Connecting all the wrong dots.

[GabrielsThoughts]

Why are all the studies relating to Goth culture in the United States always bringing up studies of "English" Children in "England"....for example " based on several long term studies of 25 Gothic teenagers between the ages of 11 and 19 (why not use all the studies?)published in an  English Medical Journal,  strong subculture Identification was analyzed in relation to lifetime deliberate self harm and suicide attempts, adjusting for other elements also predictive of these outcomes...53% of these teenagers attempted cutting 47% said they'd attempted suicide (insert crap linking Goths  to columbine/littleton massacre and Marylin Manson) Goth Subculture has its roots in the Punk Rock music scene" () blah, bla, blah, "No Doubt teenagers with depression and other mental health problems are drawn to Goth, as an alternative to needed treatment"

Oh no the Goth menace is out to get us, if your child is expressing themselves through vampire novels and listening to punk music. I'm surprised they still haven't used English studies linking hooded sweatshirts to crime, of course considering more than 75% of the American population owns at least one Hoodie they'd have trouble convincing us to swear off wearing them.

[Zedd]

Guess they couldnt stopped me..*laughs hard*

[RJ]

I'd like to see a goth study on Japan. The clothes are prettier.

[superluser]

for example " based on several long term studies of 25 Gothic teenagers between the ages of 11 and 19 (why not use all the studies?)published in an  English Medical Journal

Er...where did this quote come from?  I can do some research and get an answer, but not without knowing the reference.

I'm surprised they still haven't used English studies linking hooded sweatshirts to crime

Er...there was this guy:

[Kasarn]

Yeah, well I have the results of a COMPLETELY SCIENTIFIC study right here.
76% of people are secretly zombie unicorns plotting to take over the world!!!

[GabrielsThoughts]

 Dr. Greggory K. Fritz  "Adolescents and Goth Subculture" published June 2006 by The Brown University Child and Adolescent Behavior is where I got the data and the Quote about "No Doubt teenagers with depression and other mental health problems are drawn to Goth, as an alternative to needed treatment"

[Netami]

Being goth is something you do in Highschool to seem unique or to fit into a crowd of potential friends.

Does anyone know of a goth beyond the age of, say, 25? A person that holds down a job and spends their money on bills and not ridiculous music?

[superluser]

Does anyone know of a goth beyond the age of, say, 25? A person that holds down a job and spends their money on bills and not ridiculous music?

Aleister Crowley?  Marilyn Manson?

Dr. Greggory K. Fritz  "Adolescents and Goth Subculture" published June 2006 by The Brown University Child and Adolescent Behavior

Can't find the full text of the study, I did find the cite(*).  I think we have a name for Dr. Fritz, as well--pinhead.

In his defense, however, I will make the following statement.  ``based on several long term studies'' is academic shorthand for ``This isn't just one crackpot study.  We ran multiple tests!  Honest!''  and usually seems to mean that all studies available are included.

As a means of condemning him, I will now make more statements.

``Although it takes considerable sophistication to differentiate true goth bands from "techno/synthopop" or "industrial" bands.''

I'll give Dr. Fritz a hint.  ``99 Luftballons'' and ``Sweet Dreams'' are synthpop.  ``Electric Cafe'' by Kraftwerk is techno.  Industrial is sort of cross-genre to me, but I think I'd put Banco de Gaia (especially Drippy) into there.

Goth is more along the lines of ``Sweet Dreams (or: I'm raping your childhood)'' by Marilyn Manson.


(*)Prevalence of deliberate self harm and attempted suicide within contemporary Goth youth subculture: longitudinal cohort study.
Young R; Sweeting H; West P
BMJ (Clinical Research Ed.) [BMJ] 2006 May 6; Vol. 332 (7549), pp. 1058-61.

[Reese Tora]

See, the thing I always heard is that emo culture is more likely to be be associated with that than goth, but I only ahve hearsay behind that.
(leads one to wonder if the study didn't diferentiate between emo and goth... at one time, I, too, did not know the difference between the two.  )

[RJ]

Today in Introduction to Creative Writing, I found that my writing professor counts emo as an actual serious stereotype. 

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Being goth is something you do in Highschool to seem unique or to fit into a crowd of potential friends.

Does anyone know of a goth beyond the age of, say, 25? A person that holds down a job and spends their money on bills and not ridiculous music?

Yes. Although she spends her money on "ridiculous music" as well.

FWIW, your first comment appears to be closer to what she would call "emo goth" than "real goth"...

[Netami]

Real goths sacked rome.

Modern, grown up goths work at Hot Topic or Tower Records, I guess. People who make their living off being an icon don't really count, either. Marilyn manson does not wake up every day and wish there were more people like him, because then he'd be less cool.

[bill]

Real goths sacked rome.

Modern, grown up goths work at Hot Topic or Tower Records, I guess.

Not anymore. Tower Records is gone. R.I.P. 

[superluser]

Modern, grown up goths work at Hot Topic or Tower Records, I guess. People who make their living off being an icon don't really count, either. Marilyn manson does not wake up every day and wish there were more people like him, because then he'd be less cool.

I prefer to blame the fall of Rome on the Vandals.  They have a much cooler name.

I'm pretty sure that Marilyn Manson wishes that there were more people like him because that would mean better record sales.

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Real goths sacked rome.

Visigoths for President!