McCain suspends campaign (walls of text ITT)

[Angel]

AKA: Angel needs help with her homework. 

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/24/campaign.wrap/?iref=hpmostpop#cnnSTCVideo

John McCain has announced that he is suspending his campaign tomorrow, and that he has asked Barack Obama to do the same. He wants both parties to meet with the president and discuss the financial crisis in America.

I'm pretty surprised. Part of me thinks this is a very extreme response to the criticism he's received about claiming that "the fundamentals of the economy are strong," but still. This is better than denying that there's a problem. Now if only I could learn to trust Sarah Palin... I just don't know enough about her, and the idea of someone with less experience than Hillary Clinton having a shot at the presidency if McCain is elected and dies bothers me.

But I digress. Thoughts, opinions, statements, anything?

[Zedd]

Well that's kinda ballsy of him to do that...When it's only a few days away too!

[superluser]

Meh.  McCain's down in the polls and expects to get schooled on the economy in the debates, so he wants to call everything off.

Obama might go back to Washington, but there's really not much that he can do there that he can't do on the road, and he's sticking to the debates.

On a tenuously-related topic, it turns out that Nader's a `suiter.

[Sunblink]

That is a bit of a weird thing to do. And like Zedd said, slightly ballsy - but a recent poll said that most Americans trust Obama to repair the economy, so I guess McCain is regrouping.

I guess as far as opinions go... I feel like McCain being elected into office will only entail more of the disasters that George Bush created. As for Sarah Palin, she's very shady and I feel her nomination as the VP candidate was only a ploy by McCain to make the Republican party seem more malleable to change. McCain once claimed that the Republican party is dedicated to change, but I think that's a rather foolish thing to say, considering it's been traditional and conservative in its viewpoints.

That's my opinion in a nutshell. I'm painfully liberal.

[bill]

McCain Pulls Fire Alarm To Avoid Midterm (developing...)

[Jairus]

McCain Pulls Fire Alarm To Avoid Midterm (developing...)

Does this mean he gets suspended/expelled?

[Darkmoon]

There was a time, a while back, when I contemplated voting for McCain.

But that was back before this election cycle. Since then, he's gone from "maverick republican" to "flip-flopper". It's not that I think he really believe half the shit he says. It's that even after he gets elected this time (which I hope doesn't happen), he has to pander to the base, which means four years of conservative agenda just to ensure his next election.4 1/2 years from now we might see the real McCain again (if he wins this time), but that's too long a wait.

As for Palin, she's a conservative through and through. As I'm on the absolute opposite side of the spectrum, she's just another reason from me not to vote McCain.

[superluser]

There was a time, a while back, when I contemplated voting for McCain.

But that was back before this election cycle. Since then, he's gone from "maverick republican" to "flip-flopper". It's not that I think he really believe half the shit he says. It's that even after he gets elected this time (which I hope doesn't happen), he has to pander to the base, which means four years of conservative agenda just to ensure his next election.

If you haven't seen it:

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/09/07/daily-show-john-mccain-reformed-maverick/

As for Palin, she's a conservative through and through. As I'm on the absolute opposite side of the spectrum, she's just another reason from me not to vote McCain.

I'm on the same side as her on many issues (such as abortion), but she's so far out there on others (such as creationism, rape kits, holy war) that there's no way I could ever vote for her, even if McCain keeps her on a leash.

[Cvstos]

The "fire alarm" thing is a great analogy. If you really want to see some fireworks, the most recent Dave Letterman was very telling. He CANCELLED with Letterman at the last minute, saying he had to rush back to Washington to save the country.

Dave Letterman, during the taping of his show, showed the audience John McCain prepping for an interview with Katie Couric in a different CBS studio. John McCain lied to David Letterman.

That takes some guts, I'll give him that. But over the next few days Dave is going to smack John down so bad the polls from three weeks ago will even go down.

This is purely a political ploy, as anyone who has seen Dave tonight will know for sure. This is (well, I'm hoping is) going to backfire, especially considering that the Senate is reaching a deal as we speak. If it is at all significantly better than the deal the Treasury wanted Obama will come out ahead for managing the crisis calmly and while campaigning.

Also, a new poll shows people think Obama should keep campaigning and the debates should not change, or the topic of the first debate should be changed to an economic one.

-Edit. Fixed typo, reworded something to be more accurate.

[superluser]

The "fire alarm" thing is a great analogy. If you really want to see some fireworks, the most recent Dave Letterman was very telling. He CANCELLED with Letterman at the last minute, saying he had to rush back to Washington to save the country.

Dave Letterman, during the taping of his show, showed the audience John McCain prepping for an interview with Katie Couric in a different CBS studio. John McCain lied to David Letterman.

I don't believe you.

I'd need to see the video to believe something like that.

http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=XjkCrfylq-E

Well, OK.  Now, I believe you.

Also, it appears that Palin needs to go back to Washington to vote on the bill, too. 

[Cvstos]

OK, John McCain is actually a good debater. (It can be hard to debate someone that doesn't need to stick to the truth, but even without that he's good.) He won the GOP debates.  They're trying to lower his expectations, as always, but the truth is John McCain is a better debater than Obama. So that's what I'm worried about.

But Palin versus Biden?

Biden may not have her charisma, but he's way smarter and has been huge in foreign policy for forever now. (Chair of Senate Foreign Relations Committee.) I really want to see them square off on foreign policy.

And that's why they're DESPERATELY trying to get the VP debate cancelled (or moved and then cancelled). That's what this whole thing may be about, I think. Just a guess on my part.


Edit

By the way, it looks like the McCain campaign is still functioning at many levels despite being "suspended". The Colorado Independent has the story of how a McCain staffer accidentally emailed new McCain talking points to the wrong email list. It wound up in the hands of a ton of reporters!

http://coloradoindependent.com/9151/oops-colorado-mccain-camp-sends-internal-e-mail-to-reporters

[superluser]

And that's why they're DESPERATELY trying to get the VP debate cancelled (or moved and then cancelled). That's what this whole thing may be about, I think. Just a guess on my part.

I certainly wouldn't put money against that, but if McCain pulls a no-show for the first debate, they can't use that line.

Obama may have to concede to have the debates held in DC, but a no-show would be a guarantee that the VP debate will go as planned.

[Cvstos]

If a deal is made or is close to completion before the debate and McCain is still a no-show he can kiss the Presidency goodbye, I think.

[superluser]

I sort of wonder if, at this point, McCain is trying to campaign so poorly that when he fails, people will say, ``No, his positions were fine; it's just that he was a terrible campaigner.''

[Valynth]

I sort of wonder if, at this point, McCain is trying to campaign so poorly that when he fails, people will say, ``No, his positions were fine; it's just that he was a terrible campaigner.''

Doubt it.  I slightly favored him in the beginning for the reasons others have stated, but now I'm deep in Obama's camp due to McCain's rather shoddy running.  Of course you can't fault him for waffling almost every potential president has waffled on SOMETHING.  Even Obama's stance on not negotiating with Iran on their nuclear program, for example, and then turning around and talking about sitting down with Iran to discuss their nuclear program.

Personally I think McCain sees this election as a huge farce since Bush was so unpopular that anyone related in any way to Bush would lose.  Therefore when the inevitable happens, America would feel further united under Obama since McCain was such a poor choice (that's what I'd do in his shoes).  *predicts a nearly all blue U.S. and crosses fingers*

[Vidar]

McCain's choice of Palin for his running mate is a cynical attempt to rake in the conservative, and female votes. She has no relevant experience with leadership, how to talk to the press, how to deal with criticism, the economy, education, foreign policy, etc.
If she gets into the office of VP, you can expect the politics for the next 4 years to be summed up in 1 word: clusterfuck.
America needs honest, intelligent and experienced leaders, aka. the very best amongst all Americans, the elite, if you will.
Good luck in finding those and getting them into office with the current "smarts=elitist=bad" attitude of the average American voter.

[Fragmaster01]

Honestly, I don't really care if he suspends his campaign or not: if he wants to make a stupid choice with his own campaign, that's his decision. My dislike of the matter comes from him wanting to suspend the presidential and VP debates as well, to "free the candidates up to better deal with this crisis". Honestly, I'm much more concerned with getting a better picture of how the candidates would deal with problems in the future, rather than focusing on a vote that's being steamrolled so quickly that no one senator will affect it.

[Damaris]

I deeply oppose his suspension of his campaign- I think that this is the time that sitting down and talking with real people having real problems, and figuring out how to help Americans, rather than big business, would look the best.

Obviously, his advisers haven't thought of that.

[superluser]

Good luck in finding those and getting them into office with the current "smarts=elitist=bad" attitude of the average American voter.

I think it's summed up the best by noting that Lady Lynn Forester de Rothschild is a McCain supporter.  You don't get more elitist than the Rothschilds.

I deeply oppose his suspension of his campaign

I'm a little more generous than that.  If McCain wanted to permanently suspend his campaign, I'd be cool with that.

[Jigsaw Forte]

The very idea is laughable. You CAN'T "suspend" a presidential campaign.

What, does McCain think if he holds his breath 'til his face turns blue, they'll somehow push the general election (you know, that little thing whose date is mandated by constitutional law) back for him too?

[Brunhidden]

The very idea is laughable. You CAN'T "suspend" a presidential campaign.

true- america continued presidential campaigns when general Sherman set fire to atlanta, continued campaigns when D-day sent thousands of young men to their bloody doom, throughout every terreble time in history the presidential campaign is needed ALL THE MORE because its kinda nice to have a president who can, you know, HANDLE REALITY.

McCain sounds like he just said 'hold on, i need to take my shoe off to count that high, wait for me' in that he cant juggle both a campaign, getting exposed that his economic plan (read- george bush's economic plan) has completely failed and george bush himself just adopted Obama's economic plan, and a nationwide crisis

yeah, if he cant handle a nationwide crisis he is not fit to lead

[Tapewolf]

yeah, if he cant handle a nationwide crisis he is not fit to lead

That, I think, is the bottom line.

[Vidar]

yeah, if he cant handle a nationwide crisis he is not fit to lead

That, I think, is the bottom line.

Not quite. Can any of the current candidates or their VP's handle a nationwide crisis?

[Noone]

Fighting a crisis like this isn't easy, though I do believe Obama is *significantly* more qualified for the job than McCain. If anything, I actually think that if Obama is elected, his presidency would likely resemble Franklin D Roosevelt's. Their situations (would be) strikingly similar, a failing economy, a friendly (in terms of party anyways) senate and house, and a hostile supreme court. Either candidate would have a tough road ahead of them, though it would probably be more difficult for McCain since congress is mostly democrat, a side effect of Bush's horrible administration.

Do I think Obama can clean up the mess in the economy and the mess in Iraq in 4 years, or even 8? Of course not, that would take a miracle, especially when you consider the American federal deficit, which was 9.7 trillion the last time I checked. On the other hand, that has to be weighed against the alternative, McCain, who may not continue the Bush trend, but would more likely keep it where it is at the time Bush is removed from office. In fact, most likely, McCain would be most likely to just stop democratically aligned legislation rather than pushing his own, a president cannot directly legislate, though the threat of the veto and connections with one's political party often mean that a president can indirectly legislate. I'm truthfully more concerned about McCain's views on the war in Iraq though, which has been nothing but an administrative disaster. I honestly think that our presence there isn't actually helping anything, and while pulling out would have severe repercussions, staying there is just delaying the inevitable, and of course, congress doesn't really have a say about what the president does there, since the president handles foreign affairs for the most part.

[Brunhidden]

yeah, if he cant handle a nationwide crisis he is not fit to lead

That, I think, is the bottom line.

Not quite. Can any of the current candidates or their VP's handle a nationwide crisis?

the sad thing is McCain probably thinks this IS 'handling it'... by being able to point and say 'i care more about the economy then Obama cause i suggested this. sure i didn't care less yesterday but i changed my mind at the last minute and thats what counts'

sad

i hope in the near future we change the constitution to state that presidential candidates must have a degree in economics and something better then a C average

[Noone]

i hope in the near future we change the constitution to state that presidential candidates must have a degree in economics and something better then a C average

You might find it interesting to know that the only president with ANY economics education was Herbert Hoover, that's right, the guy who cut the money supply by 40% and didn't help with a struggling economy, and is also said to have caused the Great Depression. Now of course, a lot of that is likely exaggerated, and I can't give my personal opinions as I wasn't alive then, but the econ degree sure did a lot for him. Granted, the economic theory of that era was not as advanced as modern economics, but I think that skill in dealing with congress, foreign affairs, and other politics is more important than economic education, as a president can always consult a specialist.

[superluser]

The very idea is laughable. You CAN'T "suspend" a presidential campaign.

You *can* suspend your campaigning activities, but you're right--the names on the ballot aren't going to change unless that candidate's party changes them.

What, does McCain think if he holds his breath 'til his face turns blue, they'll somehow push the general election (you know, that little thing whose date is mandated by constitutional law) back for him too?

Actually, they could.  It's a law (3 U.S.C. § 1), and Congress could, in theory, change it.  But that would make it more difficult to get everything done by inauguration day, which *is* mandated by the 20th Amendment.

Not quite. Can any of the current candidates or their VP's handle a nationwide crisis?

Can anyone?

I'd most trust Biden on this issue, but Obama seems as qualified as any candidate.

You might find it interesting to know that the only president with ANY economics education was Herbert Hoover

In addition, the only president to ever have a doctorate was Woodrow Wilson (whoa, alliteration!), who was also the only president to go insane, and the president for whom the 25th amendment (about presidential incapacity) was passed.

[Alondro]

Obama will also have something else similar to Roosevelt:  economic stimulus plans that failed.  Have you all forgotten that the New Deal did nothing to fix the economy in the 30's?  It was the build up of manufacturing for WWII that did it at last.

besides which, Obama still has yet to show me that he can debate in a real forum.  I've watched his interviews; he either gets puff questions and reporters ignore anything serious (such as his association for years with terrorist bomber William Ayers), or if someone does mess up and ask his a real question, he very expertly meanders around and says a whole lot without ever actually addressing the subject of the question.

And as far as his claim that he'll do things differently, that's not what his voting record shows.  In fact, he has the most partisan voting record in the Senate, siding with his party line 95% of the time, vs an average of 87% for other Democratic senators.  Plus, he was one of the biggest recipients of money from Fannie and Freddie, whose lending practices were approved by majority Democrat oversight.  If anything led to the current economic crisis, it was the short-sighted stupidity to let people who couldn't afford it 'live the American dream'.  Under old lending guidelines, no one would have ever gotten a loan unless they had proof of employment and assests.  My parents went through hell with stacks of forms to borrow the $29,000 for their house in 1976, for example.  The truth is, everyone in the government was to blame for this.  The Republicans tried to soften their image and pretend to be like Democrats while spending like mad, in essense, they abandoned conservativism.  And the Democrats, well, thy just continued being themselves.  And now here we are... which is what I predicted if you'll recall.  Oh that reminds me.  I did make note that government would attempt to bail out the flundering economy in the fall and that it would seem to stabilize... until June/July 2009.  And look what we have!  A huge government bailout!  You know, the only part of my prediction left to be completed is the collapse next summer.

Obama is a smooth talker, an American Idol candidate with no substance, whose plans are all based in socialist-style rhetoric with plans that European countries tried and are now abandoning because the cost becomes too great to bear.  But vote him in if you wish.  It'll be all more taunting I get to do when he blunders.  I'm not exactly thrilled with McCain either, but at least he's not living in the clouds with airy promises of hopes and dreams that have no chance in hell of ever working.

[superluser]

Obama will also have something else similar to Roosevelt:  economic stimulus plans that failed.  Have you all forgotten that the New Deal did nothing to fix the economy in the 30's?

No, I didn't forget that.



Mainly because it's wrong.

[Amber Williams]

Personally I am amazed anyone is actually wanting to be President this election.  It seems that no matter who gets in, unless they pull a miracle out of their butt, they are going to get saddled with the blame of the current economic situation and the opposing camp is likely going to point their fingers and claim that had they been elected in, they would have made it better.

The only thing I can really say other than that is that the Republican's VP scares me.  And I don't use that term lightly.  The woman is Grade A scary to me.