8/03/09 [DMFA #1027] - Topiary?

[ishidan]

Several threads, I'd say.  I'm kind of curious as to who Mab's five friends are specifically.  If Fa'Lina is one of those, even Dan being in SAIA might not be enough to protect him.

I think that even if Fa'Lina is on the Council, she might just see 'technology' as just another topic to teach at SAIA. (If you view technology as the application of knowledge to achieve goals, then it's identical to magic.)

Heh.  Especially nowadays.  Consider the technology that is so mundane to us these days.
Why, we have learned how to create synthetic lightning, and not only direct it at will but to shape it as we please.

One well known application is the reproduction of illustrated manuscripts, wherein a single image may be reproduced anywhere on the planet, in as many copies as requested and as often as requested, given the appropriate sorcerous instruments.  This feat of wizardry is not even restricted to the hoary practictioners of the arcane arts, indeed, it is now such a common feat that it is even done for mere entertainment.  Legend even has it that the younger mages have proven more adept than their elders at summoning these scrying spells.

*grabs the forum's chain and gives it a good yank*

[Naldru]

hrmm granting magic to creatures would put them onto a power level more in line with beings and with creatures far far out populating beings, this could be a bad thing for all of them iiffff creatures got organized and planned a war against the beings... except that sounds too serious for this comic... *imagines dan, wildly, mab in combat outfits and Jyrras as the mad general* ... ... ... This needs Drawing!!

Are you sure that you are not thinking of this one.

[ooklah]

Are you sure that you are not thinking of this one.

HAH! I completely and totally was not, blast it's already been done!

[Lego3400]

Would you like a pissed-off immortal reality warper hunting you down?

No. But what makes them less afraid of 1 then 2... Aside from there being 1 instead of 2...

[Wanderer]

I might be being slow here, but does anyone know why the Council would put pressure on Jyrrus? So far, all I know is that the stuff he makes lacks magic, and that's as far as it goes. The question I have is why on earth the council would even bother putting pressure on Jyrras if all he's actually making in majority (minus secret projects) are stuff like household blenders or dishwashers.

Because they're capable of taking a long view. In a society built and ruled by magic, technology upsets the order of things. A toaster is not inherently dangerous. But the means to make a toaster and the processes involved in a toaster can be turned to other applications, some of which CAN be dangerous. As long as magic was the rule in the world, those who possessed magic could maintain control over things. Anyone who was born with magic power would have to go to someone who knew how to use it (presumably a creature) to have it trained. So not only would they be instilled with ethics of magic use (which probably included "don't overthrow the establishment") but they'd become a known factor that those in charge could keep an eye on.

Jyrras' technology upsets that. It can be used by pretty much anyone, with a minimum of training. In the proper forms, that technology could make anyone and everyone suddenly capable of harming or killing creatures, presenting a clear threat to the established order. The creature council recognizes the potential for that danger, and so they have plans to deal with Jyrras.

To illustrate my point, a piece of our own history. Crossbows, and later guns, were considered unfair by the Catholic church, and reportedly banned, because they made a peasant with a week of training capable of killing an armored knight who had spent his entire life learning his trade. Such weapons can seriously upset the balance of power, and while the creatures don't KNOW that Jyrras has weapons, they clearly do know that inventions aren't made in a vacuum. To make the things he's made, Jyrras must understand certain principles and physical laws that would allow him to make things that ARE dangerous, and the creatures know it.

[Titanium Dragon]

I'm wondering what "that final one" she's refering to is....  I'm guessing some sort of wepon he'll build in the future. Though the question remains, since the bangles  do nothing but basically say"DO NOT TOUCH" why should the creature council be less afraid of consequences if they touch him without them? Is 2 Fae pissed at them that much different then 1 (Namely Mab)

Well, the real question is, can Mab actually do something about it?

Fae are apparently extremely powerful, but lest we forget, they self-impose limitations on themselves. Mab may be able to resolve the situation, but in her current "role", she may well "not" be able to destroy everyone who pursues her friends. Or, alternatively, the fae may not have truly limitless power, and enough angry creatures could overwhelm them. In particular, the dragons seem to be special in some way as well (as they, along with fae, were said to only be allowed to be there because the world just wasn't all that important) and might be a real problem. Albanion himself is fairly important, however, and it is worth noting there are at least rumors that Albanion is a bit of a nutter in that regard and may be a fae creatures are loath to annoy.

Or its possible Mab hasn't even thought about it. Mab's plans don't always seem to be all that well thought out.

Several threads, I'd say.  I'm kind of curious as to who Mab's five friends are specifically.  If Fa'Lina is one of those, even Dan being in SAIA might not be enough to protect him.

Well, I'm assuming they're Dan, Wildy, Lorenda, and Alexi, but I guess it could be some other people.

I might be being slow here, but does anyone know why the Council would put pressure on Jyrrus? So far, all I know is that the stuff he makes lacks magic, and that's as far as it goes. The question I have is why on earth the council would even bother putting pressure on Jyrrus if all he's actually making in majority (minus secret projects) are stuff like household blenders or dishwashers.

A few reasons.

1) Creatures feel themselves to be superior to beings. Beings being as strong as creatures threatens that superiority.

2) The culture of power that creatures have; if anyone can pick up a gun and become stronger, then that messes up the entire structure of many of their societies.

3) They fear that which they do not understand.

Actually, the big thing I'm wondering about the creature council is how they can actually work as a cohesive force. As I understand it, creatures are generally solitary creatures with large, fragile egos and excessively care about power. The thing is, if they're all made up of large fragile egos (and have some sort of political power over other creatures.), wouldn't they be too busy with infighting and otherwise stabbing each other in the back to pose as a unified threat to... well, anyone. Granted, they may be individually powerful, and may have their fair share of political sway as far as their creatures go, but I can't imagine them acting in unison in an attempt to keep what is seen as the weakest race on furrae down, if anything, they would be turning their attention towards trying to one-up each other, since reasonably the other council members would be a bigger threat.

Are all creatures so individualistic, though? The incubi, for instance, have their clans, which are apparently fairly important to them, and other societies may have other structures. Some of the creatures (for instance, the bug-people and the mers) appear to live in complete organized societies of their own, and all the phoenix oracles seem to be in one group as well. It may just be that only a few of the creatures are so factionalized, and they're the ones we see because they stir up the most trouble and/or are the most likely to be out on their own in society.

[Psy-Kosh]

I might be being slow here, but does anyone know why the Council would put pressure on Jyrrus? So far, all I know is that the stuff he makes lacks magic, and that's as far as it goes. The question I have is why on earth the council would even bother putting pressure on Jyrrus if all he's actually making in majority (minus secret projects) are stuff like household blenders or dishwashers.

Actually, IIRC, the very lack of magic is what has them worried. That what used to require magic is now being done without magic... and those methods are advancing. But also, we do know that Jyrras has developed magic based tech too. I mean, think of the patches. He's managed to mass produce magic without even having any innate magic.

I once again put forward the proposition that Jyrras is potentially really really scary.

[Jairus]

I might be being slow here, but does anyone know why the Council would put pressure on Jyrrus? So far, all I know is that the stuff he makes lacks magic, and that's as far as it goes. The question I have is why on earth the council would even bother putting pressure on Jyrrus if all he's actually making in majority (minus secret projects) are stuff like household blenders or dishwashers.

Actually, IIRC, the very lack of magic is what has them worried. That what used to require magic is now being done without magic... and those methods are advancing. But also, we do know that Jyrras has developed magic based tech too. I mean, think of the patches. He's managed to mass produce magic without even having any innate magic.

I once again put forward the proposition that Jyrras is potentially really really scary.

I believe the trope is "Beware the Nice Ones." Alternatively, "Crouching Scholar, Hidden Badass." Jyrras is arguably one of the most dangerous entities on the planet. In the fields of magic and science, he understands and is capable of using both to advance both fields to levels others cannot (the patches, again). That makes him a very dangerous piece in the game, and with a little work he might become one of the players. I'm not going to finish this extended analogy with another metaphor.

[Psy-Kosh]

I believe the trope is "Beware the Nice Ones." Alternatively, "Crouching Scholar, Hidden Badass." Jyrras is arguably one of the most dangerous entities on the planet. In the fields of magic and science, he understands and is capable of using both to advance both fields to levels others cannot (the patches, again). That makes him a very dangerous piece in the game, and with a little work he might become one of the players. I'm not going to finish this extended analogy with another metaphor.

I'd say he's already a player. I mean, he's head of a major corporation, and _EXTREMELY_ rich, and that itself is enough to give him lots of influence. Combined with the rest, well...

And what's the metaphor you were thinking of, hrmmm?

[Jairus]

I believe the trope is "Beware the Nice Ones." Alternatively, "Crouching Scholar, Hidden Badass." Jyrras is arguably one of the most dangerous entities on the planet. In the fields of magic and science, he understands and is capable of using both to advance both fields to levels others cannot (the patches, again). That makes him a very dangerous piece in the game, and with a little work he might become one of the players. I'm not going to finish this extended analogy with another metaphor.

I'd say he's already a player. I mean, he's head of a major corporation, and _EXTREMELY_ rich, and that itself is enough to give him lots of influence. Combined with the rest, well...

And what's the metaphor you were thinking of, hrmmm?

Pawn. He can become a player in the game instead of a pawn.

Wait a minute... supergenius? Head of a company? Freaking rich? Oh great, Jyrras is this world's Tony Stark. "I AM IRON RAT!"

[Lucheek]

Wait a minute... supergenius? Head of a company? Freaking rich? Oh great, Jyrras is this world's Tony Stark. "I AM IRON RAT!"

Check out the colors on hisrobotic super suit

[bradley535]

I just realized. Jyras's "final one" can't be an Armageddon device (or other such malicious thing). He's already invented that one... She even named herself appropriately.

[Psy-Kosh]

Wait a minute... supergenius? Head of a company? Freaking rich? Oh great, Jyrras is this world's Tony Stark. "I AM IRON RAT!"

Given the size of his mechs, wouldn't it be "I AM IRON EARZILLA"?

[bradley535]

Regarding Albanion's comment about statues, it may be that he is simply saying that there is no way to completely protect her friends and still let them live their lives.

You, sir, are a frickin' genius. That has to be one of the most intelligent insights I've seen here... Good call.

[Indy]

The friends are probably Dan, Wildy, Alexsi and Merlitz. Mab's on comfortable terms with Lorenda, but they've only known each other for six months, if that.


As for the final weapon: Considering that DMFA is supposedly about the conflict that arises when fantasy (creatures) and reality (beings/humans) collide, wouldn't the final weapon be an atomic bomb? I think we can all agree that a weapon capable of leveling cities and rendering an entire countryside uninhabitable for decades on end is not only humankind's greatest military achievement, but would also stop any Creature Council investigation of Jyrras. If he got a chance to prove it worked, that is.

[TheJimTimMan]

As for the final weapon: Considering that DMFA is supposedly about the conflict that arises when fantasy (creatures) and reality (beings/humans) collide, wouldn't the final weapon be an atomic bomb? I think we can all agree that a weapon capable of leveling cities and rendering an entire countryside uninhabitable for decades on end is not only humankind's greatest military achievement, but would also stop any Creature Council investigation of Jyrras. If he got a chance to prove it worked, that is.

Jyrras probably has some nukes gathering dust somewhere already. Remember he can build gryphon mechs, I think it's safe to assume he's worked out fusion reactors or some other such advanced power source. If Jyrras builds doomsday weapons I wouldn't be surprised if they could reach Class X on the Apocalyse How scale (Planet Busters, basically), since he is rather adept at combining magic and technology as already mentioned.

[Arapaima]

Less impressive than the gryphon mechs would be the metallurgy involved in actually allowing machines that big to work, move, etc. But aside from that Jyrras is what, twenty-something? He's incredibly young and has already achieved in his life what takes people lifetimes or more to accomplish. If anything he's dangerous for the insane rate at which he learns and develops.


edit) He's 21: http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_631.php

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Less impressive than the gryphon mechs would be the metallurgy involved in actually allowing machines that big to work, move, etc. But aside from that Jyrras is what, twenty-something? He's incredibly young and has already achieved in his life what takes people lifetimes or more to accomplish. If anything he's dangerous for the insane rate at which he learns and develops.


edit) He's 21: http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_631.php

Yes.

[Naldru]

With regard to Beware the Nice Ones, you have a number of nice people who could probably be extremely destructive if pushed too far.  I believe that Dan counts as nice, but he once destroyed a room of Deathknights with a spork.  Jyrras with his giant mechas and farming and mining equipment.  I also suspect that Pyroduck could be a very scary opponent.  And let's not forget what happens when Aliyka loses her temper.

I believe that it was in Terry Pratchett's Sourcery that one of the characters remarked that he was so powerful that it was like living in a world made of eggshells.  That would certainly apply to the Fae.  Mab can easily stop any fight.  The problem is ending a fight without ending everything.

While looking at TV Tropes, I also spotted Good is Not Nice.  Some of the attributes listed for this type are loner, his morals get in the way of ignoring people, he had problems with his father, develops a Jerkass Facade to cover his true feelings, and repulses attempts to be friendly with him.  I'm surprised I didn't see a picture of Abel.

[MT Hazard]

If this keeps up we'll have a goth/emo Mab in the comic again.

[Caswin]

Well, if I'm not mistaken, this is a new side of Mab.  Or, at least, new eyes.  I like those eyes.  Have I mentioned I like where the plot is going?

I wonder (not having read the rest of the topic) exactly what Mab means.  What kind of pressure?  How would Jyrras "react"?  And wouldn't Jyrras going public with his weapons (or on a one-roo-rat rampage) be exactly what the Creature Council is afraid of?

Actually, as far as reactions to pressure by the Powers That Be goes... just how big is JyCorp, anyway?

[techmaster-glitch]

I wonder (not having read the rest of the topic) exactly what Mab means.  What kind of pressure?  How would Jyrras "react"?  And wouldn't Jyrras going public with his weapons (or on a one-roo-rat rampage) be exactly what the Creature Council is afraid of?

In a nutshell, it is inferred that the Creature Council doesn't like the ideas of Jyrras' technology. If word ever gets out that he has built these weapons, the rammifications will not be lost on the Creature Council; suddenly, you have nonmagical beings weilding weapons powerful enough to bring down established magical Creatures. They won't like that, and it appears Mab is afraid they might try to stop Jyrras from producing any more. She is also afraid that if that happens, the exact opposite effect that the Council wants will occur; Jyrras will either mass-produce and distribute the weapons, or turn them agains the Creatures himself. And if -that- happens, the Creatures will react will all the force that they possess and, Mab is afraid (and Albanion is reinforcing) that they will destroy Jyrras and all other friends.

[ishidan]

Wait a minute... supergenius? Head of a company? Freaking rich? Oh great, Jyrras is this world's Tony Stark. "I AM IRON RAT!"

Check out the colors on hisrobotic super suit

Heh.  You couldn't choose the comic where he makes his Dramatic Entrance in the GryphonMech?  http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_401.php
So yeah, either that or he's this dimension's Bruce Wayne.
"What are you dense?  Are you retarded or something?  Who the hell do you think I am?  I'm the g******n KangarooRatman."

[Jairus]

Wait a minute... supergenius? Head of a company? Freaking rich? Oh great, Jyrras is this world's Tony Stark. "I AM IRON RAT!"

Check out the colors on hisrobotic super suit

Heh.  You couldn't choose the comic where he makes his Dramatic Entrance in the GryphonMech?  http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_401.php
So yeah, either that or he's this dimension's Bruce Wayne.
"What are you dense?  Are you retarded or something?  Who the hell do you think I am?  I'm the g******n KangarooRatman."

Then again, given the colors on his most recent unit, he might not quite be an Iron Man. Blue and silver... I know I've seen those colors before on some superhero.

And unlike Tony Stark, I doubt that Jyrras drinks much. For some reason, I have the feeling that Jy-squeak can't hold his alcohol very well, but I don't know why I have that thought.

[Caswin]

Ah, I see, thanks.  Should've read closer.  Especially that bit about "that final one", that confused me.

They won't like that, and it appears Mab is afraid they might try to stop Jyrras from producing any more.

This is the part that I was really thinking about.  How does a shadowy cabal go about leaning on a multibillion-dollar company?

[Jairus]

Ah, I see, thanks.  Should've read closer.  Especially that bit about "that final one", that confused me.

They won't like that, and it appears Mab is afraid they might try to stop Jyrras from producing any more.

This is the part that I was really thinking about.  How does a shadowy cabal go about leaning on a multibillion-dollar company?

Well, to be fair, they are centuries-old extremely powerful magical beings who probably have agents of their own, and he is a 21 year old gay kangaroo rat with no magical powers whose only physical ability is the ability to outrun all of them on the ground. I can see a few ways they could lean on him, or at least think that they could...

[demecowen]

Ah, I see, thanks.  Should've read closer.  Especially that bit about "that final one", that confused me.

They won't like that, and it appears Mab is afraid they might try to stop Jyrras from producing any more.

This is the part that I was really thinking about.  How does a shadowy cabal go about leaning on a multibillion-dollar company?

1. There is also the factor of Jyrras family, his mother maybe ok, but the shadow cabal can threaten Jyrras' sisters and Jyrras might fold like wet noodle.

2. They produce negative campaign ads of Jyrras that can ruin his image and company name forcing him to go out of business.


I am curious say what final invention is I doubt is a doomday weapon, but a powersorce that will give all beings the power to fight the creatures.

[ishidan]

Blue and silver... I know I've seen those colors before on some superhero.

And unlike Tony Stark, I doubt that Jyrras drinks much. For some reason, I have the feeling that Jy-squeak can't hold his alcohol very well, but I don't know why I have that thought.

Not 'latest' if Deebs followed instructions and got rid of it to start over.
No, it's when Jy barely comes up to the top of the sole-pad on a machine painted purple and blue...

[Jairus]

Ah, I see, thanks.  Should've read closer.  Especially that bit about "that final one", that confused me.

They won't like that, and it appears Mab is afraid they might try to stop Jyrras from producing any more.

This is the part that I was really thinking about.  How does a shadowy cabal go about leaning on a multibillion-dollar company?

1. There is also the factor of Jyrras family, his mother maybe ok, but the shadow cabal can threaten Jyrras' sisters and Jyrras might fold like wet noodle.

2. They produce negative campaign ads of Jyrras that can ruin his image and company name forcing him to go out of business.


I am curious say what final invention is I doubt is a doomday weapon, but a powersorce that will give all beings the power to fight the creatures.

Towards number one, I think that if you threaten Jy's sisters, two things are gonna happen: Jy's probably gonna get pissed off and kill you (they may be overbearing and smothering, but they are his sisters), and Moira's gonna come after you. As for number two, not only does that not sound like something that creatures would do, but Moira - again - would be after you. And, eurgh. I dunno if I like the power source idea. I mean, I can see it being workable, but I think that whatever Jyrras builds is more metaphysical in nature of its effect. Something outwardly simple, but it has absolutely enormous ramifications on the future of Furrae. It might have something to do with magic, rather than technology: he was studying magic, after all, and that's what created Deebs, and we know he understands how to create what is in essence a computer controlled shapeshifting spell. Then again, his pure technology is still a key part of it... hm.

Blue and silver... I know I've seen those colors before on some superhero.

And unlike Tony Stark, I doubt that Jyrras drinks much. For some reason, I have the feeling that Jy-squeak can't hold his alcohol very well, but I don't know why I have that thought.

Not 'latest' if Deebs followed instructions and got rid of it to start over.
No, it's when Jy barely comes up to the top of the sole-pad on a machine painted purple and blue...

Ah, right. Then again, since we haven't seen the new one, that's what we've got to go on in terms of most recent color choices on Jy's part.

[Psaakyrn]

Actually, the final one may not be a weapon at all. Just a side thought that it may be related to creature creation...