Cybernations

[Tezkat]

So... who all is up for the buyings? Darkdragon kinda put himself out of the running with the early stimulus packages, unless we want to wait until next week to start. (Which is possible... I could even take the opportunity to drop some free aids on them to build up infra and such before we start trading.)

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

I'm in for buying.

[James StarRunner]

Ok, 1.5 mil sent to Ink and Drath, compliments of llearch (via me and my extra aid slots).

[Darkdragon]

So... who all is up for the buyings? Darkdragon kinda put himself out of the running with the early stimulus packages, unless we want to wait until next week to start. (Which is possible... I could even take the opportunity to drop some free aids on them to build up infra and such before we start trading.)

I'll be busy for the next few weeks anyways.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Given nobody else was organising things, I've had Ink and Drath throw me 50 tech each.

We can get things sorted later, yes, no? Something like that.

[Tezkat]

Well... you could have organized things, no?   Anyways, since both you and Darkdragon are now out of cycle, I'll just toss in some monies of my own. It might be a good idea for the newbies to pick up a foreign ministry early to help the aids flow faster.

We can begin a proper 3x3 on the 21st. Who wants to go first?

[James StarRunner]

Oh... Didn't I say it already? I'm up for buying tech.

[Magic]

Tez: Zero aid slots, if I accept the 3 million now. Is that an actual aid package or a tech trade too?

[Tezkat]

Hmm... it looks like we'll have more than 3 buyers. So who all is buying? So far we have...

Tezkat
llearch
Darkdragon
James

If all the sellers can get a foreign minstry by the 21st, we'll have room for a 3x3 and maybe some kind of 2x3 on the side.

Tez: Zero aid slots, if I accept the 3 million now. Is that an actual aid package or a tech trade too?

We have to wait 10 days before any of you can do more tech trading, so I guess it's free money. You can safely use most of it on regular infra development and such.

[Mao]

I would suggest holding off doing any more foreign aid just now so we can clear up people's aid slots to make organizing this easier.

[Tezkat]

Most of them don't actually have aid slots left anyway. I just tossed out some cash because my slots will clear at the same time llearch's do.



There are a couple of ways we could handle more than 3 buyers...

For instance, with 5 buyers, we could do a 5x3 where we have $6 million down and 150 tech up per round.

B1 $3 mil to each seller
B2 $3 mil to each seller
B3 50 tech from each seller
B4 50 tech from each seller
B5 50 tech from each seller

And just rotate through that on a 50 day cycle. The tech's more expensive that way, but obviously the newbies would get faster boostage. It might also be a little easier to organize.

We could do it as we've done before, where we have a 3x3 running and what are effectively multiple 1x1s on the side (where $3 mil goes down on the first round and is paid back in 50 tech increments over the next two).

Or we could use a few middlemen for secondary trades.

Or we could engage in some logistical gymnastics and try to combine multiple types.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

I'm happy for easier organisation.

You might also want to plan for how it falls down when someone fails to send tech for a week, since we had that issue last time and it made for a fair mess...

Come up with a plan, and we'll start following it. Yes? Good. Good organisation there. ;-]

[Tezkat]

Well, I need a complete list of buyers first. Last call...


Contingency plans... hmm...

If the seller is only a day or two late, we could probably push the entire cycle back a day or two. Realistically, it might be tough to get all those transactions done in one day anyway, since the buyers have to be online to accept before the next package can be sent. Otherwise, sellers would have buy 100 tech at once and soak the difference (a full 150 at once wouldn't be worth it at all).

If it's like a week late, then it should probably count for the next cycle. I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it, won't we?

[Kasarn]

Unless things have changed, if you have 50 tech on hand, you can send out as many lots of 50 tech as you like. We just never cared about it before.

In any case, I'm going to bed.

[Keleth]

I've been trying to follow this organization thing. And I've come to terms with something X3


I cannot do paperwork/organization for -squat- XD

I can shoot things, single-mindedly do something until it's awesome.

But I can't do . .the paperwork thingies X3

So I have Iron and Wine, and can sell tech, since I'm not really planning on doing much with tech in general.

So!

Just. . uh. . tell me where to put the things with the money and I'll do whatever it is works 

[Tezkat]

Unless things have changed, if you have 50 tech on hand, you can send out as many lots of 50 tech as you like. We just never cared about it before.

Really? That's good to know. It would certainly keep us all on a 10 day cycle and probably make things a bit easier for the sellers. Unfortunately, that kinda puts the onus on the buyers to only accept tech when it's available. I'm sure we're smart enough to figure that out, though.

Maybe we should test that somehow...

I've been trying to follow this organization thing. And I've come to terms with something X3


I cannot do paperwork/organization for -squat- XD

I can shoot things, single-mindedly do something until it's awesome.

But I can't do . .the paperwork thingies X3

So I have Iron and Wine, and can sell tech, since I'm not really planning on doing much with tech in general.

So!

Just. . uh. . tell me where to put the things with the money and I'll do whatever it is works 

Heh. That's cool. The paperwork will mostly be handled by the higherups. Once we know who all is onboard, I'm going to create a new tech trading thread similar to the old one.

Every 10 days (that's how long it takes foreign aid shipments to expire), something more or less like this will happen:

Two of us will send you $3 million in aid apiece.
You use that money to raise tech to 50.
You send out 50 tech aid packages to each of the three designated recipients.
The first accepts.
You buy another 50 tech.
The second accepts.
You buy another 50 tech.
The third accepts.
You should have a bit over $2 million left over, depending on trades and improvements.

Actually, since you know you'll have $2 million left over, you can spend it at the beginning of the cycle, if you prefer. If you don't already have a foreign ministry by then, you'll have to build enough infra to buy that first. The rest of the spending is up to you. Basically, spend it on infra, infra, and more infra. Grab new improvements (as per the guide) whenever you have enough pop. Keep up with the minimum land and soldier requirements.

You'll probably want to maintain a bit of tech (maybe 24.5, if not the full 50) while waiting for a new round to start. It's also a good idea to keep some cash in the kitty for emergencies, since all of your aid slots will be permanently full.

[Kasarn]

Maybe we should test that somehow...

I just offered tech to both Shadrok and James StarRunner (and then cancelled them both; hi guys!). As far as I can see, it works.

[Shadrok]

Maybe we should test that somehow...

I just offered tech to both Shadrok and James StarRunner (and then cancelled them both; hi guys!). As far as I can see, it works.

Hmm... I was wondering what that was about. Kind of thought you had clicked the wrong nation when I saw it canceled.

[Tezkat]

So... the first round of tech trading should start on Sunday. Only four buyers have expressed interest so far. Should I plan for a 4x3? Or does someone else want to get in on the action?

[Darkdragon]

Just so you know, I will be a bit busy almost all of Sunday, and perhaps some of Monday.

[Kasarn]

Just thought I'd note that the ghost is in war mode.

[Keleth]

Buy my tech!

Buy my tech!

You don't get any classier than a 4x4

[Tezkat]

You're already on the list, Drathorin.

Anways... new tech trading thread is up.


Not sure what to do about the ghost. Certainly, we'll be out of range to hit him as soon as the first wave of tech money arrives.

[Shadrok]

Just posting a heads up that I won't be online for a little while (apart from the needed once and a while to keep Tanagra active of course). Basically I have some things I need to take care. Nothing too serious, just things that keep getting put on hold due to me getting distracted with the internet.


*Edit*

and I'm back.

[Kasarn]

Two years ago, DMFA's alliance score was 23.43!
Then the new score was implemented and it dropped to 0.26

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

... and now it's 0.95

Oh, how the mighty have fallen. ;-]

[Keleth]

I'm curious as to what the 'critical mass' of a tech trader usually ends up being.

Even with my foreign aid slot open, it almost seems with 1.5k infra, that the 3 million doesn't go very far. With keeping my tech at 15 between rounds, am I gimping how my nation grows?

[Kasarn]

You stop selling tech whenever you're ready to start buying tech, which is usually around 2.5-3k infra.
Sitting at 15 tech instead of 50 tech will cost you 1 happiness.

Also, you should buy tech in this order: 0/4.5/14.5/24.5/29.5/39.5/49.5/50. Not buying in that order will cost you 10-50k per 50 tech.

Then, you have no tech discounts.
At 3m for 150 tech:
No discount = ~2.5m and 500k profit
Microchips = ~2.2m and 800k profit
MC+2 Unis = ~1.8m and 1.2m profit
Microchips is Gold, Lead and Oil. You should drop Furs and get Gold.

Finally, switch your government type to Capitalist, Democracy, Monarchy, Republic or Revolutionary. If your people want something else, ignore them.

[Tezkat]

The 3 million you're receiving now shouldn't be going that far. Remember that I designed the current system for heavy frontloading of aid. The $12 million you got in the first two weeks was mostly profit for you to plow into early nation development. The $3 million per round now should be just enough to cover costs with a little bit left over.

Normal tech trading will net you over $1 million profit per round per customer, which is pretty respectable. (You can hit almost  $2 million per round with the right build.) It's not uncommon these days for new members of established alliances to continue selling tech until 4k infra. That's a bit arbitrary, though.

Basically, at some point (usually around 3-4k infra), it's expected that you to be able to carry your weight in wartime, which means pumping your tech up to 500+ for planes and such.

[Magic]

Moon & Mars Wonders - The Moon and Mars wonders are such unique wonders that they deserve their own section in order to provide a full description on how the wonders work. High level nations with a Space Program and the required funds can purchase either a Moon Base or a Mars Base. Once a nation builds a Moon Base or any other Moon facilities they will be unable to build facilities on Mars and vice versa so choose your destination wisely. Once a Moon Base or a Mars Base is purchased you will see a new Moon or Mars icon appear beside your nation name on your nation display page. Clicking this icon will take you to the Moon or Mars map where you can view and operate your Moon or Mars facilities. One of the key concepts behind the Moon and Mars wonders is that of a position on the Moon and Mars that provides premium solar and resource utilization known as a hidden hotspot that affects the effectiveness of Moon or Mars facilities in the game. The closer in miles that a facility is to the hotspot the more effective that wonder becomes for your nation up to a maximum of 100% and a minimum of 50%. Players can relocate any of their Moon or Mars facilities once every 7 days at a price of (Nation Strength * 10). The Moon and Mars hotspots randomly change once every 30 days.

WONDERS:

# Mars Base - Coming Soon - Reduces infrastructure cost and bills -3%. Provides a gradually increasing happiness bonus that peaks at +6 happiness at the end of the life of the wonder. Expires at 1,200 days. Cannot build Moon wonders if you build Mars wonders. Requires Space Program.
# Mars Mine - Coming Soon  - Provides access to a randomly selected resource of Basalt, Sodium, Magnesium, or Potassium. Provides a gradually increasing happiness bonus that peaks at +4 happiness at the end of the life of the wonder. Expires at 900 days. Relocating your Mars Mine gives you the option to randomly select a new Mars resource for a fee. Cannot build Moon wonders if you build Mars wonders. Requires Space Program and Mars Base.
# Mars Colony - Coming Soon  - Stores 6% of citizen count at time of purchase. Provides a gradually increasing happiness bonus that peaks at +4 happiness at the end of the life of the wonder. Expires at 900 days. Relocating your Mars Colony gives you the option to reset the stored citizen count based on your current citizen population for a fee. Cannot build Moon wonders if you build Mars wonders. Requires Space Program and Mars Base.
# Moon Base - Coming Soon - Reduces infrastructure cost and bills -4%. Provides +5 happiness that degrades over the life of the wonder. Expires at 600 days. Cannot build Mars wonders if you build Moon wonders. Requires Space Program.
# Moon Mine - Coming Soon - Increases population income by $3.00 for the resources Furs, Rubber, Lead & Gold that your nation has access to. Provides +3 happiness that degrades over the life of the wonder. Expires at 300 days. Cannot build Mars wonders if you build Moon wonders. Requires Space Program and Moon Base.
# Moon Colony - Coming Soon - Stores 8% of citizen count at time of purchase. Provides +3 happiness that degrades over the life of the wonder. Expires at 300 days. Relocating your Moon Colony gives you the option to reset the stored citizen count based on your current citizen population for a fee. Cannot build Mars wonders if you build Moon wonders. Requires Space Program and Moon Base.

BONUS RESOURCES:

# Basalt - Mined from Martian surface. +3 happiness if nation has Automobiles, –5% infra upkeep if nation has Asphalt, –5% infra purchase cost if nation has Construction.
# Magnesium - Mined from Martian surface. +3 happiness if nation has Microchips, –4% infra upkeep if nation has Steel.
# Potassium - Mined from Martian surface. +3 happiness if nation has Fine Jewelry, +$3 citizen income if nation has Scholars, +5% more citizens if nation has Affluent Population.
# Sodium - Mined from Martian surface. +2 happiness if nation has Fast Food, +2 happiness if nation has Beer, Decreases GRL by an additional 50% (75% total) if you have Radiation Cleanup.