened some time ago when Dan was much younger. The end of the Amazons/DP arc showed Destania at least was still at Lost Lake at the time Dan started out as an adventurer. Have we just been given another clue, or another red herring?
What am I talking about, this is Amber. It's probably both. ;)
Actually, I'm wondering if the discussion of the legal system on Furrae (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_287.php) could have been a reference to Regina's little escapade. After all, we are discussing a dozen beings being killed and it would have been reasonable for a family member (Kria) to pay the fines (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_972.php).
The speculation seems to be that while she tried to kill Dan's friends she didn't succeed. This is based on the line that she almost killed Wildy. Now since Wildy isn't the be all and end all of Dan's freinds how do we know that Regina didn't succeed in part. Shoe could have killed any number of freinds that we don't know of simply because... they are dead. Wildy maybe alive now simply because while dan was to late for the others he barely made it there for her.
Regina seems to give off a fatal attraction sort of vibe to me. I get the feeling she may have been crushing on Dan at one point and wanted him all for her own. she killed people she thought might come between them. starting with perhapse peole she thought might be giving him the eye, then moving on to his freinds so she didn't have to share his attentions.
Quote from: thegayhare on February 15, 2009, 09:09:29 AM
She could have killed any number of friends that we don't know of simply because... they are dead.
Excellent point. It's likely the story would be spun more in that direction if we'd had Regina's Story instead of Abel's Story.
QuoteRegina seems to give off a fatal attraction sort of vibe to me. I get the feeling she may have been crushing on Dan at one point and wanted him all for her own. she killed people she thought might come between them.
Or, she was trying to show how strong she was, thinking that he'd fall for her, demon-style.
Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk. He certainly is a lot better behaved than Regina, but if, assuming for a moment, that his backstory was entirely erased from view, I wonder what fans would think of him. They wouldn't know that he had a lot of traumatic experiences that led him to have the personality he has in present day DMFA.
I wonder if Regina had some similar ordeals that made her what she is. Of course, her behavior is a good deal more 'out of control' than Abel's, but still, it's possible that she wasn't simply born with her personality. It is mentioned that she didn't get along with her parents, maybe adventurers killed most of her immediate friends and she has a grudge against beings and wants to kill every one she can find? I'm not saying that's the case... but it is worthwhile to consider all reasonable possibilities.
I'm wondering if reception to her would be different if Regina's story was written instead of Abel's story.
I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.
In other news, I hope Dan catches up to her.
*de-lurkus*
I said it once before, but I don't remember if it was in person or on paper...so I may as well step up and say it now. When it came to backstory war...I once mentioned there was going to be dissapointment for some people regardless of which side won. Abel's because there was not going to be a mention of the library incident, and Regina's because it wasn't really a backstory for her...but a backstory for Dan where Regina played a major focus. People who were bidding expecting to get Regina's life and her perspective were going to be incredibly sore since everything was pretty much told from Dan's point of view. It was set up to be more Dan's backstory and as this comic likely hinted at, was more going to focus on a key event rather than a life-story.
Which ugh...is why I always joke about how Regina's story would have been long since done rather than Abel's Story which is taking narfing forever. :cry
I have also made it one of those things that when I do DMFA, I try to keep the side stories out of mind in the regard that I write DMFA as if no one actually reads Abel's Story and any of the mini-arcs. So you can likely expect a similar gloss-over to Abel's backstory at some point. It puts Devin in a bit of a fun spot since while people who read Abel's Story has a good idea of who he was...as far as DMFA's main canon is concerned, he is still just an Undead that works for Kria.
I will say this much, and likely nothing more. The update delay between her very first appearance and now was bad pacing on my part. And I apologize if the delay caused her to be a bit overhyped. I have little doubt Regina is going to dissapoint a few people. But at the same time, I also hope many peeps realize she is a new character and the current story has sort of caught her at one of her more unpleasant times. And much like Dark Pegasus...sometimes it takes a bit of time before a character gets their stride. I admit my biggest worry, as well as probably the worry of any creative worker person, is that when making a character who has some very unlikable traits...I worry that a character is unlikable not because that is how they were meant to be...but unlikable because I am a bad writer.
Quote from: The1Kobra on February 15, 2009, 09:27:09 AM
Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk.
That's an interesting point, but I'm not quite convinced. He was displaying a certain, subdued affection for Dan back before AS kicked off - for example, his reaction when Ink got at Dan. I wrote a detailed analysis of at back at the time which I can dig up if you're interested, but my conclusion was that nearly everything Abel did for Dan was done for his benefit, even if the results didn't quite pan out the way he'd intended.
QuoteHe certainly is a lot better behaved than Regina, but if, assuming for a moment, that his backstory was entirely erased from view, I wonder what fans would think of him. They wouldn't know that he had a lot of traumatic experiences that led him to have the personality he has in present day DMFA.
This I beg to differ on. The scenes in the shopping arc, where Abel sees the paint, and every scene where Abel is asked about his parents. I believe AS was running at the time of the paint incident, but that was so far before things hit the fan that we could only guess what it meant. My assumption then was that his family had been massacred. Now, it's more likely a flashback to Hennya.
Then there's the business about Abel refusing to shapeshift, sleeping and eating habitually, even at the Academy where he's not trying to maintain a disguise. Again, AS was running but not at the critical point yet. Even so, it suggested to me that he'd had a rough time of it.
Quote from: Pagan on February 15, 2009, 09:40:47 AM
I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.
...it was less about 'ending' the fandom and more that there used to be huge flailings that Regina should have won so she got her story instead of Abel. So of course, with Regina's backstory in condensed form, there might be some flailing. S'why we're all over here in the snack corner being disappointed at the lack of it. ;)
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: The1Kobra on February 15, 2009, 09:27:09 AM
Actually, now that I think about it, I wonder if Regina won the wallpaper war instead of Abel, if people would think that Abel was nothing more than an unruly, hardened jerk.
That's an interesting point, but I'm not quite convinced. He was displaying a certain, subdued affection for Dan back before AS kicked off - for example, his reaction when Ink got at Dan. I wrote a detailed analysis of at back at the time which I can dig up if you're interested, but my conclusion was that nearly everything Abel did for Dan was done for his benefit, even if the results didn't quite pan out the way he'd intended.
Strangely, the first thing to come to mind was not the button-pressing quote from Ink, but Abel staring at the "bishounen" test and flailing about how he'd just -made- that outfit for Dan. :P
(As for Amber delurkingu - never panic! We trust in yoooou~)
I'm just glad to have some frigging insight as to this whole Regina/Dan conflict. Last few updates, it felt like everyone knew but me.
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 10:11:31 AM
Strangely, the first thing to come to mind was not the button-pressing quote from Ink, but Abel staring at the "bishounen" test and flailing about how he'd just -made- that outfit for Dan. :P
That would be affection for the outfit, though...
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 09:22:24 AM
Or, she was trying to show how strong she was, thinking that he'd fall for her, demon-style.
Also a likely possibility...
Though I will admit I may be allowing my own situation to taint my veiws of regina here.
she could have simply befreinded Dan and used him to kill alot of people because playing a famous adventures son for a patsey like that would be a real boost to her status as a younger demon
Quote from: The1Kobra on February 15, 2009, 09:27:09 AM
I wonder if Regina had some similar ordeals that made her what she is. Of course, her behavior is a good deal more 'out of control' than Abel's, but still, it's possible that she wasn't simply born with her personality. It is mentioned that she didn't get along with her parents, maybe adventurers killed most of her immediate friends and she has a grudge against beings and wants to kill every one she can find? I'm not saying that's the case... but it is worthwhile to consider all reasonable possibilities.
I'm wondering if reception to her would be different if Regina's story was written instead of Abel's story.
For a demon of her age, Regina's behavior
is perfectly normal. Scary thought, isn't it?
Kria is kind and compassionate, for a demon. And she eats tour guides. Her mental list of "how can I cheer Lorendra up" was mostly "lets go kill things". Reread Kria's explanation of her worldview (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_343.php) to Jyrras. Demons are not nice people (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AlwaysChaoticEvil).
Quote from: rabid_fox on February 15, 2009, 10:16:02 AM
I'm just glad to have some frigging insight as to this whole Regina/Dan conflict. Last few updates, it felt like everyone knew but me.
When Regina showed up in this arc, Amber updated her cast page (http://www.missmab.com/Cast/regina.php). That's where I was getting my information. Plus a lot of connecting the dots, which involved a certain amount of interpretation and supposition. I don't know yet how much of it I got right. I think I can say now, that I nailed that Dan does
not think well of Regina, and would find any gushing by her towards him to be revolting. Of course, I got
that from the panel (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_388.php) where she first appeared.
It's easier now to understand the strength of Dan's reaction (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_307.php) to becoming a cubi (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_392.php).
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 10:51:26 AM
For a demon of her age, Regina's behavior is perfectly normal. Scary thought, isn't it?
Kria is kind and compassionate, for a demon. And she eats tour guides. Her mental list of "how can I cheer Lorendra up" was mostly "lets go kill things". Reread Kria's explanation of her worldview (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_343.php) to Jyrras. Demons are not nice people (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AlwaysChaoticEvil).
From what Amber was saying not too long ago about 'Cubi being treated with suspicion and contempt by Demons, Regina's actions are curious. What she (Amber) said was that 'Cubi are considered weak because they rely on subterfuge most of the time. That makes Regina's line about 'using his trust to kill a dozen Beings' rather strange.
:mowsad it's too bad Amber decided to make Reggie an unlikable villain. I really can't feel sorry for her, I don't sympathize with her, and other than the fact she's cute...for a demon, I see noting but distance preventing Dan tearing her limb from limb. My only sympathies are for her wasted potential as a character. All that smoke, and no fire.
*grabs popcorn* oh well maybe I'll see some cool pyrotechnics after the slaying.
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 02:18:35 AM
Well, the demon philosophy is "might makes right". Hence the lack of vengeance seeking from a slain demon's relatives. The moral immaturity isn't just Regina's.
Running into these kind of Creatures is how Dan got his prejudice. Perfectly rational.
You're absolutely right. I totally forgot about that.
But it's not about murder that I find her immature about. It's just that the line, "This is like...totally unfair", kind of got to me, like she doesn't think Dan
should be reacting to anything at all (even after she lists off all the reasons in her head!).
Also there's her whole spoiled personality (like with Lorenda and her "harem dream"), but that''s a different topic.
Quote from: Madmann135 on February 15, 2009, 04:04:45 AM
Regina is Lucky to have Kira as an aunt AND Lorenda as a cousin or else Regina's blood might be spilled in the next few minutes.
Kira may be eccentric in her approach to wooing a guy and her direct approach cough Dan off guard ...but that was bound to happen.
At the end of this I think Regina is going to owe Kira and Lorenda her life. Dan may be a young cubi but he is a skilled and retired adventurer.
Kira=The guy from Death Note.
Kria=The mass-murdering demon-mare from DMFA
There's a
difference, people!
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on February 15, 2009, 10:11:31 AM
Quote from: Pagan on February 15, 2009, 09:40:47 AM
I don't see why everyone assumes this will end the Regina fandom. I thought the reason for liking Regina was because she was a psychopath. Sure, she's a bit more petty than I had hoped, but she's still evil and crazy. And that's good enough for me.
...it was less about 'ending' the fandom and more that there used to be huge flailings that Regina should have won so she got her story instead of Abel. So of course, with Regina's backstory in condensed form, there might be some flailing. S'why we're all over here in the snack corner being disappointed at the lack of it. ;)
It's turned out considerably less interesting than I thought... :cry
Quote from: GabrielsThoughts on February 15, 2009, 11:13:35 AM
:mowsad it's too bad Amber decided to make Reggie an unlikable villain. I really can't feel sorry for her, I don't sympathize with her, and other than the fact she's cute...for a demon, I see noting but distance preventing Dan tearing her limb from limb. My only sympathies are for her wasted potential as a character. All that smoke, and no fire.
I think the general disappointment stems from the fact that most fans of Regina over-hyped her possible back story and her personality.
And I think she's far from wasted potential. I find her personality pretty intriguing in that she's not only a young and inexperienced demon, but she's also like a spoiled child. She's like the complete opposite of what we've seen from pretty much the only (known) villian, Dark Pegasus. And we've only just met her. She has room to grow.
And like it was pointed out to me, it's important to keep in mind that she is, for all we know, a typical demon, and that she's going to have the typical values. She is going to be unlikable to us, because most of us don't agree with her brand of reasoning.
CUE THE BUTTHURT CROWD.
I like Regina. Psychopaths are awesome characters; they tend to be more interesting than some heroes. (Although I admit, I'm going more for the "BWARGH Regina's an awesome character but an awful person" love-hate angle than a "STFU SHE'S JUST MISUNDERSTOOD" perspective. Because the latter is just retarded.)
I'm glad for the extrapolation. This makes me more fascinated with her. I pretty much thought she was going to be a ***** to begin with, so I'm not exactly disappointed by the revelation that she really tried to screw up Dan's life.
I mean seriously. After her first appearance, who could think she was going to be a nice character? The idea everyone's so disappointed and whining about her being unlikeable just has me in stitches.
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 10:57:59 AM
From what Amber was saying not too long ago about 'Cubi being treated with suspicion and contempt by Demons, Regina's actions are curious. What she (Amber) said was that 'Cubi are considered weak because they rely on subterfuge most of the time. That makes Regina's line about 'using his trust to kill a dozen Beings' rather strange.
Maybe Regina's use of subterfuge in this case is what got her in bad with her parents. As a young demon (hence less powerfull), she'd have more excuse for resorting to such "weakling" tactics, but even so...
Quote from: Marmonstein on February 15, 2009, 11:18:47 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 02:18:35 AM
Well, the demon philosophy is "might makes right". Hence the lack of vengeance seeking from a slain demon's relatives. The moral immaturity isn't just Regina's.
Running into these kind of Creatures is how Dan got his prejudice. Perfectly rational.
You're absolutely right. I totally forgot about that.
But it's not about murder that I find her immature about. It's just that the line, "This is like...totally unfair", kind of got to me, like she doesn't think Dan should be reacting to anything at all (even after she lists off all the reasons in her head!).
That's the point I was trying to make (sorry I wasn't clear enough).
Because of their might makes right philosophy, demons
don't take it personally, so it's natural for them to have a hard time understanding why Beings
do. The whinyness
is Regina's immaturity, though. Aliph just considered "taking it personal" as weak emotionality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_925.php). Of course that's a harder attitude to take when you are the one fleeing.
Oh, don't get me wrong. Regina has an interesting character... from the perspective of getting a viewpoint into the mind of your average demon and that of a nigh-psychopathic character. She is not sympathetic, but I'm going to enjoy watching what happens next.
A lot of people don't seem to like Regina....but she reminds me a lot of Kria, and people seemed to like the petty pshycopath Kria. I don't know, maybe I'm missing somethihng.
Quote from: Lucheek on February 15, 2009, 12:00:19 PM
A lot of people don't seem to like Regina....but she reminds me a lot of Kria, and people seemed to like the petty pshycopath Kria. I don't know, maybe I'm missing somethihng.
Feelings ran a little high over the wallpaper war. A number of people were put out because she lost. That's fair enough, but since then she has been hyped up to a standard that she could never possibly live up to. I'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina
per se.
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 12:13:59 PMI'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina per se.
Well, me too. :3 But I'm pretty tired of the mass whining about something that should have been obvious from the start.
Quote from: Keaton the Black Jackal on February 15, 2009, 12:16:20 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 12:13:59 PMI'll admit I get a guilty pleasure from watching the bubble burst, (though to be fair I did try to deflate it earlier on), but it's nothing to do with Regina per se.
Well, me too. :3 But I'm pretty tired of the mass whining about something that should have been obvious from the start.
Seriously. She had BLOOD. On her HANDS. And she was SMILING. And Dan was afraid of becoming like her. I mean, I didn't even know about the wallpaper war when I was first reading DMFA, but seeing that bit basically told me that she was probably evil, or at the very least not a nice person.
Quote from: SpottedKitty on February 15, 2009, 08:55:23 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 01:52:45 AM
Interesting that she thinks of Dan as "that adventurer's son".
I'm wondering if this helps pin down the time when Edward disappeared and Destania went looking for him. At first, I had the impression (I think it was from the things Alexsi said way back when Dan's headwings first appeared) that it had all happened some time ago when Dan was much younger. The end of the Amazons/DP arc showed Destania at least was still at Lost Lake at the time Dan started out as an adventurer. Have we just been given another clue, or another red herring?
What am I talking about, this is Amber. It's probably both. ;)
Hmm, starting with Dan's cast page (http://www.missmab.com/Cast/dan.php)
QuoteA bit of Dan's past is shaded but it is known that Edward went missing and Destania left the inn to Alexsi as she went off to look for him. It was soon after that, that Dan first headed off for his starting adventures.
That must have happened very soon after Dan graduated from Adventurer's School and had his first encounter with DP. It's possible that Edward was away and when his return became overdue is when Destinia left to go looking for him. Then Dan linked up with an adventuring group and his career began.
He had to have been coming back to Lost Lake now and then, otherwise Alexsi couldn't have observed (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_305.php) that he'd stopped needing to eat three years ago. He's only been retired for a year.
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 11:49:44 AM
That's the point I was trying to make (sorry I wasn't clear enough). Because of their might makes right philosophy, demons don't take it personally, so it's natural for them to have a hard time understanding why Beings do. The whinyness is Regina's immaturity, though. Aliph just considered "taking it personal" as weak emotionality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_925.php). Of course that's a harder attitude to take when you are the one fleeing.
Ah, okay, I get you. I agree with you completely. I don't expect that demons understand the why behind the retaliation of beings. But it just seems that they should understand that beings do, because adventurers exist.
I dunno. I just find it kind of hard to believe that Regina could be completely oblivious to repercussions, like what her profile (http://missmab.com/Cast/regina.php) says. It kind of shows creatures are at least aware of them and at least expect something, be it a fine or something, like what Kria got once.
I guess that's what I mean by her immaturity. Along with her whininess. :U
Quote from: Marmonstein on February 15, 2009, 12:49:11 PM
I dunno. I just find it kind of hard to believe that Regina could be completely oblivious to repercussions, like what her profile (http://missmab.com/Cast/regina.php) says. It kind of shows creatures are at least aware of them and at least expect something, be it a fine or something, like what Kria got once.
I guess that's what I mean by her immaturity. Along with her whininess. :U
Which brings us around to the reasons why Regina is working for her second aunt as a maid.
Inexperienced, naive, reckless. Liable to get herself easily killed by some random adventurer. A need to lie low while a "certain incident" cools off.
Regina may be too ignorant to understand just how dangerous an enemy "that adventurer's son" is, but I bet that her parents have a much better grasp of the danger. And she certainly doesn't need to be making any more enemies of Dan's caliber at her age.
Hmm. I still like her quite a bit. Maybe even more so now actually. Odd I know, but that's just the way I am.
I'm curious as to what makes Kria different than Regina. I like Kria a bit because she, at least, sometimes attempts to be a decent mother. (Lorenda's wings growing in, for instance) Perhaps it was the raising a child? (shrugs)
I have no sympathy for Regina. Average for her age or not, I can't agree or condone that kind of moral system. I don't really want to see Dan kill her, though.
*flails his arms a bit to keep the crowd entertained* :P
From what we've seen so far, I'd say Regina is a rebellious 'teenage'-demon. :rolleyes
And it all makes her more amusing to watch, I've been intrigued ever since the total bloody hand things. So turns out she's a bit of a brat with typical demon ethics just pumped up way above her level, nothing wrong with that. It's just whether she came keep Dan from tearing her a new one, PG comic or not, now THATS something to watch for...
Not taking it personally does not mean not retaliating. Look at Wildy's comments to Biggs about stealing from Lost Lake. (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_090.php) Essentially, she stated that Biggs stealing Alexsi's hammer from Lost Lake was an action that required retaliation. In the same way mortal insults are expected to be responded to by duels. The fact that police and the courts try to punish people for breaking the law doesn't mean that the police are taking it personally, just that they are doing what needs to be done (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_936.php).
Kria may have stated that Demons don't need to avenge the death of other Demons. However, that doesn't mean that she expects others to forego vengeance. The big difference between Kria and Regina is that Kria accepts that her actions have consequences, while Regina feels that it is unfair that there are consequences.
If Kria feels that Lorenda is threatened, Kria will take action (not necessarily the correct action). (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_769.php)
I'm going to think about this a little and do some editing when I figure out what I'm talking about.
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 10:04:31 AM
This I beg to differ on. The scenes in the shopping arc, where Abel sees the paint, and every scene where Abel is asked about his parents. I believe AS was running at the time of the paint incident, but that was so far before things hit the fan that we could only guess what it meant. My assumption then was that his family had been massacred. Now, it's more likely a flashback to Hennya.
But Abel had his hemophobia before he even got home from the funeral, remember? Devin was making fun of him about it--he even said that it had been going on since they were kids. That would likely have been before Abel even met Hennya.
Quote from: Amber Williams on February 15, 2009, 09:57:38 AM
I admit my biggest worry, as well as probably the worry of any creative worker person, is that when making a character who has some very unlikable traits...I worry that a character is unlikable not because that is how they were meant to be...but unlikable because I am a bad writer.
I'm only sorry that you have such a worry, Amber, because you've proven time and again that you are NOT a bad writer. I likely haven't seen enough of Regina yet to judge her accurately--I might well change my mind. It's just that so far I haven't found her to be all that interesting--that may just be because, as you said, she's being introduced now and interrupting the main storyline of this chapter. But there's still time.
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 04:54:41 PM
But Abel had his hemophobia before he even got home from the funeral, remember? Devin was making fun of him about it--he even said that it had been going on since they were kids. That would likely have been before Abel even met Hennya.
I know that, he even blames it on haemophobia in the strip itself, but I think he's using it as a cover for what really bugged him. After 375 years with what are probably some of the best psychologists in the world (thought and emotion readers, yeah?), I'd be astonished if he hadn't got the phobia under some degree of control by that point. Yes, he likely still has it, but I think his reaction is more severe than the blood/paint alone would account for. Though reading AS 44(46) again, it's difficult to say.
Quote from: Tapewolf on February 15, 2009, 05:03:41 PM
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 04:54:41 PM
But Abel had his hemophobia before he even got home from the funeral, remember? Devin was making fun of him about it--he even said that it had been going on since they were kids. That would likely have been before Abel even met Hennya.
I know that, he even blames it on haemophobia in the strip itself, but I think he's using it as a cover for what really bugged him. After 375 years with what are probably some of the best psychologists in the world (thought and emotion readers, yeah?), I'd be astonished if he hadn't got the phobia under some degree of control by that point. Yes, he likely still has it, but I think his reaction is more severe than the blood/paint alone would account for. Though reading AS 44(46) again, it's difficult to say.
Ah, yes--that hadn't occurred to me.
However, he obviously doesn't have it completely under control, just as he hasn't gotten over his need to be an "honest jerk", especially when he's called out on being nice.
But yeah, you may have a point there....
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 05:14:39 PM
... just as he hasn't gotten over his need to be an "honest jerk", especially when he's called out on being nice.
Abel didn't start out as a jerk, just the opposite in fact. Perhaps he's cultivated it as a defense mechanism after what Aniz put him through, so Aniz can never threaten anyone he cares for ever again. By not having anyone close to him again.
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 06:05:44 PM
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 05:14:39 PM
... just as he hasn't gotten over his need to be an "honest jerk", especially when he's called out on being nice.
Abel didn't start out as a jerk, just the opposite in fact. Perhaps he's cultivated it as a defense mechanism after what Aniz put him through, so Aniz can never threaten anyone he cares for ever again. By not having anyone close to him again.
I'm aware of that. My point is that his jerky quality seems like the kind of thing you'd expect psychologists to try to treat, or better yet, prevent--especially since he
didn't start out that way. Thus even after 300 years at SAIA, it appears there's only so much said psychologists could do, so they must not have been all that effective.
That shirt does not fit Regina. She should wear her bio outfit. It looks better.
Mm, I'm still not quite ready to judge. I admit I'm overly sympathetic and a total softy, and Regina hit a sore spot in comic 964. I went through that phase (not the 'killing townspeople' phase, the 'how come insertfamilymemberhere get's more love than I do?' phase). Of course, that happened when I was half her age... meh.
Occasionally I can see actions in black and white, but people (and thus characters) are merely shades of gray. I'm a moral optimist; that is to say, someone who often notes the good in people more than the bad. Whiiiiiich seems to make me come off as annoying at times. :U
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 08:00:22 PM
Quote from: inuhanyo on February 15, 2009, 06:05:44 PM
Quote from: Baal Hadad on February 15, 2009, 05:14:39 PM
... just as he hasn't gotten over his need to be an "honest jerk", especially when he's called out on being nice.
Abel didn't start out as a jerk, just the opposite in fact. Perhaps he's cultivated it as a defense mechanism after what Aniz put him through, so Aniz can never threaten anyone he cares for ever again. By not having anyone close to him again.
I'm aware of that. My point is that his jerky quality seems like the kind of thing you'd expect psychologists to try to treat, or better yet, prevent--especially since he didn't start out that way. Thus even after 300 years at SAIA, it appears there's only so much said psychologists could do, so they must not have been all that effective.
No psychologist can treat something that the patient doesn't want treated. If Abel is being a jerk to protect himself from Aniz, then the only hope for a "cure" has to start with dealing with Aniz. Permanently.
Quote from: Minishear on February 15, 2009, 08:18:03 PM
That shirt does not fit Regina. She should wear her bio outfit. It looks better.
We heard you the first time you said that. On the first page of this topic. Stop complaining.
Personally, I like her t-shirt. It fits her juvenile personality, and Regina can't dress like a dominatrix every day of the week.
Quote from: Keaton the Black Jackal on February 16, 2009, 03:34:06 PM
...and Regina can't dress like a dominatrix every day of the week.
:C
Spoil sport.
Quote from: Keaton the Black Jackal on February 16, 2009, 03:34:06 PM
Quote from: Minishear on February 15, 2009, 08:18:03 PM
That shirt does not fit Regina. She should wear her bio outfit. It looks better.
We heard you the first time you said that. On the first page of this topic. Stop complaining.
I thought it was maybe 2-3 different people saying that throughout the thread, though I wasn't particularly paying attention to who it was.
QuotePersonally, I like her t-shirt. It fits her juvenile personality, and Regina can't dress like a dominatrix every day of the week.
Why not? :mowwink Well, I suppose one reason might be comfort. The jeans and t-shirt look more comfortable, depending on what actually makes up that darker outfit (chain mail or fish net, armored or cloth bra and skirt pieces).