A tad sadistic...

[Jairus]

All she has left to rest is two pieces, tail and leg, the rest is dust/ash. (Or how many pieces does ash count as?).

I would imagine that that's more than you need to put in a coffin. Heck, a tail and a leg is more than what some unfortunate people get (a picture, from what I've heard).

[Naldru]

I heard of one case where they buried his wig.  (He had been killed by native americans, and one of them had kept his wig as a trophy.)

[Auron]

Death is... Something we're surrounded by all our lives, some more than others. We cling to life, which, normally is a admirable thing, but... I think we cross the line somewhere when we cling to the dead. We have cemeteries dedicated to death. I think I'm odd for saying it, but, I think it's wrong. When did it become ok to collect corpses? Sure, we can't leave people were they drop, but I don't think putting them in a box and lining them up on display is great either. It might seem cruel to some, but maybe not having a body to put in the coffin is a blessing. I don't mean we should all be so lucky as to be blown up, torn apart, or otherwise killed in a truly horrific way, but, still.

Gah, I hate this!! Sometimes I'm so overly sentimental I can't even understand it!

[Tiger_T]

~~*~~
It's the simple fact you have a place where you can go to; that helps people to overcome their mourning a bit better.
Over time that place may get less important. You sort your feelings and continue your way through life with the memories in your heart.
It's a process that takes time, but my experience is that this place helps ease the pain.
~~*~~

-piece of my mind-
Tiger_T

[Stygian]

It's all beautiful to me.

[Jer-oh-me]

I'm figuring Hannah's now off in the next life enjoying her new wings...

Yeah, I'm the eternal optimist, but I think if she had to die permanently she'd at least get to have some manner of pleasant afterlife and remember how she really liked Dan's wings?

Eh, I just think a Hannah spirit with wings would give me closure personally.

[Jairus]

...

Hm, I don't think we've ever had an afterlife mentioned, aside from the one time that Dan was killed and came back as a ghost... but those events were undone by a cosmic retcon, so they may not count. And Angels/Demons are physical things, so they're not spiritual entities. Gods have been mentioned, but only in cursing and expressions like that. And aside from a mentioned ability to reattach souls to corpses (the Undead) and the ability to consume souls (Cubi), do we have any idea of what happens afterwards? Or does Amber not wish to go into that? (that last option is totally understandable from my perspective)

[VSMIT]

Now Hannah's going to show up in CVRPG, where angels do exist as spiritual entities.

[Jer-oh-me]

Eh, heh.

I guess I was just being silly I suppose. But yeah, gonna miss Hannah.

[Aisha deCabre]

...

Hm, I don't think we've ever had an afterlife mentioned, aside from the one time that Dan was killed and came back as a ghost... but those events were undone by a cosmic retcon, so they may not count. And Angels/Demons are physical things, so they're not spiritual entities. Gods have been mentioned, but only in cursing and expressions like that. And aside from a mentioned ability to reattach souls to corpses (the Undead) and the ability to consume souls (Cubi), do we have any idea of what happens afterwards? Or does Amber not wish to go into that? (that last option is totally understandable from my perspective)

I have actually been curious about that...souls in Furrae seem quite a bit more tangible than what they seem to be in our world, aside from the ghosts thing.  That they can be eaten or stored or used to enchant something, perhaps, just adds to the intrigue on what a soul is really made of other than a person's personality and emotional energy.

But, I do like to imagine that there's an afterlife, even though I say it on the fear that it'll spark debate.  'Cause having ghosts wandering around with nowhere to go may actually fill the place with more hijinks than it already has. x3

Aside from that, Hannah's luck definitely has gone for the worst in that arc.  I'd like to see it not go that way with her sisters.

[Jer-oh-me]

...

Hm, I don't think we've ever had an afterlife mentioned, aside from the one time that Dan was killed and came back as a ghost... but those events were undone by a cosmic retcon, so they may not count. And Angels/Demons are physical things, so they're not spiritual entities. Gods have been mentioned, but only in cursing and expressions like that. And aside from a mentioned ability to reattach souls to corpses (the Undead) and the ability to consume souls (Cubi), do we have any idea of what happens afterwards? Or does Amber not wish to go into that? (that last option is totally understandable from my perspective)

I have actually been curious about that...souls in Furrae seem quite a bit more tangible than what they seem to be in our world, aside from the ghosts thing.  That they can be eaten or stored or used to enchant something, perhaps, just adds to the intrigue on what a soul is really made of other than a person's personality and emotional energy.

But, I do like to imagine that there's an afterlife, even though I say it on the fear that it'll spark debate.  'Cause having ghosts wandering around with nowhere to go may actually fill the place with more hijinks than it already has. x3

Aside from that, Hannah's luck definitely has gone for the worst in that arc.  I'd like to see it not go that way with her sisters.

Agreed, but there was the unmake the undead vendetta thing DP was on about, so the odds may be more in their favor than they were for poor Hannah. And now that I think about it, DP said that the undead seemed to think he should be amongst their ranks, a bit of foreshadowing perhaps? Of course I could be reading too much into it.

[Tapewolf]

Hm, I don't think we've ever had an afterlife mentioned, aside from the one time that Dan was killed and came back as a ghost... but those events were undone by a cosmic retcon, so they may not count.

AFAIK, Fae seem to be considered remarkable because they don't have any kind of after-existence.  Whereas with other Beings and Creatures, it is possible to raise them from the dead some time after their actual death - not only the undead, but Dark Pegasus himself.

Gods have been mentioned, but only in cursing and expressions like that.

DP was trying to raise the Dark God, though granted we have no idea if it actually exists.  He could simply be full of faith in a non-existent deity.
However, there are references to the 'Four Cubi Gods' as actual real entities, some form of ascension beyond even Tri-Wing.  I can try and dig up the reference if anyone is interested.

do we have any idea of what happens afterwards? Or does Amber not wish to go into that? (that last option is totally understandable from my perspective)

Only Amber does, assuming of course that she has planned that far herself.  I've made a few assumptions in my writing that a sufficiently power spellcaster is able to recall the dead, and that the dead do have some form of experience and are not just 'archived' in some kind of non-functioning form - though I have taken great care to avoid describing the afterlife itself in anything other than vague terms.

I have actually been curious about that...souls in Furrae seem quite a bit more tangible than what they seem to be in our world, aside from the ghosts thing.  That they can be eaten or stored or used to enchant something, perhaps, just adds to the intrigue on what a soul is really made of other than a person's personality and emotional energy.

Indeed.  Recall Aary in 234, with the Knight-in-a-jar.  Her line that the knight is going to be p***ed off at being stuck in there for so long is kind of interesting.  That alone would suggest that the dead remain sentient.

There are several possible models for how souls might work.  P. F. Hamilton had an interesting one where souls were essentially an energy field that also stored the personality information and memories.

[Jer-oh-me]

I have actually been curious about that...souls in Furrae seem quite a bit more tangible than what they seem to be in our world, aside from the ghosts thing.  That they can be eaten or stored or used to enchant something, perhaps, just adds to the intrigue on what a soul is really made of other than a person's personality and emotional energy.

Indeed.  Recall Aary in 234, with the Knight-in-a-jar.  Her line that the knight is going to be p***ed off at being stuck in there for so long is kind of interesting.  That alone would suggest that the dead remain sentient.

There are several possible models for how souls might work.  P. F. Hamilton had an interesting one where souls were essentially an energy field that also stored the personality information and memories.

Heh, yeah, I always wondered if she intended to release him or not.

[!KCA]

However, there are references to the 'Four Cubi Gods' as actual real entities, some form of ascension beyond even Tri-Wing.  I can try and dig up the reference if anyone is interested.

*Searches the forum for cubi gods.*

*Fails miserably.*

Yes, I would enjoy that very much. (Is it on the previous forum?)

[Attic Rat]

Dan was a ghost for a little while, wasn't he? Does that count as an afterlife?

[Slowtini]

(besides, i've seen people do far more sadistic things to their characters, including having them skinned alive... well, immortalised, killed, then waking up skinless only to feel their skin growing back.. long story..)

...I think I know what you're talking about...
Wasn't that in the black tapestries webcomic?
*fuzzy memory*

[Tapewolf]

However, there are references to the 'Four Cubi Gods' as actual real entities, some form of ascension beyond even Tri-Wing.  I can try and dig up the reference if anyone is interested.

*Searches the forum for cubi gods.*

*Fails miserably.*

Yes, I would enjoy that very much. (Is it on the previous forum?)

Here you go:
http://nice.llearch.net/dmfa_forum1863.htm

Dan was a ghost for a little while, wasn't he? Does that count as an afterlife?

I don't think that is considered canon.  IIRC Amber once told me I was on shaky ground using that as a citation, the last time this subject came up 

[Amber Williams]

To me, cemetaries arent really for the dead so much as something for the living.  In a lot of times, having someone with you for a good part of your life and them suddenly being "gone" is a really hard thing to go by. Many people use cemetaries as a place to go visit said loved one and feel a sort of comfort.  I know several people who will visit a loved ones grave to talk about whats on their mind because they feel closer to said relative or friend when they are in a way physically closer to them.  Its a closure, and sometimes it is what someone needs to feel at peace and move on with their lives.

It just happens that you need a particular zoning permit in where you put em cause the last thing you need is bodies just getting buried all over the place.


As for religion in Furrae, I try to avoid the topic when I can. Obviously a diverse world is going to have diverse beliefs...but considering some of the emails I get already...I am not sure if I want to start lowering the faith booms just yet. I know already several peeps (though they may not be on this forum) are going to be displeased at the idea of there being "gods" or faiths other than the ones they themselves belief in in the real world...

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Pfft.

It's a fictional world. Anything in it is "grain of salt the size of Texas" territory already.


... having said that, I'll be disappointed if there aren't Atheist. If only because, as with the Discworld, they have to deal with the gods wandering around every so often and breaking their windows...

[Jer-oh-me]

*giggles at llearch's comment*

Moved from Hannah's speculated afterlife to religion, why do I find this ridiculously funny? I one hundred percent support Amber's decision to not cover religion in her comic, after all, everyone knows what a touchy subject it is. I was reminded of that in college the other day when I said something out of turn that irritated a good number of my classmates who come from a starkly different background. So, like I said, full support! Just figured imagining Hannah with pretty fluffy wings made me happy in spite of her gruesome demise.

On cemeteries, I agree, I've actually gone to the gravesides of a few of my heroes from history, and also pallbearer-ed at my Grandfather's funeral earlier this year, and Eulogized the other one after his cremation last August, so I know all about what you're talking about there.

[VSMIT]

I think this sums it up the best:

1 - Make all threads in DMFA religious

2 -???

3 - Profit

[lihua]

Well, religion is part of what makes a world, and I think more people will find it fun and interesting rather than offensive.  I personally am curious about how people like Gloria the paladin fit in to Furrae.  Whatever beliefs someone holds in real life, he or she should be able to step back and appreciate an author's creativity with the metaphysical.  I suppose 'should' is the keyword there, but, meh.  It seems many works of fantasy include deities and religions without it hurting them overmuch.

[Amber Williams]

Unfortunately, when you are dealing with a matter of faith...it is somewhat easy to find people who will be less than pleased.  I have had several emails once over the strip where Abel and Fi were chanting "the power of christ compells you" while Alexsi throttled Dan. Which, even though it was an exorcist reference more than a truly religious one, a few people felt my using the name Christ in vain like that was uncalled for.

It is also the reason I never really brought back the trio that once came across Wildy topless. In actuality I had planned to do more with them. (the armadillo basically representing a casual more laid back approach while the rabbit was the more zealous of the trio. The koala seeming to have no lines up until very much later on)  However I decided to cancel their re-appearance because I just didnt feel like making DMFA a platform for any religious opinion.

Does DMFA have religions in it? Indeed.  However, I have come across people who simply cannot grasp or handle the idea of a universe which has a different rule of divinity and not be considering blasphemous.  And I just dont have patience to deal with that at this time.

[lihua]

I suppose that's true.  Those two examples touch on real-world religions, though.  Christrians and more specifically the Jehova's Witnesses (even if it's just a title reference) are seeing their religion being poked fun at - whether or not that was your intention, things tend to come off that way - rather than reading about a made-up pantheon and cosmology.  I understand not wanting to deal with people who are going to get offended, however.  It's something I've gone back and forth with in my own writing and brainstorming.  I know I don't need to say this, but do what you're comfortable with, and all the rest of us will deal with it. 

[Jairus]

Those are all really good reasons, Amber. Religion/belief is serious business after all: some people just can't get around that. Though I do miss those little witnesses. I'm guessing that little things like "the Dark God" and using "god" in a curse or swear is okay from where you're standing, right? I mean, I'm not being confrontational, I'm just asking.

[Kuari]

I honestly do believe people take things too seriously...  I mean seriously, what good is free will and a sense of humor if we can't make use of them...  now on the topic of the OP and what has been said already, it happens unfortunately...  it's especially bad when its a character thats been around for a LONG time, I mean, really, say Merlitz or Wildy up and died.  That would REALLY make people feel down in the dumps.  Hell, from what I've hear, people cried a bit from the deaths in the Harry Potter books.  Heck, as a former DM in a few RPs, and constant role player, I REALLY don't like when people get killed off, but its all part of the story.  There have been some funny deaths though...  this one guy having his character just jump down a deep pit so he could figure out what's at the bottom for example.

[Sofox]

Liwah, that is an awesome quote in your sig. Thanks, I really appreciate it and think it will help me.

[lihua]

You're so welcome!  Lewis is one of my heroes.

[Jer-oh-me]

Indeed, Lewis is most excellent, 'A Horse and His Boy' is my favourite of his works. Back to topic.

Faith has a strong effect on people, look what happened to people who poked at Islam in a comic, yeesh. Anyway, my point is is that I fully agree with Amber's choice to try and leave religion out of her comics, but I have to admit, I thought her references were hilarious. And yeah, I don't think too many mainline Christians with strict upbringings and such would have seen the exorcist, frankly I think they should have thought it nice that you'd think only the power of Christ would be capable of exorcising, but eh, people tend to make snap judgments. Which amusingly, if I remember my Sunday School Lessons correctly, Christians should not be doing that.

Though, isn't it interesting that Amber chose Jehovah's Witnesses and Catholics to represent religion? Not trying to mock anyone of those particular brands of Christianity here, as I too am Christian and that'd be wrong, but isn't the Catholic church making a lot of news with issues in the past couple years? Of course I'm willing to guess that the stuff we've seen on the news is the exception and not the rule, but the Catholic church does have a history of corruption at various levels (Medieval History folks, look it up if you don't agree). And then some people think Jehovah's Witnesses' method of spreading the word is annoying, it would seem Amber included based on her comic.

[PencilinHand]

I understand and agree with Amber's choice to avoid religion for the purpose of the comic.

Religion is a delicate and a complicated subject because people are fully convinced of and truly believe it.  Many people are more than willing do defend what they believe like how my original post got peeled off.


I will miss Hannah. The reader in me wishes she had not been killed.  However, the critic in me knows she had to and appreciates Amber's ability to endear the reader with her characters regardless of their fate and have the guts to "end" their existence.

I really liked her explanation for it.

For me, one of the things I try to always remember when telling a story is that every character should be an individual.  It's something I remind myself in real life when I drive down the street. Every person in every car? They have years of life behind them and a whole building block upon which has made them that very person who is driving that car.  As such, I don't really believe in making characters who's purpose it is to die.   Instead, I simply try to make characters who are characters...and it just happens to be their time.