just a quick question

[gh0st]

so i was reading Abel's story again, good story by the way, anyways i was wondering if the Cubi traits only get passed on after the Cubi has "awaken" or gained their full powers. to put this in a story, if Abel had some crazy love child with a random lady, and ended up getting her pregnant before he got the little tattoo thing, would the crazy love child be Cubi, or would it be just a normal child?

hehe Abel gets around...

[!KCA]

Can a cubi pass on its cubi traits before it gets its wings or clan symbol?

Since the chance of passing on cubi traits tends to be related to how powerful the cubi is compared to the other parent, I'm going to say it would be extremely unlikely.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

...

Given you'd have to be underage, or at least close to it, how is this a relevant line of enquiry?

Also, since Cubi don't appear to reproduce very frequently - three on the go is unusual, from what Fa'Lina said, and Aniz seemed to think that four in a century was a lot - the chances of one of them reproducing whilst under 24 is about on par with a human expecting a child at under 8 or so.

Not something frequent enough to worry about, on the scale of things, I think. Sheesh.

[Tapewolf]

Given you'd have to be underage, or at least close to it, how is this a relevant line of enquiry?
Also, since Cubi don't appear to reproduce very frequently - three on the go is unusual, from what Fa'Lina said, and Aniz seemed to think that four in a century was a lot - the chances of one of them reproducing whilst under 24 is about on par with a human expecting a child at under 8 or so.

Humans do reproduce under 24, and are legally allowed to under UK law.  Other countries - and indeed the UK in earlier times - have or have had even lower requirements.  In the middle ages marriages at 12 or so were not uncommon.

It really depends how Being society works.  It's reasonable to assume that with human-compatible lifespans, they allow someone to become a father at 18 or 21 or whatever.  That gives you a window of several years where the incubus still thinks he's a winged Being.
After realising what he is, yes, he's more likely to take things a bit slower, but ghost's question is about the pre-head-wings stage anyway.

Indeed, that's how Jakob's story began.  He was conceived when his father was about 19-20 (said father being 'kidnapped' when he turned 25).  This age may even have been considered somewhat late, given that I chose a middle-ages setting for it.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Sorry, I wasn't clear enough.

What I was trying to suggest was that a 'Cubi reproducing under age 24, say, would be about on par with a human reproducing under the age of 8 or so.

Technically possible, but way outside the "normal human range" and usually requires large numbers of population to get the variations in. And you better believe there will be problems with it; sociological problems of the parents being way too young to cope, emotionally, physically, and mentally. And then there's financial problems with it as well, not discounting any legal issues...


It's not terribly unusual - particularly in what I would term the "more stupid type of person" - for 16-18yos to have kids; barely legal parents. Girls, and I do use the term advisedly, as young as 12 are menstruating; and hence physically capable of spawning a child; bearing it to completion, I'm less sure about. It follows that boys as young as 12 are physically capable of siring a child as well.

However, as noted, it's extremely unusual. The suggestion I was trying to make was that with Cubi, it's possible that they are "functionally sterile" until 'Cubi adulthood kicks in, no matter what physical form they take. So until they get their wings, they can't reproduce.


However, that's just speculation, no matter how well it fits what Amber has shown us so far.

[Tapewolf]

The suggestion I was trying to make was that with Cubi, it's possible that they are "functionally sterile" until 'Cubi adulthood kicks in, no matter what physical form they take. So until they get their wings, they can't reproduce.

Ah, I see.  From what Amber seems to have been saying, immature 'Cubi are basically all-biological, becoming more magic-based as they age.  That would suggest to me that they are able to reproduce like a normal Being up to that point.  Of course, they might not yield another 'Cubi.

[Ry]

What I was trying to suggest was that a 'Cubi reproducing under age 24, say, would be about on par with a human reproducing under the age of 8 or so.

The youngest birth was at age 5, but the girl had already hit puberty.  For that to happen- the Cubi traits would, presumably, already popped up.

[Edit] Also: this is a bit confusing because, before they reach that age, they may not realize their cubi (our 2 resident incubi didn't, even if it's not common), so what would happen if they married at an age that's acceptable for Beings to have kids?  What sort of fertility clinics does Furrae have?  o_O  Would there be a test for "cubi who hasn't shown hir traits yet"?

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Sorry, Ry. I'm not laying down the law, here, I'm speaking as an "interested party". So whatever I'm saying is purely guesswork.

And yes, I'd guess that prior to showing as Cubi, they might think they're Being and behave accordingly. However, note also that Beings tend to live a little longer than humans, on average; also Dan is an exceptionally late bloomer, or so I understand. So it may well turn out that the gap between "puberty" and "Cuberty" (ahem, ahem) is negative in most cases, rather than the positive in Dan's case. We simply don't have enough information to make anything other than a WAG. Which is what I've done.

It is, as noted, a vague guess rather than specific information. It "seems to fit", as it were. Maybe I'm right and maybe I'm not. The only way we find out is if Amber stops screaming in pain and wanders in to answer, and I'm pretty sure she's not going to; she seems to like leaving us to hang.

And then breaking out the steamroller. *grin*

[PurpleCheeseLlama]

Girls, and I do use the term advisedly, as young as 12 are menstruating

Even younger, it's not uncommon for them to start as young as 9/10 (two of my friend's were as early as that)


Also, thanks for 'Cuberty'...I swear that just made everything so much funnier XD

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

... I was sortof attempting to avoid the paedophilia. ;-]


However, Cuberty is not originally mine. It's not totally accurate, but it's a useful label.

[PurpleCheeseLlama]

... I was sortof attempting to avoid the paedophilia. ;-]


However, Cuberty is not originally mine. It's not totally accurate, but it's a useful label.

You were already at 12...not that far a gap to jump XD nvm though

[AmigaDragon]

Back to the apparent original intent of the question, I think a pre-'cuberty' (makes me think Q-bert) cubi would still produce cubi, since it's probably just outward signs of being a cubi that shows with the headwings and clan markings. showing or not showing cubi features doesn't change what they are. My main (I think still unanswered) question is whether cubi always produce cubi or if they can occasionally produce beings (this would also apply to angels and demons).

[Tapewolf]

My main (I think still unanswered) question is whether cubi always produce cubi or if they can occasionally produce beings (this would also apply to angels and demons).

Indeed.  I'd like to know the answer to that also.  If you take a fine-tooth-comb to Fluffy's wording, he/she/it seems to be implying that you do end up with a Being on occasion (note the double "if" when describing Megan).

Personally I suspect that's what Devin was - a failed attempt. 

[AndersW]

I always thought that the headwings usually came in during a persons mid twenty's.  The most relevant post by Amber I can currently find is this.

In Aary's case, her headwings came in around her late teens...which is considered really early for Cubi.

[kaskar]

The suggestion I was trying to make was that with Cubi, it's possible that they are "functionally sterile" until 'Cubi adulthood kicks in, no matter what physical form they take. So until they get their wings, they can't reproduce.

Ah, I see.  From what Amber seems to have been saying, immature 'Cubi are basically all-biological, becoming more magic-based as they age.  That would suggest to me that they are able to reproduce like a normal Being up to that point.  Of course, they might not yield another 'Cubi.

    There are exceptions to every rule. Look at Dan with his " W_S " markings. He considers himself a being, until forced otherwise, with the appearance of his head wings. His skills are more in the physical, not academic, line and so the  need to use magic is almost nil.

His clan marking has yet to appear, and since Destina is his mother, her clan markings are, for the moment, assumed by Dan. ( In the near future, what happens if Aniz's clan markings turn up? )
   
With this mental infant, only time, or a certain Warp - Aci, can tell ...
     

[AmigaDragon]

His apparent need to use magic is nil. Remember he apparently still has an aversion to using his own magic.

[Ry]

His clan marking has yet to appear, and since Destina is his mother, her clan markings are, for the moment, assumed by Dan. ( In the near future, what happens if Aniz's clan markings turn up? )

Does anyone else want to speculate on what would've happened if Dan did have Aniz's marking when he showed up at the academy?  I wouldn't bet Abel likes his clan much, what with it being so fragmented that dear ol dad might be his only introduction, and he already knew that Dan was at least Edward's son (can't remember on Destania).   That could've ended badly.

[AndersW]

Even if Edward was Aniz, Dan would still have the Cyra clan marking, because Cyra clan is the more powerful clan.  Besides, Fi has Dan's clan marking right there on his forehead.

[Ry]

Even if Edward was Aniz, Dan would still have the Cyra clan marking, because Cyra clan is the more powerful clan.  Besides, Fi has Dan's clan marking right there on his forehead.

Stop ruining my speculation on things that would never happen with logic!   

Heh heh, yeah, I didn't think that it'd ever happen.  But I'm still curious what Abel's reaction to another of his clan would be, especially one that's Edward Ti'fiona's son.

[AmigaDragon]

Even if Edward was Aniz, Dan would still have the Cyra clan marking, because Cyra clan is the more powerful clan.  Besides, Fi has Dan's clan marking right there on his forehead.

I'm wondering if Fa'lina  put that marking on Fi or if it automatically proves the connection with Dan? As far as we've seen, Dan's clan mark has yet to show itself, due to the lack of magic he's performed over the years.

[gh0st]

well that answers some things...