WGA Strike 2007(-8? -9?)

[Alondro]

Yeah, now I just need to get a pile of money behind me too.

*thinks of all the painful clinical studies he's going to have to sign up for*  At $1000 a pop, I could fully fund the project with a mere... 500 studies...

...

I'm going to need my veins replaced after this... 

[Valynth]

Hey, I just found a vid on YouTube that has a very clear explanation on what this is all about. For some reason, I didn't quite understand it all until now

Why They Fight

And I say, I agree with this.

Considering the commission that they START with is more than most minimum wage work will earn in three years for about three months of writing, no, I don't agree.  In fact, the REASON 48% of writers are unemployed is because they DON'T NEED TO WORK!  They can go with out work for about three years with a single gig if they managed their money like a minimum wage slave.  Hell, the national unemployment rate is around 4%.  There are jobs to be had if those damn prissy writers would actually take one as opposed to their current arguments about the job that make about as much sense as the "but I might chip a nail" argument.  If they're able to pick and choose jobs, they are not getting sympathy from me.

[bill]

So, your argument is "Writing isn't a job". OK.

[Reese Tora]

Considering the commission that they START with is more than most minimum wage work will earn in three years for about three months of writing, no, I don't agree.  In fact, the REASON 48% of writers are unemployed is because they DON'T NEED TO WORK!  They can go with out work for about three years with a single gig if they managed their money like a minimum wage slave.  Hell, the national unemployment rate is around 4%.  There are jobs to be had if those damn prissy writers would actually take one as opposed to their current arguments about the job that make about as much sense as the "but I might chip a nail" argument.  If they're able to pick and choose jobs, they are not getting sympathy from me.

Or, you know, maybe they are unemployed because there is only so much writting work in Hollywood.  Try and find out how many writters are between jobs and looking for a new one as opposed to between jobs and being lazy, why don't you, before you make broad sweeping generalizations about the character of a large group of people.  getting work in entertainment is not so simple as knocking on some door and saying 'hire me'.

And, lazy or not, the fact remains that they took a voluntary pay cut to help grow the home video market with the understanding that thier previous pay levels would be reinstated once the market had taken off.  The hove video market has taken off, in spades, and they have not had that pay reinstated.  The question is NOT whether thier work is worth what they want to be paid, it is a question of getting thier previous pay levels reinstated as they were originally led to believe they would.

For the issue of recompense for internet material, how is an internet broadcast any different from a TV broadcast once you get past the technology of delivery? Maybe the Internet thing is greedy, and they don't deserve it (I don't necessarily agree with that, better writting gets better viewership gets better revenue, and good writting deserves reward), but they aren't getting paid for thier work, they aren't getting credit for thier work in some instances, and there is an injustice here, if not the grave one they make it out to be.

[Valynth]

Considering the commission that they START with is more than most minimum wage work will earn in three years for about three months of writing, no, I don't agree.  In fact, the REASON 48% of writers are unemployed is because they DON'T NEED TO WORK!  They can go with out work for about three years with a single gig if they managed their money like a minimum wage slave.  Hell, the national unemployment rate is around 4%.  There are jobs to be had if those damn prissy writers would actually take one as opposed to their current arguments about the job that make about as much sense as the "but I might chip a nail" argument.  If they're able to pick and choose jobs, they are not getting sympathy from me.

Or, you know, maybe they are unemployed because there is only so much writting work in Hollywood.  Try and find out how many writters are between jobs and looking for a new one as opposed to between jobs and being lazy, why don't you, before you make broad sweeping generalizations about the character of a large group of people.  getting work in entertainment is not so simple as knocking on some door and saying 'hire me'.

And, lazy or not, the fact remains that they took a voluntary pay cut to help grow the home video market with the understanding that thier previous pay levels would be reinstated once the market had taken off.  The hove video market has taken off, in spades, and they have not had that pay reinstated.  The question is NOT whether thier work is worth what they want to be paid, it is a question of getting thier previous pay levels reinstated as they were originally led to believe they would.

For the issue of recompense for internet material, how is an internet broadcast any different from a TV broadcast once you get past the technology of delivery? Maybe the Internet thing is greedy, and they don't deserve it (I don't necessarily agree with that, better writting gets better viewership gets better revenue, and good writting deserves reward), but they aren't getting paid for thier work, they aren't getting credit for thier work in some instances, and there is an injustice here, if not the grave one they make it out to be.

Do you honestly think the guys behind the why we fight video care about actual employment?  Odds are they only took the figure of writers who are not employed TO WRITE.  There is a significant difference between the two, not to mention they can wait off of one writing gig for a year or two before they become seriously strapped for cash if they managed their money right.

Also, have you seen how much crap Hollywood is pumping out?  They'll make a movie out of almost ANYTHING, I mean you can't look at the latest releases as say "Oh the Hollywood people actually looked around for that plot talent,"  because quite frankly they didn't otherwise it wouldn't suck so horribly.

There's also the fact that even an additional 4 cents on every DVD sale results in over 100,000$ simply by all the rental places buying the DVD's.

Also, the pie chart is purposefully misrepresented.  The studio gets no where near the amount they show, retail ALONE takes 5.00, and then you have actors, directors, CGI people, and in some case extras that also have a little slice of that chart.  Pretty much everyone in the credits gets a piece of the chart as listed at the end of the movie.  In otherwords, the writers want the rest of the crew to take paycuts so they can get even more of a respectable slice of the sales since very few writers are needed compared to the rest of the crew in movie production.  Hell, two writers can be all a group needs to produce a movie or television series.

[Brunhidden]

i suddenly have a desire to see how hard it is to submit a script to hollywood....

[Reese Tora]

Do you honestly think the guys behind the why we fight video care about actual employment?  Odds are they only took the figure of writers who are not employed TO WRITE.  There is a significant difference between the two, not to mention they can wait off of one writing gig for a year or two before they become seriously strapped for cash if they managed their money right.

No, you brought it up, I responded.  You are assuming a lot without any reference to facts or real statistics other than what the writters themselves said.

Also, have you seen how much crap Hollywood is pumping out?  They'll make a movie out of almost ANYTHING, I mean you can't look at the latest releases as say "Oh the Hollywood people actually looked around for that plot talent,"  because quite frankly they didn't otherwise it wouldn't suck so horribly.

Oh, I don't disagree with that most of it is trash, but this proves my point; hollywood is putting out as much junk as it can raise the money to produce.  Hollywood is desperate for new scripts that it can put to movie and make a little more scratch.

There's also the fact that even an additional 4 cents on every DVD sale results in over 100,000$ simply by all the rental places buying the DVD's.

Also, the pie chart is purposefully misrepresented.  The studio gets no where near the amount they show, retail ALONE takes 5.00, and then you have actors, directors, CGI people, and in some case extras that also have a little slice of that chart.  Pretty much everyone in the credits gets a piece of the chart as listed at the end of the movie.  In otherwords, the writers want the rest of the crew to take paycuts so they can get even more of a respectable slice of the sales since very few writers are needed compared to the rest of the crew in movie production.  Hell, two writers can be all a group needs to produce a movie or television series.

Yes, the pie chart only represents the amount that writters themselves get, and there are other costs, but it also doesn't represent the fact that writters only get 0.3% of the first reportable gross in residuals from the first million copies sold.  A team of writers might spend a year or more on a single project, and, assuming that the DvD they make even sells a million copies, (unlikley, for a lot of direct to DvD junk that's put out) they would only make ($30 * 1mil *0.3% = )90,000 dollars, which is split amongst all the writters.

In a team of, say, five writters, you would have $18,000 each for a year's work, adn that's for one decent direct to DVD movie.

As for comparing this to minimum wage, we are talking about trained professionals, not people who flip burgers for a living.  Even a McDonalds employee can expect to make mroe than minimum wage. (you also ahve to take in to account the cost of living in California is MUCH higher than the national average, especially in the hollywood area)

[Brunhidden]

however its still a matter of when a writer says "i was the one who put in the 'this is Sparta *kick*' line and all i got was $18 K, its still a little unfair that you do not have recognition or are suitably rewarded for making that movie a hit.  however the way movies go now it pisses them off more because the movie makers think they can just shove a big name actor in and itll make a good movie but the writers are just to be yelled at when they screw up.

[Alondro]

Bah, this whole thing is crap.  That's like every single person who was involved in bringing a successful drug to market wanting a percentage of the profits. 

That's why real companies pay wages.  That's what you signed up for, that's what you get... so shut up. 

Oh, it takes them a year to write this stuff?  Seriously?  A whole year and these movies and shows are the best they can come up with?  You know, that makes me feel even less for them than just a little while ago.

[Reese Tora]

Oh, it takes them a year to write this stuff?  Seriously?  A whole year and these movies and shows are the best they can come up with?  You know, that makes me feel even less for them than just a little while ago.

Writters sign on with a movie, and are involved with the production.  A script isn't ususally just written and handed over to a production studio.  The script that gets shown to a studio is a rough idea of the movie, it gets refined durring pre-production, modified durring production, and maybe even re-ordered and changed durring post-production.

It's not that it takes a year to write the movie, it's that it takes anywhere from half a year to a couple years create a movie, and the writter is on-board for that time.

[Brunhidden]

Oh, it takes them a year to write this stuff?  Seriously?  A whole year and these movies and shows are the best they can come up with?  You know, that makes me feel even less for them than just a little while ago.

actually it takes like a week to 'write' it, but the year part is re writing it every time someone points out an inconstancy, the director does not like that scene, a PR representative says this here might be racist, a choreographer says to change an action/fight scene, someone with an ambiguous job title says there should be more sex here, here, and here, and by this point one of the changes you made just summoned one of the previous people to come back again to insist it be re written again

this is the creative process, and without it many movies would be five hours long, many tv sitcoms may actually be funny, and anything labeled as 'drama' would cease to exist

[Netrogo]

I'd like to bring something to the attention of Val. To say that extras get a small part of the gross is BULLSHIT. I work part-time as an extra and we don't get jack or shit from the movie other then our set pay rate during production. The minimum wage for extras is $10 an hour (here in Canada) and we get paid for a minimum of eight hours a day. That means if I get called in for three hours I get paid for eight. After we're done signing in the extras are all herded into one room that (on any set) is called 'Background Holding' where we all sit around and wait to be brought out. Then when we are brought out, we're the equivalent of props that can talk. We're not actors we don't even get to speak (speaking credits you as an actor and therefor get's you a LARGE increase in pay). So yeah we get no piece of the pie we're more likely filed under the same category as paying for the rentals they needed to film the set.


Now this isn't to say that sets don't treat extras right cuz alot of them are fucking awesome as far as how much they pay and food supplied.

[Alondro]

I liked the way it was in the little dinner theater Murder Mystery comedy I used to act in some years ago.  It was fun.  Everyone added to the writing as we rehersed, and often came up with some very funny parts.

I still recall the time Kage was there for a show and I did my multiple movie deaths death scene.  It was great!

[Valynth]

I'd like to bring something to the attention of Val. To say that extras get a small part of the gross is BULLSHIT. I work part-time as an extra and we don't get jack or shit from the movie other then our set pay rate during production. The minimum wage for extras is $10 an hour (here in Canada) and we get paid for a minimum of eight hours a day. That means if I get called in for three hours I get paid for eight. After we're done signing in the extras are all herded into one room that (on any set) is called 'Background Holding' where we all sit around and wait to be brought out. Then when we are brought out, we're the equivalent of props that can talk. We're not actors we don't even get to speak (speaking credits you as an actor and therefor get's you a LARGE increase in pay). So yeah we get no piece of the pie we're more likely filed under the same category as paying for the rentals they needed to film the set.


Now this isn't to say that sets don't treat extras right cuz alot of them are fucking awesome as far as how much they pay and food supplied.

Whooaaaa there cowboy, rope up them hormones right now.  You should note that I said "in some cases."   If you had a different experience then you are part of the "many cases."

Also, you get paid 10$ an hour for eight hours a day in three hours to essentaly be filler?  I'd kill for your job.  I'd be lucky to find a commercial job that pays 6$ an hour for eight hours a day in ten hours a day all of which I'd be cleaning/stocking/dealing with public/basicaly earning my pay.

[Reese Tora]

the important question is, how many days a year does an extra work?

regardless, extras are paid for a very important skill many have yet to grasp: the art of not talking

rhubarbrhubarbrhubarb

[Fuyudenki]

no, actually, I second Valynth.  $10 an hour, minimum $80 a day to basically stand around and look pretty, or sit in a room full of people?

... probably a pay cut from my current job, but I assume you can do other stuff in the "background holding" room.

[Valynth]

especially if you're making an adult movie....

[Netrogo]

Buh dum dum...



Oh yeah don't get me wrong, background is great. The only downside to it is it's an 'on call' job. Which means I only work when my agent calls me. Sadly because of the strike she hasn't called once this past two weeks

[Dannysaysnoo]

Buh dum dum...



Oh yeah don't get me wrong, background is great. The only downside to it is it's an 'on call' job. Which means I only work when my agent calls me. Sadly because of the strike she hasn't called once this past two weeks

Net, have you been in anything we might have seen?

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Net, have you been in anything we might have seen?

... that you're willing to admit to? ;-]

[Netrogo]

I was in the movie adaptation of Repo! The Genetic Opera. I was also in this mini series that's supposed to come out next year called The Summit.

Oh and Llearch I'll admit to anything. Hell I did some fetish videos earlier this year. Mind you they were only tickle fetish videos so it was fully clothed, horrible acting, and lots of laughing. But they are still hosted on a porn site XD Frankly I'm more ashamed of having worked with Paris Hilton on Repo!

[Darkmoon]

We're all ashamed for you.

[Alondro]

Paris Hilton?!.. !!!!?!!!!!?!!!???!   

You are among the damned... 

[Netrogo]

I know, I know >.<

Although there was one good thing to working with her. She single handedly resulted in all the extras getting paid for an extra three hours of work, because she couldn't get ONE word right in her lines. So her stupidity was a blessing, even if we had to put up with watching her strut around like the preppy bitch she is when not on set.

Plus there were other cool people on set thankfully. Paul Sorvino, Alexa Vega, Sarah Brightman, and Bill Moseley to name a few. Also unlike Hilton they all ate their meals in background holding and hung out with us. Sorvino even sang opera for us when we were between takes (Fyi he sings AWESOMELY!!! Yes so good that I make up words like awesomely to describe it).

[Alondro]

As long as you didn't touch her, you are still 'clean'.   

If you did, you must be dipped in sulfuric acid for cleansing.   

[Fuyudenki]

oh wow, you've got Ursula Vernon!?

I don't recognize any of the other names below hers.

Mayhaps I should attempt to join your team.

Or mayhaps I should continue puttering along on my own.  I'll worry about it when I have time.

Hey, Alondro?  I've thought about it.  Can I join United Paws?

Do I need to provide a portfolio or something?