03/27/10 [Clan Leaders 12] - Hope springs eternal

[Jigsaw Forte]

I'm pretty sure the whole conversion process (and requirement) is for the purposes of saying "Once you've crossed the threshold, you can't make any more clanfolk, period" and probably keeps folks from, say, turning tri-wing as soon as they're out of the academy and trying to just have a convert-only clan.

i.e. if Cubi were an MMO, Clan Leaders would be player avatars who can control the clan and generate resources, but can't act directly on improving their clan strength short of, say, ordering all their male members to go out and bed a continent's worth of beings. It just happens that Fa'Lina decided to keep playing past her personal Game Over and found a nice bug in the system to exploit.

[VAE]

I just have one question: does Clan Affinity survive being ripped outside of space and time and brought forward seven thousand years or so?

Which brings up a couple of questions for me, if time-travel rids a cubi of their Clan Affinity, how does that impact the cubi? Would they lose their powers or at least their clan marking? Would die?

No i think - a cubi with dead leader is for all purposes practically clanless and Aary says it makes them somewhat less powerful.

[Anker Steadfast]

I wonder what would happen if a Tri-Wing could ascend further, to a Quad-Wing ?
Would such a cubi even be able to walk with so many wings on her backside ?
And I wonder just how dangerous Fa'Lina could become as such a creature?
What with her madness only held at bay by keeping herself busy with the academy and all that.

Ah well, so far there doesn't seem to be any such creatures, and if older clan leaders haven't found a way, there probably won't be a Quad-Wing.

I just have one question: does Clan Affinity survive being ripped outside of space and time and brought forward seven thousand years or so?

Which brings up a couple of questions for me, if time-travel rids a cubi of their Clan Affinity, how does that impact the cubi? Would they lose their powers or at least their clan marking? Would die?

No i think - a cubi with dead leader is for all purposes practically clanless and Aary says it makes them somewhat less powerful.

I believe it has been mentioned that a clan can continue without a leader, by the simple expedient of appointing a new leader.
It would be traumatic, sure, but possible all the same. And yes, it would most likely decrease the clans power.
Possibly even create a split of the clan, into two clans, or have some of the clans members joinanother clan.

Plenty of possibilities there.

[Tangent]

Actually, I was considering that. What if the reason a tri-wing cannot have children is that the mate has insufficient power? In short... in order for a tri-wing to have additional children, he or she would have to mate with another tri-wing, or a Creature of similar or greater power (say, a Demon or a Fae).

Of course, Amber is the Creatrix of this realm, so if she says no, it means no.

Hey! Stop taking apart the 360! Um, excuse me, got some hyperactive imaginary cubi running amuck... darn kittens went AWOL on me. *wanders off*

[Morgan]

That's an idea - that ascended 'Cubi can only mate with 'Cubi or creatures of suitable strength. Wouldn't it be twisted if Fa'Lina and Hizell were actually a power match? Haha. Oh boy.

Also, the fae thing wouldn't work. It would just make a little blank person that would never have a personality and whose body would die on its 21st birthday. Faeries can't date outside the race. It's sad.

[VAE]

My belief is that eventually it becomes an enormously powerful creature composed just of wings (with blindsight and all the senses you haven't even heard about)
Something like a gibbering orb, just with wings

That's an idea - that ascended 'Cubi can only mate with 'Cubi or creatures of suitable strength. Wouldn't it be twisted if Fa'Lina and Hizell were actually a power match? Haha. Oh boy.
 

I think you are onto why she and Hizell were friends before the treason ... this would make a lot of sense since with romantic interests one's brain tends to go on holiday

[Lego3400]

So are people forgetting this and this? >.>
To me, mostly a lurker, this screams Siar betrayed Fa'Lina.
...But I'm also awake at 5am, so I could be reading into it wrong.

I'm guessing that Amber meant to say ". . . .lead to the betrayal BY one of her closest friends. . ."  rather than "OF." "OF" can be interpreted two ways while "BY" can only be interpreted one way.

We know that Hizell was one of Fa'Lina's friends before the war.
http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1071.php

I think the betrayer is him and there is no third party that decided to betray her to Hizell. 

Yeah... I wanna know where your getting the idea that Hizell and Pryodaddy are the same dragon.

[AmigaDragon]

We know that Hizell was one of Fa'Lina's friends before the war.
http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1071.php

I think the betrayer is him and there is no third party that decided to betray her to Hizell. 

Yeah... I wanna know where your getting the idea that Hizell and Pryodaddy are the same dragon.

I'm at a loss to find where that arc says "Hizell" was Ducky's father or Fa'Lina's friend. All it says is that Ducky's father was her friend.

Fa'lina = Sasuke from Naruto!

Which must mean that the ultimate bad guy is ALSO actually from her clan but IN DISGUISE, like Tobi actually being Uchiha Madara!!! 

You need to do spoiler alerts, some of us haven't watched the entire series yet!!! 

Some of us have never seen any of it and have no idea what you're talking about.

[Pvblivs]

I don't know.  It seems a general "tri-wings can't have children" would be problematic.  A cubi becomes a member of a clan either by being born into it or converting into it.  It would seem that any pre-existing children at the time of ascension would remain in the old clan.  I suppose it could be possible to start a new clan before becoming tri-wing.

All in all, I think it would be simpler to say that Fa'lina's interest in adding clan members has passed.  Other things are more important to her.  And Amber wouldn't be the first author to introduce clunkers and/or inconsistencies in order to force a particular result. 

[SoWhatIfImFurry]

Yes, but Devin also appeared in Abel's story if I recall correctly, and then later appeared in the main comic.

But mink has not yet, and if he will either the cast page will be revised or it will not be

Not all dragons! What about Pyroduck? He's nice

Do you know what collateral damage is ?  

You're kinda confusing affinity and food here. Because this is a demo page, Hope is correct. Her nomming preference however is probably legitly unknown.

Ehm,., muffins?

Wait, hold up. This is probably a stupid and off topic question, but... Isn't Mink a girl? *cowers behind flame shield*

[Mrs_A_ZeTavia]

Wait, hold up. This is probably a stupid and off topic question, but... Isn't Mink a girl? *cowers behind flame shield*

Mink is a squiggly, simple as that! 

[SoWhatIfImFurry]

sooo... he/she has no gender?

[James StarRunner]

If Mink does, it hasn't been specified. Welcome to the forums by the way!

[Mrs_A_ZeTavia]

If Mink does, it hasn't been specified. Welcome to the forums by the way!

And on that note, please make sure you read the forum rules as well (if you already haven't). 
So I Welcome you, too; SoWhatIfImFurry!! 

[Arcblade]

Quad-wing cubi.... I vote the 4th set goes on the ankles.  Hermes, anyone?

Right now it's only speculation that Hizell and Pyro's father are the same.  Short of author-confirmation or comic-reveal, we can only guess.

[SoWhatIfImFurry]

thanks guys! really glad to be here! 

[Tapewolf]

I don't know.  It seems a general "tri-wings can't have children" would be problematic.

I see it as part of the price you pay.

A cubi becomes a member of a clan either by being born into it or converting into it.  It would seem that any pre-existing children at the time of ascension would remain in the old clan.  I suppose it could be possible to start a new clan before becoming tri-wing.

I think that's the case.  It does seem to be possible to start a clan without ascending, most likely by branching yourself and like-minded individuals into a new one.  So the way I see it, you have your children and gather your followers and then, when you're ready, you ascend (or die trying).

[Anker Steadfast]

Quad-wing cubi.... I vote the 4th set goes on the ankles.  Hermes, anyone?

Nah ... should be a pair of HUGE backwings that makes them fall backwards, that would so fit the DMFA universe.
"Yeah, I considered becoming a Quad-Wing, but I like to have a balance, so I didnt."

Right now it's only speculation that Hizell and Pyro's father are the same.  Short of author-confirmation or comic-reveal, we can only guess.

Lots 'n' lots 'n' LOTS of speculation.

But yeah, we don't know if his father is Hizell.
In fact, I suspect that Amber would deliberately not make him Hizell, just to throw us a curveball.

[Sind]

The Dragons most notorious for Cubi-slaying are Ducky's dad and Hizell, who are known for slaying entire clans D:
I doubt the Cubi vs. Dragons war had several leaders on the Cubi side, but only one on the dragons side
I'm going to guess they are different dragons...

[Tapewolf]

I doubt the Cubi vs. Dragons war had several leaders on the Cubi side, but only one on the dragons side

We don't know how many Dragons there are active in Furrae - it might be fewer than 100.

[nicoreon the tyrannical]

Gust had one of thous weird 4am epiphany. I never noticed this before but her clan mark looks like a lot like pink snork when your tiered. 

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Gust had one of thous weird 4am epiphany. I never noticed this before but her clan mark looks like a lot like pink snork when your tiered. 

... Also, you become incoherent. Try getting some sleep, then coming back.

[Scow2]

Well, we do know a single Dragon can destroy an entire powerful clan quickly... so there may be very few Dragons in Furrae, and Dan owes one of them money!

[Pvblivs]

I don't know.  It seems a general "tri-wings can't have children" would be problematic.

I see it as part of the price you pay.

I meant problematic for the coherency of the DMFA universe, not for the individual cubi.  As I said, founding a clan before ascending might be made to work.  But if a new cubi are born into the stronger clan of the two parents (I seem to remember that being one of the rules) it is difficult to see how that could be the fledgeling clan unless the founder were already ascended.

[Tapewolf]

I meant problematic for the coherency of the DMFA universe, not for the individual cubi.

Ah, right.  All the same, one of the things Amber seems to have done as a whole is to balance things out, so that for every advantage there is a major weakness.

As I said, founding a clan before ascending might be made to work.  But if a new cubi are born into the stronger clan of the two parents (I seem to remember that being one of the rules) it is difficult to see how that could be the fledgeling clan unless the founder were already ascended.

True, but only if the parents are both 'Cubi.  If one of them is a Being or a 'lesser Creature', e.g. a Gryphon, Phoenix etc, the child will more often than not be 'Cubi.

[Mao]

True, but only if the parents are both 'Cubi.  If one of them is a Being or a 'lesser Creature', e.g. a Gryphon, Phoenix etc, the child will more often than not be 'Cubi.

Uh.. are you sure about that? That doesn't match up with what was said here.

[Tapewolf]

Uh.. are you sure about that? That doesn't match up with what was said here.

Not really... it's difficult to be 100% sure of anything with that page.  It's rather vague and full of "if" and "almost always".
For instance, I thought that you'd never get a 'Cubi out of a Demon/Cubi pairing, but rereading it, panel 2 contradicts that.  Presumably you'd have to have a powerful 'Cubi and a weak demon.
Then you've got the whole "if she became a 'Cubi" thing with Matilda, which again might be dependent on Dan and Matilda's relative power levels.
And them you've got Aniz not 100% sure that Abel was going to be a 'Cubi, when May was a Being...

EDIT:
At the end of the day the point I was making was that if you want to ensure that the child is a member of the clan, you'd choose a weaker, non-'Cubi as your partner, which (all things being equal) should result in a 'Cubi who is a member of your clan.  If there's something which contradicts that on the page, I'm not seeing it 

[Psychedelic Mushroom]

[Also I do wonder if Cyra lent a hand with the magic of SAIA, making it harder to find, perhaps giving up Dest would have compromised the academy.

If Fa'Lina is one of Mab's special friends, this may have been her wish.

Hm, I like the sound of this theory! I'ma sit on it now, and watch what develops.

[Mao]

Not really... it's difficult to be 100% sure of anything with that page.  It's rather vague and full of "if" and "almost always".
For instance, I thought that you'd never get a 'Cubi out of a Demon/Cubi pairing, but rereading it, panel 2 contradicts that.  Presumably you'd have to have a powerful 'Cubi and a weak demon.
Then you've got the whole "if she became a 'Cubi" thing with Matilda, which again might be dependent on Dan and Matilda's relative power levels.
And them you've got Aniz not 100% sure that Abel was going to be a 'Cubi, when May was a Being...

EDIT:
At the end of the day the point I was making was that if you want to ensure that the child is a member of the clan, you'd choose a weaker, non-'Cubi as your partner, which (all things being equal) should result in a 'Cubi who is a member of your clan.  If there's something which contradicts that on the page, I'm not seeing it 

Actually, looking back, I misread your statement as saying that more often than not, the child wasn't cubi when paired with a 'lesser' species and that you were citing Aniz as an example.  My mistake.

[Psychedelic Mushroom]

Yeah... I wanna know where your getting the idea that Hizell and Pryodaddy are the same dragon.

Well, Pyroduck says "He betrayed her. Took her entire clan." And, what other Dragon would take Fa'Lina's clan? Because in her Clan page, it said that she was betrayed by a friend, and her whole clan was slaughtered. So I have a HUGE hunch that Pyroduck's father is indeed Hizell. Also. In Abel's Story, that one panel that shows the outline of Hizell looks exactly like the face of Pyroduck's father with few drawing errors. Here, look for yourself:
http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_055.php   - Outline of Hizell
http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_1072.php - Pyroduck's Father
And the horns on his chin and nose MATCH. People have said this though: "Oh but they're not the same size. Well not all drawings of a character will look exactly the same as another hm? anyways that was my proof. Sleep now. *fump*