11/05/2010 [AS2 #101] Abel Smackdown

[Keleth]

A bit of rationalizing on the huge load of Abel-hate in comic and on these forums.  Abel has been implied to be rather intelligent and talented previously, which he's done nothing but squander.  It's even worse for the Cubi in-universe since Abel has two extremely rare traits that almost scream 'Uber-Cubi' to those in the know.  

Imagine if you will someone born with all the bests gifts and talents of Ernest Hemingway, Nikola Tesla, and Alexander the Great... now imagine all that person does is sit around playing WoW all day.

Wouldn't you wanna strangle that person just a little?

It depends, at least the wow player is having fun doing what they're doing.

Abel isn't even having that.

[Les]

A bit of rationalizing on the huge load of Abel-hate in comic and on these forums.  Abel has been implied to be rather intelligent and talented previously, which he's done nothing but squander.  It's even worse for the Cubi in-universe since Abel has two extremely rare traits that almost scream 'Uber-Cubi' to those in the know.  

Imagine if you will someone born with all the bests gifts and talents of Ernest Hemingway, Nikola Tesla, and Alexander the Great... now imagine all that person does is sit around playing WoW all day.

Wouldn't you wanna strangle that person just a little?

It depends, at least the wow player is having fun doing what they're doing.

Abel isn't even having that.

You haven't played much WoW have you?   

[Keleth]

A bit of rationalizing on the huge load of Abel-hate in comic and on these forums.  Abel has been implied to be rather intelligent and talented previously, which he's done nothing but squander.  It's even worse for the Cubi in-universe since Abel has two extremely rare traits that almost scream 'Uber-Cubi' to those in the know.  

Imagine if you will someone born with all the bests gifts and talents of Ernest Hemingway, Nikola Tesla, and Alexander the Great... now imagine all that person does is sit around playing WoW all day.

Wouldn't you wanna strangle that person just a little?

It depends, at least the wow player is having fun doing what they're doing.

Abel isn't even having that.

You haven't played much WoW have you?   

Playing Since Beta.

[AGE00]

A bit of rationalizing on the huge load of Abel-hate in comic and on these forums.  Abel has been implied to be rather intelligent and talented previously, which he's done nothing but squander.  It's even worse for the Cubi in-universe since Abel has two extremely rare traits that almost scream 'Uber-Cubi' to those in the know. 

Imagine if you will someone born with all the bests gifts and talents of Ernest Hemingway, Nikola Tesla, and Alexander the Great... now imagine all that person does is sit around playing WoW all day.

Wouldn't you wanna strangle that person just a little?

No. But, the way you explain it, I can understand how someone might.

The thing is, the examples you give are rather telling. One went insane and killed himself, one was naturally insane and was ruthlessly exploited by his competitor, and one was a violent dictator. They all led unhappy lives, and one of them spent most of his life making sure everyone else got a share of the misery. Sitting around and playing WoW all day is probably a best case scenario for the kind of person you describe.

[Scarydragon]

The thing is, the examples you give are rather telling. One went insane and killed himself, one was naturally insane and was ruthlessly exploited by his competitor, and one was a violent dictator. They all led unhappy lives, and one of them spent most of his life making sure everyone else got a share of the misery. Sitting around and playing WoW all day is probably a best case scenario for the kind of person you describe.

I'm thinking Les meant to focus on the talented side of these people, not the obvious downfalls. You can invalidate anyone's point of view by just focusing on the bad.

[Congo Jack]

I had to re-read this page a few times... then get my friend to read it as well and tell me that no, my brain wasn't making it up.

I had to re-read this page a few times myself. And it made my worry about not seeing anything special where someone obviously does, as a possible signs of mental retardation.

This thread is fascinating. I mean, she teaches torture. That's pretty unambiguous. If we were dealing with a big, fat guy, the only ones on his side would be the ones playing Devils Advocate. Dress a hot chick up in leather, though, and she could be the Dean of Slavery & Holocaust Denial for all anyone cares.

Funnily enough, even then i would support him, just out of the lack of taste for what abel is doing, although then the whole plot segment of becoming a loving mother would not work, and aniz would have to be female ...... meh
Not to mention i do not find her exceptionally hot anyway , especially not in a leather suit.

See, I can't help but question your objectivity here. How does siding with a known sadist and murderer over a guy who only wants to be left alone make sense from any dispassionate stand-point?

Noone can be objective here, because we know how they ended. Since they both turned out well, we can't help, but approve their actions in the past. Justifying means by the ends isn't good either, but honestly, if you suddently learn that your granddad was a moonshiner and your grandma beat him regulary for that when they were younger, would it change your opinion of them much, provided you see them often and know as nice people?

As for fat guy/hot chick, aside from obviuos pointing by the author, who you should like, fatness isn't just visual pecularity, but evidence of lacking self-control and/or a clue. (do as I say! To become like you? No, thanks.) Beauty isn't a "gift" either, but result of drastic self-discipline and wide erudition on subject. (If she made herself that, she probably knows what she doing.)

The thing is, the examples you give are rather telling. One went insane and killed himself, one was naturally insane and was ruthlessly exploited by his competitor, and one was a violent dictator. They all led unhappy lives, and one of them spent most of his life making sure everyone else got a share of the misery. Sitting around and playing WoW all day is probably a best case scenario for the kind of person you describe.

I'm thinking Les meant to focus on the talented side of these people, not the obvious downfalls. You can invalidate anyone's point of view by just focusing on the bad.

No, he's right. You should make sure that one become good person first, develop talent second. World won't come to an end if new Teslas stop inventing new types of iPod, progress don't make people happy by itself, but you sure can imagine what will happen if someone talented as Alexander the Great chose the wrong side.

[Les]

Playing Since Beta.

Then you know WoW is the most popular game everybody hates.   

Personal experience, it Can become like a second job sometimes.   

[A. Lurker]

And the bits about her possibly redirecting her anger at Aniz (an idea I think is possible) and her later giving Abel lessons have been brought up.  I wonder how much longer before he starts taking lessons from her?  The fact that she's probably just beating him and no one will intervene has been mentioned.  It's possible she'll soon find out about his blood-phobia and some thoughts will come based off of it.  That or she doesn't and Abel's the one that comes to her for lessons.  I wonder which way it was?

It strikes me as entirely possible that to Destania, especially in hindsight and given her stated specialty, "he was one of my students" and "oh, yeah, I taught that little jerk a lesson or three in my day!" aren't all that distinct from each other...

[AGE00]

This thread is fascinating. I mean, she teaches torture. That's pretty unambiguous. If we were dealing with a big, fat guy, the only ones on his side would be the ones playing Devils Advocate. Dress a hot chick up in leather, though, and she could be the Dean of Slavery & Holocaust Denial for all anyone cares.

Funnily enough, even then i would support him, just out of the lack of taste for what abel is doing, although then the whole plot segment of becoming a loving mother would not work, and aniz would have to be female ...... meh
Not to mention i do not find her exceptionally hot anyway , especially not in a leather suit.

See, I can't help but question your objectivity here. How does siding with a known sadist and murderer over a guy who only wants to be left alone make sense from any dispassionate stand-point?

Noone can be objective here, because we know how they ended. Since they both turned out well, we can't help, but approve their actions in the past. Justifying means by the ends isn't good either, but honestly, if you suddently learn that your granddad was a moonshiner and your grandma beat him regulary for that when they were younger, would it change your opinion of them much, provided you see them often and know as nice people?

As for fat guy/hot chick, aside from obviuos pointing by the author, who you should like, fatness isn't just visual pecularity, but evidence of lacking self-control and/or a clue. (do as I say! To become like you? No, thanks.) Beauty isn't a "gift" either, but result of drastic self-discipline and wide erudition on subject. (If she made herself that, she probably knows what she doing.)

"Turned out well"? She's a bad guy! She's trying to commit genocide! I think that's a slightly stronger indicator of moral character than the fact that she has pretty hair. And, seriously? She's not all that. I can think of about five characters who make for better looking females in DMFA off the top of my head, and two of those are guys.

The thing is, the examples you give are rather telling. One went insane and killed himself, one was naturally insane and was ruthlessly exploited by his competitor, and one was a violent dictator. They all led unhappy lives, and one of them spent most of his life making sure everyone else got a share of the misery. Sitting around and playing WoW all day is probably a best case scenario for the kind of person you describe.

I'm thinking Les meant to focus on the talented side of these people, not the obvious downfalls. You can invalidate anyone's point of view by just focusing on the bad.

In all honesty,  I'm not trying to invalidate their point of view. In fact, in this specific instance, it was a good point that helped me to see the matter from another perspective. All I meant to say was that "great" people rarely live happy lives, and that I would never blame anyone for seeking to pursue their own peace of mind instead of some vague notion of the "greater good", especially when doing so harms no-one else.

[Mao]

Between the fact that this is becoming less about the comic and more about "Is Destania an evil psycho?" and the tone that some folks are taking with one another I've got only one suggestion:

Stay classy, thread.

[Turnsky]

y'know, i bet folks are starting to run a pool on where this thread will end up...

[Congo Jack]

She's a bad guy! She's trying to commit genocide!

Every dragon wants her dead and she's the bad guy because she's trying to fight back?
She didn't even kill any of them yet.

[Keleth]

y'know, i bet folks are starting to run a pool on where this thread will end up...

. . . Starting?

I already have had bets since this thread was 5 posts in.


. . .

Where do you think I make my living? 

[Sunblink]

Between the fact that this is becoming less about the comic and more about "Is Destania an evil psycho?" and the tone that some folks are taking with one another I've got only one suggestion:

Stay classy, thread.

The past few Abel's Story threads have been so full of hate.

We need to make a thread where hate isn't allowed, and people hug each other and post pictures of kittens and... yeah. Haters, don't hate.

[Keleth]

So we just give peace a chance :o


*Ques up and plays "Under Pressure" by Queen. Dances*

[Turnsky]

We need to make a thread where hate isn't allowed, and people hug each other and post pictures of kittens and... yeah. Haters, don't hate.

how about one discussing Dee's wardrobe? i mean, she is a cat... rawr. 

[joshofspam]

Did someone ask for a change in the direction that this page is going?

Well has anyone noticed that the style of clothes Abel's wearing here match the style in the current story and Abel and Dan are both wearing the same style with different colors.

It must be a way trendy style.

[Arcblade]

Between the fact that this is becoming less about the comic and more about "Is Destania an evil psycho?" and the tone that some folks are taking with one another I've got only one suggestion:

Stay classy, thread.

The past few Abel's Story threads have been so full of hate.

We need to make a thread where hate isn't allowed, and people hug each other and post pictures of kittens and... yeah. Haters, don't hate.

...sorry, I had to. 

Getting back on topic, I think Destania probably did more for Abel than beat him up every now and then, like what we see here.  Somehow, Abel learned to fight like Destania.  As talented and lucky and whatever else Abel might be, I kind of doubt he picked that up from just a few beatings. 

[Tapewolf]

I think Destania probably did more for Abel than beat him up every now and then, like what we see here.  Somehow, Abel learned to fight like Destania.  As talented and lucky and whatever else Abel might be, I kind of doubt he picked that up from just a few beatings. 

Well, if he asked her to teach him that kind of stuff after all that, it might impress her in terms of sheer guts.  Who knows...

[VAE]

The past few Abel's Story threads have been so full of hate.

We need to make a thread where hate isn't allowed, and people hug each other and post pictures of kittens and... yeah. Haters, don't hate.

Well, cubi can emotion jammer, and as far as i see, around half posters have clanmarks in the signature....
So in a brilliant turnabout, i blame Abel himself for making everyone in this thread hostile and with attitude!
Aren't me just ingenious?

"Turned out well"? She's a bad guy! She's trying to commit genocide! I think that's a slightly stronger indicator of moral character than the fact that she has pretty hair. And, seriously? She's not all that. I can think of about five characters who make for better looking females in DMFA off the top of my head, and two of those are guys.

The second part got me laughing, but no, she is not the bad guy.(much less a guy)
There is nothing wrong in particular with clearing out another species to ensure your survival - that is how nature works, and i myself can think of several real (mosquitoes, potato bug...) and fictional (borg, strogg, orcs ) species i would have no qualm of doing this to. In fact, i am really glad apparently our (great)^n grandparents genocided the neanderthal man, otherwise we wouldn't be speaking now, much less writing.
Therefore i can perfectly understand and approve her course of action - it is not like the dragons wish to do something else to the cubi, so it is only a matter of who is more sucessful at it.

In all honesty,  I'm not trying to invalidate their point of view. In fact, in this specific instance, it was a good point that helped me to see the matter from another perspective. All I meant to say was that "great" people rarely live happy lives, and that I would never blame anyone for seeking to pursue their own peace of mind instead of some vague notion of the "greater good", especially when doing so harms no-one else.

I don't think so - it harms others passively, and certain kinds of inaction are worse than certain kinds of bad action even in my opinion. Besides great people lead happy lives quite often - they find happiness in what they do (otherwise they wouldn't do it) And at least they become permanent in history, while those with peace of mind just flutter away with time...

[ANTIcarrot]

The page reminds me of something I once heard on Red vs Blue...
"Oh hell no! She's always been a rotten bitch. It's just now she has superpowers!"
Tex also being female, prone to violence, and a fan favorite.

Otherwise... I hope we move beyond mopy Abel soon. I'm still hoping to find out how exactly he got banned from the library.

[Prof B Hunnydew]

The page reminds me of something I once heard on Red vs Blue...
"Oh hell no! She's always been a rotten bitch. It's just now she has superpowers!"
Tex also being female, prone to violence, and a fan favorite.

Otherwise... I hope we move beyond mopy Abel soon. I'm still hoping to find out how exactly he got banned from the library.

What!! My ex-girlfriend is a superhero....?

And yes I would like to hear what did turn Olong from pink to dark grey-green.?  And what can turn her around?


PBH

[Anker Steadfast]

In all honesty,  I'm not trying to invalidate their point of view. In fact, in this specific instance, it was a good point that helped me to see the matter from another perspective. All I meant to say was that "great" people rarely live happy lives, and that I would never blame anyone for seeking to pursue their own peace of mind instead of some vague notion of the "greater good", especially when doing so harms no-one else.

I don't think so - it harms others passively, and certain kinds of inaction are worse than certain kinds of bad action even in my opinion. Besides great people lead happy lives quite often - they find happiness in what they do (otherwise they wouldn't do it) And at least they become permanent in history, while those with peace of mind just flutter away with time...

Bah - Stop messing with people's lives, is all I can say.
If they want to veg out, and can afford to do so, let them.
It's not for you or anyone else to say otherwise.

I've been under that sort of pressure myself, being good at applied mathematics, basic engineering and telecommunications, I have had people bugging me about "why didn't someone like you invent the iPhone?" ... or ... "Why don't you do something interesting with your life?" - Why thank you, I am, I'm enjoying my life already.

It didn't take long for me to figure out that when ever they say "I'm only doing it for your own sake" that they really meant "I'm doing it for me, how can you be so heartless and not make me happy ?"!

It's a fine line to walk sometimes, but you'll have to trust that the "great" people will do the "great thing" that is in them if they *want* to do it. And that no good would come out of it, if someone tried to force them into it.