2013/01/20 [DMFA #1371] - Once upon an time...

[joshofspam]

Another odd reason I thought of why Destania has targeted Abel is a rather opportunist one and still a bit on the crazy side.

1.It would give her the chance of fully settling her grudge with Aniz.
2.By killing a cubi at the Inn, it takes the focus away from undesirable taking interest of the inn. Cubi killed by adventures and the reason for an elder dragon and their assassins to look into things drops dramatically.

[FairWage22]

Something else comes to mind...

If Des has 'cut herself off' from Cyra, and tri-wings are the 'rock' that a Clan is supported on, that might be part of the root cause for her instability.

From a different angle, Fa'lina did see some of this coming, and was willing to give Abel the choice to do something about it.

Now that the Band o' Brix has discovered that they may have been set up to assassinate cubi, they may be seeking authorities to turn themselves in to with full evidence of the research they've made thus far... which could introduce a whole other can o' worms to the scenario.

Not to mention that it's a big blank spot for the phoenix yet somehow one told them the information that sent them to Lost Lake...  So, it's just getting messy AND real up in here.

Heckuva birthday present, though.

~Happy birthday, Dear Abel... Happy Birthday, to you... Happy Birthday, Dear Abel... how dead are you?  How dead are you?~

[maus_merryjest]

Ah Destania... I guess you can be old as dirt and still be dumb as mud.
I'm not disappointed in Destania, from the mess that the Ti'Fiona history is, I assumed that someone who had more verve for revenge than common sense was meddling in the background.

Abel may be an odd duck and a snark, but ultimately he's not a bad (400 year old) kid. Destania's poor concept of revenge is going to come back to haunt her--- if I were Destania, what more delicious revenge could there be than turning the son of someone you hated into a staunch ally and friend?
Then again, that requires more of a cool mind than D seems to have--- it's probably something Fa'Lina would do.

[killpurakat]

You know, I think I feel sorry most of all for Cyra. She has one daughter, one of two living relatives, and she seems to deeply regret her actions from so long ago that killed most of her clan. She obviously does value family, and it seems she is not angry at the dragons (maybe a bit, but it seems to be more sympathic over the situation in Hishaan and the terrible fate of those that dwelt there before she tried to take over, if her speech in this comic is anything to go by: http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1217.php).

And her daughter does not listen to her, cuts her out of her life, and is on a self destructive path that most likely will end in more tragedy. No wonder Cyra said she got so much happiness from simply talking to Dan for a short while (this comic here: http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1214.php).

Something else to think about: Cubi, as a whole, are very emotional, and do have grudges, but they are also very much against destroying their own. Heck, Fa'Lina couldn't do anything besides bar Aniz from coming back to SAIA, even though he'd just caused a massive uproar and destroyed decades/centuries of work, because Taun would pitch a fit over Cubi turning against Cubi (this comic: http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_009.php). And Fa'Lina wasn't even thinking of doing anything to Aniz herself, just turning him over to the proper authorities. Destania is outright trying to murder Abel; Taun is not going to be happy is her clan hears of that.

[Naldru]

I think that Destania has just passed the point where there is no way she can become a likable character again.

With the X-Men Dark Phoenix Saga, they had a point where Jean Gray became the incredibly powerful Dark Phoenix and then blew up an inhabited planet.  Somebody at a higher level then mentioned that they wanted to bring Jean Gray back to the team.  As I understand it, the reaction of the editor was "Gee.  I wish you had told us that before we had her blow up a planet and kill billions of people."

Of course, they did bring her back by arguing that the Jean Gray who blew up a planet was the equivalent of an "evil clone".

One possibility does present itself.  Hizell and Destania trying to bring the Cubi-Dragon war to its final solution with Dan and Pyroduck (their sons) trying to stop them and make peace.  A little bit of Romeo and Juliet with Pyroduck and Alexsis to add more impact.  Lots of opportunities for heroic deaths.

[Amber Williams]

I think that Destania has just passed the point where there is no way she can become a likable character again.

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Er...wait...was the challenge to make her likable again or is the challenge that this is the point where she's past the point of no return?

[ChaosMageX]

One possibility does present itself.  Hizell and Destania trying to bring the Cubi-Dragon war to its final solution with Dan and Pyroduck (their sons) trying to stop them and make peace.  A little bit of Romeo and Juliet with Pyroduck and Alexsis to add more impact.  Lots of opportunities for heroic deaths.

Or a tiny bit like Star Wars, although it isn't likely Dan will end up kissing Alexsi.  Darn it, now I want to see Pyroduck dressed as Han Solo, or Chewbacca, or both.

[Ignuus66]

Wait Pyroduck isn't a shaved chewbacca with a tail??? MY WHOLE LIFE IS A LIE

[Wanderer]

I think that Destania has just passed the point where there is no way she can become a likable character again.

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Er...wait...was the challenge to make her likable again or is the challenge that this is the point where she's past the point of no return?

Oh, by all means go ahead and make her likeable again. I'm pretty sure that was the challenge. Really, you don't need to go out of your way to do the other thing, since prior evidence in regards to the development of morally-ambiguous-but-probably-evil-characters suggests you were going to do that anyway.

[Plotting]

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Er...wait...was the challenge to make her likable again or is the challenge that this is the point where she's past the point of no return?

I challenge you to do both!

I challenge you to make he likable again, and to show us that this is not the point where she's past the point of no return! I even challenge you to make her worse/more evil than she already is, then make her redeemable somehow!  

[VAE]

I think that Destania has just passed the point where there is no way she can become a likable character again.

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Er...wait...was the challenge to make her likable again or is the challenge that this is the point where she's past the point of no return?

Oh, by all means go ahead and make her likeable again. I'm pretty sure that was the challenge. Really, you don't need to go out of your way to do the other thing, since prior evidence in regards to the development of morally-ambiguous-but-probably-evil-characters suggests you were going to do that anyway.

Well, given that I still like her, and I'm likely not alone, that's an easy challenge.

[latei]

Awww, Biggs is all sad that Dee destroyed his Number #1 Bro! mug.

Anyway, mad theory time: would Dee need to impersonate the Phoenix to make the prophecy that brought the BoB to the Inn. Maybe she blackmailed one of the Phoenix instead. We've seen that Dee can hide people (Aniz) and places (the Inn) from Phoenix sight, so maybe it is possible that she can permanently block a Phoenix's sight, or at least large portions of it. Of course, for this to work it has to be able to stick through the Phoenix's death. But if the previous theory is true, then it is possible that her attack on Abel is her getting some petty revenge while testing that a)her blackmail will actually work and b)if the Phoenix will rain any kind retribution down on her.

[Alondro]

Well, that is disappointing.  I really didn't think she'd be so stupid as to jeopardise her plans, her son and her own life by attacking Abel and therefore tipping off her enemies that she had a presence at Lost Lake.

I don't think Dan's going to be too happy when he finds out either.

"Did anything happen to Alexsi...?"
"She was nearly killed by assassins sent by your mother.  The Dragons will now be tipped off to your existence and they will hunt you down like a dog."


EDIT:

Fa'Lina may have been right:  http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1330.php

I still have to wonder about Mertlitz.  Since old-style Destania is behind this, it's entirely likely she offed him to make things more convincing, though there is the problem of Aliyka as well. 

*Charline chuckles*  Silly Tape!  Mot cubi aren't anywhere near as clever as I am!  You have no idea how many people I let live even though I utterly despise them because I need them for my plans!  Like Charles, for instance!  But once the plans are complete... heh heh heh!

*Charles feels a sudden chill*  o_____o

[Zebra Bug]

Ok, I've been reading this webcomic since 2005, my second webcomic ever, and by far one of my favorites. But this is really the first time I ever thought to post. But I am just curious about what everyone else thinks about this page....is it just me or does Dee really, really have it in for Abel?

[KV1NN4]

http://clockworkmansion.com/forum/index.php/topic,9323.0.html Most people have been discussing the most recent update in the thread I jsut linked.
~K. *: )

[Zebra Bug]

It is interesting that Destania and Biggs are plotting the downfall of the dragon race (I am very curious to Bigg's motivations for that...seems more like he'd be plotting against demons with the implications that Regina killed his mum...) and yet she seems content to keep in the dark about all her other machinations.

[Zebra Bug]

Awww, Biggs is all sad that Dee destroyed his Number #1 Bro! mug.

Anyway, mad theory time: would Dee need to impersonate the Phoenix to make the prophecy that brought the BoB to the Inn. Maybe she blackmailed one of the Phoenix instead. We've seen that Dee can hide people (Aniz) and places (the Inn) from Phoenix sight, so maybe it is possible that she can permanently block a Phoenix's sight, or at least large portions of it. Of course, for this to work it has to be able to stick through the Phoenix's death. But if the previous theory is true, then it is possible that her attack on Abel is her getting some petty revenge while testing that a)her blackmail will actually work and b)if the Phoenix will rain any kind retribution down on her.

Oh, that is a sneaky thought that makes alot of sense....and yet...even though she could easily take the form of a Phoenix...and I can picture her acting like that...how could they (The other Oracles) not notice her if she was at their enclave? Unless she hid herself from their sight well there, and hid the Adventurers too? So they came to see her, the other Oracles would not see any of them? Or was it a fake enclave? Oh, and I see people using 'BoB' in reference to the party that attacked Lost Lake...what does that mean? I can make some guesses but...

[YawnPB]

Blunt Object Brigade, B.O.B. 

[Zebra Bug]

Blunt Object Brigade, B.O.B. 

Thank you! 

[Tapewolf]

It is interesting that Destania and Biggs are plotting the downfall of the dragon race (I am very curious to Bigg's motivations for that...seems more like he'd be plotting against demons with the implications that Regina killed his mum...) and yet she seems content to keep in the dark about all her other machinations.

It has been suggested that he's a Were.  The truth of this is not known, but it has been said that Weres are mostly in hiding after their race was nearly exterminated and I wouldn't be entirely surprised if the dragons had a hand in that.  So that's one possible explanation.

By the way, it might be a good idea to check through the rules - consecutive posts like that are considered bad form.

[Jesk Levethix]

there's a bit of an issue with all this coming to light that has me wondering like with some...

Des seems to have impersonated a Phoenix (a) in order to set up her hit on Able .. (Union Rules as stated in an earlier comics would have made clear even if blackmailed  A Phoenix (a) must give all incites in the form of a riddle/metaphor if in an official meaning.  Seriously not even being able to tell a kid his ball is under the sink...) 

That said.. and given how in doing so she has tarnished the image Oh the Phoenix(A) race in the eyes of those that won't understand the deception there.. (and really even if it is a blackmail issue this is still food for thought) She's likely truly wronged them at least  one member or the entire race...

So.. When will the Phoenix(A) notable figure come for her.. Or given how somewhat insane she feels at this moment
(Naldru BTW I'm actually kinda with you at the moment ) has She already come by for tea.. and the one bit of knowlage abut the future you never want to be told.. telling.

[Naldru]

There is no point in challenging Amber.  As the author, she is omnipotent and omniscient with respect to Furrae.   I was merely discussing the direction the plot seemed to be going.

I see the following as the main methods for converting Destania back into an anti-hero.

It isn't really Destania.  Somebody else is pretending to be Destania. (like Dark Phoenix)

Destania is under the mind control of somebody really evil.  (like Darth Vader and Palpatine)

Destania had secretly planned for the attack to fail and was pretending to be angry.  (Xanotos gambit)

It was all a dream,  (like Dallas)

Destania knows a secret about Abel that makes him a danger to all of Furrae.  (If you knew a baby would grow up to become Hitler, would you kill him.)

Having Abel killed would advance some other plot that would serve the greater good.  (like Dumbledore in Harry Potter expecting Harry to be killed going after he who must not be named)

I'm sure that there are others.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

http://clockworkmansion.com/forum/index.php/topic,9323.0.html Most people have been discussing the most recent update in the thread I jsut linked.
~K. *: )

Fixed.

Awww, Biggs is all sad that Dee destroyed his Number #1 Bro! mug.

Anyway, mad theory time: would Dee need to impersonate the Phoenix to make the prophecy that brought the BoB to the Inn. Maybe she blackmailed one of the Phoenix instead. We've seen that Dee can hide people (Aniz) and places (the Inn) from Phoenix sight, so maybe it is possible that she can permanently block a Phoenix's sight, or at least large portions of it. Of course, for this to work it has to be able to stick through the Phoenix's death. But if the previous theory is true, then it is possible that her attack on Abel is her getting some petty revenge while testing that a)her blackmail will actually work and b)if the Phoenix will rain any kind retribution down on her.

Technically, we've seen that _Cyra_ can hide people. Destania, not so much; as I recall it, she borrowed Cyra's power to shelter Aniz.

And we don't know what happened with the Phoenix; all we know is that Da' doesn't know, and it wasn't one of the Phoenices. Phoenixes. Whatever.


Which leaves a lot more wiggle-room than you might think.

[VAE]

There is no point in challenging Amber.  As the author, she is omnipotent and omniscient with respect to Furrae.   I was merely discussing the direction the plot seemed to be going.

I see the following as the main methods for converting Destania back into an anti-hero.

It isn't really Destania.  Somebody else is pretending to be Destania. (like Dark Phoenix)

Destania is under the mind control of somebody really evil.  (like Darth Vader and Palpatine)

Destania had secretly planned for the attack to fail and was pretending to be angry.  (Xanotos gambit)

It was all a dream,  (like Dallas)

Destania knows a secret about Abel that makes him a danger to all of Furrae.  (If you knew a baby would grow up to become Hitler, would you kill him.)

Having Abel killed would advance some other plot that would serve the greater good.  (like Dumbledore in Harry Potter expecting Harry to be killed going after he who must not be named)

I'm sure that there are others.

And the neat thing is that there isn't a single bit of evidence supporting any of them.

[ChaosMageX]

In my opinion, I don't think Destania has reached the point of no return in terms of her ability to be liked, at least not yet.

I mean sure, her actions seem over-emotional, rash, and just plain stupid, but considering that not only is she a Cubi, a race that's prone to lose control of their emotions, but also, as others have stated, Abel was related to Aniz, the object of her scorn, and she openly states that relation in this very strip.

And who knows?  As someone else has stated, what seems like a stupid and petty revenge plot could have been part of a much greater scheme to deliberately draw attention to the Lost Lake Inn in order to bait the dragons and lure them into some sort of trap.  I'm not sure what sort of trap it would be, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone as resourceful as Destania had a trick or two up her sleeves.

But I digress.  Personally, I think the point of no return will be if she ever states that she never truly loved Edward or even her own son, that her entire mellowing out into a "loving mother" was just an act and that they were merely pawns in her greater scheme to eliminate the dragons.  At that point I'll think she's an evil bitch witch who deserves to die.

[VAE]

In my opinion, I don't think Destania has reached the point of no return in terms of her ability to be liked, at least not yet.

I mean sure, her actions seem over-emotional, rash, and just plain stupid, but considering that not only is she a Cubi, a race that's prone to lose control of their emotions, but also, as others have stated, Abel was related to Aniz, the object of her scorn, and she openly states that relation in this very strip.

And who knows?  As someone else has stated, what seems like a stupid and petty revenge plot could have been part of a much greater scheme to deliberately draw attention to the Lost Lake Inn in order to bait the dragons and lure them into some sort of trap.  I'm not sure what sort of trap it would be, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone as resourceful as Destania had a trick or two up her sleeves.

But I digress.  Personally, I think the point of no return will be if she ever states that she never truly loved Edward or even her own son, that her entire mellowing out into a "loving mother" was just an act and that they were merely pawns in her greater scheme to eliminate the dragons.  At that point I'll think she's an evil bitch witch who deserves to die.

Well, you are entitled to your opinion, but if she really pulled off a gambit 50 or so years long, I'd be friggin' impressed.

[Tuyu]

Was that another of Aniz children Des got rid of?

Not likely, as she would have had the guy's kid offed as well on the off chance that the kid would grow up to be a Siar cubi.

Unless you consider a longer and even more twisted view:  perhaps waiting until the child actually displayed cubi traits would be important?  Or the idea that the child would turn out a 'dud' would be as good as killing? Or even that she wants to keep the bloodline alive for future killing needs?

[ChaosMageX]

Well, you are entitled to your opinion, but if she really pulled off a gambit 50 or so years long, I'd be friggin' impressed.

Well, when compared to the typical lifespan of cubi, 50 years is practically nothing, and as other strips have indicated, creatures that live that long might have a penchant for creating schemes that can last several decades if not longer.

If Dark Pegasus can create a plan that takes decades alone to prepare, I wouldn't be surprised if Destania would do the same thing.  For all we know Destania could have been planning this since before Abel was even born, since she probably knew it was Aniz's goal to have kids.  It might have just happened that offing Abel fit snugly into her grand plan, and if he hadn't existed in the first place or had done something different that wouldn't have made offing him work to help accomplish her ultimate goals, she might have thought of an alternate way to move her grand plan forward.

[VAE]

Well, you are entitled to your opinion, but if she really pulled off a gambit 50 or so years long, I'd be friggin' impressed.

Well, when compared to the typical lifespan of cubi, 50 years is practically nothing, and as other strips have indicated, creatures that live that long might have a penchant for creating schemes that can last several decades if not longer.

If Dark Pegasus can create a plan that takes decades alone to prepare, I wouldn't be surprised if Destania would do the same thing.  For all we know Destania could have been planning this since before Abel was even born, since she probably knew it was Aniz's goal to have kids.  It might have just happened that offing Abel fit snugly into her grand plan, and if he hadn't existed in the first place or had done something different that wouldn't have made offing him work to help accomplish her ultimate goals, she might have thought of an alternate way to move her grand plan forward.

But, Dark Pegasus himself doing that was impressive. Besides, the length of the plan compared to lifespan isn't really the determining issue in hatching a plan of this sort - planning for longer periods of time becomes progressively harder and harder. Hell, if you want to do lifespan ratios, a solidly executed, complex plan which takes five years to a person is damn impressive too.

[Lying Foo]

Destania has kind of always been one of the "evil teammates," alongside Kria and Biggs.  Right now, she's working against the heroes; soon, she'll probably be on their side, and everyone will treat her with the same suspicion they always did.  I mean, how many Beings has she tortured in her classes?  How many folks must she have killed for Biggs if for no other reason?  And she's still trying to wipe out the dragons, even if Pyroduck is probably exempt...