[Comics, Drawing] Another round, for better or worse

[VAE]

Edit: this will be the place  of more works as well, so the title got changed.
Index

1) ASWC
2) Glup the chuul
3) Vladim, coloured
4) IC Apples: Glup and Farin , Glup, Crystal and Vladim
5) The Many Faces of Vladim Alexeievich Eisenberg
6) Better coloured (and drawn) Vladim
7) And Sergej, for completion OP follows:
8 ) Vladim, preparing to kill someone
9 ) A bunch of sketches and drawings, mostly DnD
10) 0x35 the fateful day when i started linking updates here again
Well, i have a webcomic pretty much since january, located as follows:

EDIT: since this became a general purpose thread, the latest issue is all the time at
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~dm510

Proper index is (after restructuring my page) at
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~dm510/random/index.html

http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~dm510/random/comic01.html - the first issue
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~dm510/random/comic0D.html - where it got regular characters and semblance of a plot
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~dm510/random/comic12.html - where i got a scanner so the graphics went from appalling to just bad.
From a nondescript place, it became located in a post-conflict furrea, (hopefully post DMFA therefore) and an unimportant second world-like part of it for the matter. (and yes, i have notified Amber )
It follows the life and so  of an evil overlord, who from being the character of random jokes in the early parts got promoted to an actual character when i realised it is somewhat easier to think of  things to happen that way
It is currently drawn with a Versatil falling-lead pencil and a generous usage of rubber. (before in Gimp with generous usage of Ctrl+Z)
there are 23 issues so far (24 including the one i have not scanned yet )

In this i would like to ask, as title says for general advice, one of the things being legibility - it seems to me both handwriting and fonts i know do a bad job, each from a different way - should i make up my own in fontforge and type it? or something entirely else.
I sincerely hope i have not messed up this post too much ...

[WhiteFox]

I use fonts from Blambot.com. Particularly, AnimeAce 2.0

I'd be less worried about legibility, and more coherency. The story and writing is kind of random.

[VAE]

Thanks!
The font looks good, i will try to put it in when i leave Slovakia.
As for randomness, i am trying to decrease the amount of that, with more or less success...
currently i have a text file where i drop off joke/happening  ideas, and then string them on where possible... i have a rough sketch of a part of plot in mind, and am trying to progress with that, but i do not want to skip in time in a too forced manner so it kind of slowed down until something important enough happens ....

[GabrielsThoughts]

 Your artwork reminds me of the preposterous adventures of Ironhide Tom. I think it is good that you have a scanner, as I've always admired traditional line arts over a purely digital alternative. However,  The only problem I have with the comics you've provided is that the writing is unclear. You can get away with the most abstract of art as long as the writing is good, and you have a good story. As it stands, you narrative is confusing and the art itself leads to further confusion. I agree with whitefox, picking a consistent font,( preferably a script font) and sticking with it would be a good start towards improving your skills. Also, since it appears you like to use MS paint, try making characters out of basic shapes. Having a consistent character design would greatly improve the quality of your work. Try drawing the same character 95 times... something is bound to remain consistent enough to help with character identification later on. another thing you might do is practice drawing for a year in ink, the inability to erase lines will teach you how to cover up you mistakes and lower your standards a bit.      

EDIT: Your art also reminds me of early artwork by Cathy Guisewite  

[VAE]

Thanks for more advice. but to clear up:

Is the randomness and lack of clarity referring to the whole thing or just the latter half? the thing is, for the first 14 or so comics,  it was a random enterprise.
I think i should put up some kind of separation in the index.

Hmm, i  am using GIMP, not MS paint - as far as most of the computer-drawn comics go, the problem was mainly to draw something close enough to what i want using a laptop mouse... one of the reasons i gave in and got the scanner (i am quite miserly )
currently it is pretty much used for cropping the picture and perhaps erasing few smudges

The character - a good idea .  I had real hard time drawing the same character with a different facial expression... you probably saw it especially in the last comic - the last face is somewhat ugly as i started rubbing through the paper not getting it right several times...

Also, any good thoughts how to draw from ´angles´ Maybe because the only training i have is technical drawing,   i find it pretty hard to draw things that are not the usual top-side-front or at most isometric... 

[WhiteFox]

However,  The only problem I have with the comics you've provided is that the writing is unclear.
You can get away with the most abstract of art as long as the writing is good, and you have a good story.

I agree with whitefox, picking a consistent font,( preferably a script font) and sticking with it would be a good start towards improving your skills.

I was thinking mostly of panel flow. If the transitions from panel to panel aren't smooth, it can be hard to follow what's going on. Panel transitions are a mix of camera work and timing.

GabrielsThoughts, your comics would benefit from better panel flow too.

Is the randomness and lack of clarity referring to the whole thing or just the latter half?

All through. The art gets much better, but the panel transitions only marginally so.

Hmm, i  am using GIMP, not MS paint - as far as most of the computer-drawn comics go, the problem was mainly to draw something close enough to what i want using a laptop mouse... one of the reasons i gave in and got the scanner (i am quite miserly )
currently it is pretty much used for cropping the picture and perhaps erasing few smudges

Inking on paper would definitely be an idea, then. Fixing line mistakes in digital is pretty simple.

The character - a good idea .  I had real hard time drawing the same character with a different facial expression...

I usually sketch drafts. That lets me figure out how I want to draw a character for a panel in advance. Or figure out if I know what I'm doing at all.

Also, any good thoughts how to draw from ´angles´ Maybe because the only training i have is technical drawing,  i find it pretty hard to draw things that are not the usual top-side-front or at most isometric...  

Start with basic shapes. Sort out how to draw a figure with sticks and circles.

Then learn how to arrange the basic shapes to draw the figure from different angles.

Then learn foreshortening, IE, the farther away something is, the smaller the sticks and circles should be.

Then learn how  to draw different features from different angles and poses. The easiest way to do this is by doing life drawing, of every feature, from every angle, in every pose, that you will ever want to draw it until your fingers fall off. Some artists skip this part, and it shows.

[VAE]

Hmm, how should a panel transition look? It seems the most-impact thing to improve so i am wondering.

[WhiteFox]

When you write a sentence, you string a bunch of word together in a way that makes sense. The better the words are arranged, the more the sentence will make sense.

Panel transitions are kind of like that. It's not just a matter of what is being drawn or written. The panels are a sequence of events, and the reader has to be able to follow that sequence. If information gets left out, the sequence becomes hard to follow.

I found a good tutorial on them here: http://www.mangatutorials.com/tut/paneltrans.php
It pretty well copies, word for word, the write up that Scott McCloud did in his book, Understanding Comics.

[VAE]

hmm, actually seems pretty complicated
Although i see now that some of the comics have it really done badly - like the Einbomber one, or the one where the flashback began.
are there any simple guidelines ? (i mean like in chess - do not start out with heavy figures, make sure each turn in beginning develops a figure..)

[VAE]

Glup the Chuul, my Deathtrap Dungeon character can go here as well.

He is a chuul brain merchant, exploiting the fact those are poisonous to them
here is the image and  here the character sheet

[VAE]

I think this is a good place for the drawing i attempted to colour in GIMP, and which depicts Vladim,  (the main character of the comic) in one of the rare capeless moments...  And which is to be my avatar( (since people constantly thought the last one was a zombie) and probably a goto character as well - after the Apples to apples game, i began to like him a lot more...

Why use hands to hold a book when you can ... never mind, it still needs them

Hmm, the pink nose and pawpads are probably another reason why he uses the cape all the time...

just a short description:
Name: Vladim
Species : Lynx, being (at least so far)
Skills: Wizard-magic (ie elemental, telekinesis etc. )  computers, fringe science.. (for other stuff ,there's Sergej)
Age: 30
Occupation: Evil overlord (after taking a requalification course when unemployed around 10 years ago)  , trying to become a cubi (Hey , 3000+ years sure is better than 70, not even considering other advantages !)

As you can tell he is somewhat of a showoff as well, although the eyes do have the advantage of not being able to tell where he is looking... As well as the steel spiky shoulderpads trying to cover up the fact that he has less than impressive figure


The thing in his hand is an issue of "Mad Science weekly" - a popular magazine around those parts of Furrae between all such inclined

[Tapewolf]

There are several tricks to get rid of the white fringes.  You can probably do it via Layer->Transparency->Colour to Alpha, but that's not a technique I usually use.

The quickest way, which I use for PF, is to use Colours->Threshold on the original lineart and convert it to pure black/white rather than greyscales.  Then, when you flood-fill it, it will go right to the edge instead of stopping when it gets sufficiently grey to halt.

[VAE]

Hmm, i will try the alpha one... i spent about an hour out of the colouring to hunt the fringes from around the letters, and pencil edges - it was the single most time consuming part of the colouring.
EDIT: Hmm, just changing it to alpha channel does not do it for this case,,,

BTW , this sounds stupid , but do you know some clever way of making speech bubbles?
The problem is if i draw them beforehand on paper, the size is not right for typed words, while if i want to make them in GIMP, they have (by me ) ugly shapes, and i constantly need to erase stuff from under them...

[Tapewolf]

Hmm, i will try the alpha one... i spent about an hour out of the colouring to hunt the fringes from around the letters, and pencil edges - it was the single most time consuming part of the colouring.
EDIT: Hmm, just changing it to alpha channel does not do it for this case,,

The alpha technique is complicated.  You need to use two layers, and again, it's not something that can really be done after the fact.  What Ren does is use Colour-to-alpha on White, which basically hollows out the line-art.
On the layer underneath, you then colour the relevant parts however you see fit.  The advantage of this is that you can be fairly messy and you'll still keep the outlines in place.

The thing about this technique is that the result resembles a hybrid of pencil and cell-shading, like this:
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/3435055/

...I also did that on PF for the SAIA flashback, however it didn't look as different to the regular strip as I'd hoped.

BTW , this sounds stupid , but do you know some clever way of making speech bubbles?
The problem is if i draw them beforehand on paper, the size is not right for typed words, while if i want to make them in GIMP, they have (by me ) ugly shapes, and i constantly need to erase stuff from under them...

For the last part, the trick is to use layers (it sounds like you aren't).  Have the speech bubbles on a layer of their own and then you can move or resize them to your heart's content without damaging the underlying image.
Personally?  I cheat and use a program called ComicLife which makes the framing and captioning considerably easier.
However, I use the Mac version.  I haven't tried the Win32 one under WINE yet.

http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/tapewolf/projectfuture/pf_dev.png
[Photobucket seems to be dying]

[VAE]

Ooh, that explains it!

hmm, so prepare a text bubble sideways and then paste it in? I will try it with next issue - use basic bubble then draw in the tail..
Also , after losing the last one, i got some cheap chinese rubbers which leave much less of a muck than the cheap chinese rubbers i was using before ... that should make it easier too (in fact that is what gave me the courage to try to colour this one )

[Drayco84]

I'm aware that this is currently rather off-topic, but for some reason, Vladim reminds me of a Shofixti...


Not that it's a bad thing or anything like that... The Shofixti were one of the more interesting races in the Star Control series, choosing to go out in "A Blaze of Glory", nearly causing their race to go extinct and taking out a large enough amount of Ur-Quan Kzer-Za ships. Unfortunately, this also gave the Ur-Quan Khor-Ah forces an advantage. (But hey, it's not like the Kzer-Za said "We're at war with the other half of our race and if they win, they will destroy all life in the galaxy save for Ur-Quan so we would prefer to encase you in a slave-shield for your own protection, as well as ours.")

[VAE]

Hmm, yet another awesome PC game i did not yet play....

[Drayco84]

Hmm, yet another awesome PC game i did not yet play....

To be honest, it was actually first published on the 3DO system. Some time ago, the source code was been released by the original creators to the fan community and was dubbed The Ur-Quan Masters due to issues with naming. It's available in most Linux distros and can be downloaded here.

[Turnsky]

hrm, allow me to weigh in with my two-cents. Forgive any bluntness, as i've had basics hammered into my head in a similar manner.

First off, figures. what you need to learn for starters is basic construction techniques, circles, stick figures, and other fun shapes.
http://www.drawfurry.com/?p=26 this here is a good place to start, also other tutorials on that site would be beneficial to you as well.

as for lineart cleanup and coloring? well, this old chestnut from back in the day is something that formed the basis of how i continue to work to this day: http://machall.comicgenesis.com/info/art.html

since you grace the chat sometimes, dan, if you can catch me there i can offer further insight as well if you so wish.

[WhiteFox]

I have to agree with about all of what Turnsky says. Planning out the figure is essential to drawing a character. It's incredibly hard to get proportions and anatomy right without it. There are, however, dozens of ways to draw a gesture, and I think every artist ends up developing their own.

I'm also in the chat on a regular basis. Drop me a line if you want to kibitz.

As for colouring, I figured out a quick and easy method:
(Note: This is a semi-rough that's been partially cleaned up. I usually take 10-15 minutes to clean up the linework, but that's not essential for this tutorial. This also doesn't cover any of the processing I do to a scanned image before cleaning it up or colouring it.)
(Diagram)
1: Take the layer with your inks/pencils/what-have-you, and set the "Mode"  to "Multiply."
3: Put a layer for colour underneath. Take a pencil tool (NOT the brush!), outline areas of colour.
4: Fill them in. (This is why I use a pencil tool.)
5: Touch up any spots where the the colour went over the lines. (EG: nose, most of the hair, etc.)

I use Photoshop CS4, but it should work the same way for GIMP. (I checked; the layer mode in GIMP works exactly the same as it does in CS4)

All told, just doing this face took me less then three minutes. (But then, I'm using a tablet. Still, it's a pretty quick method.) Adding shadows and such is a much more lengthly process.

I scan an image at 4x the size of the final (300dpi), and shrink it down when I'm done. This makes a lot of faults and mistakes evaporate (Shrunk version of the above diagram.). Notice how many rough spots in the large version look fine in the smaller one. The lines for the jaw, ears, and eyebrow all look much better. The spot where the frizz at the corner of the jaw overlaps the red hair looks much better in the shrunk version.

[VAE]

Just as an hopefully entertaining aside, a rather sketchy depiction of a scene which occured at the IC Apples to Apples game, starring Glup  , and Farin Falmuth, Liatai's rogue who unwisely decided to cheat in the presence of a camera-endowed robot, while previously calling Glup a lobster several times (about the same as calling someone an ape)
What happens when a level 6 rogue annoys a level 23 psionic creature  

Also, i attempted to use the stickfigure outline for his standing position , so i hope it looks a little better than my usual drawings.
 

EDIT:

Added another drawing  from the IC Apples to Apples game - Crystal being rather unimpressed by Vladim's "hands-free" cards dealing
And in the meantime. glup is taking a drink...
I figured that since i will need to be able to draw crystal properly eventually for a (currently, far) future cameo, i might as well try ... hopefully she resembles herself

EDIT2:
And here comes sweet revenge.... Glup has fallen asleep as apparently alcoholic beverages affect crustaceans rather strongly and Farin has taken it as a revenge opportunity, not to mention Chairoum....
Again this shows just how poorly i can draw hands... good old tentacled glup!
no matter how big, a sleeping enemy is a doddle... lucky that glup is pretty much immune to dagger stings


EDIT3:
And so, i decided to put one more... this time in a moment just after Vladim having a fit.... this will probably be funny or interesting only to Liatai and meany.... Also , crystal is the only one who looks decent on the picture despite shrinkage.... i suck at colouring....
This rain isn't chocolate...
Tapewolf- the alpha channel idea was awesome! saved me soo much time...

[Chairtastic]

Awww.   They're friends now.  How adorable.  Seriously though,  that's some serious coolness right there.  I particularly like the detail you give Glup from this angle.  Some karma-chameleon points for you!

Also:

...Liatai's rogue who unwisely decided to cheat in the presence of a camera-endowed robot...

Yay!  Chair gets mentions!

[Liatai]

Pfft! Foot-in-mouth syndrome, indeed! Farin does seem to have a habit of ticking off people who are stronger than him. Man, that was fun.

He didn't actually know it was an insult; Farin just tends to call people he's on somewhat good terms with "___-man" or "___-lady." (For example, Crystal is "cat-lady" when she's not "that **** creepy broad." ) So when Glup got mad from being called "lobster-man," he was like "What. What'd I do. What. Huh? "

They look good! I love Glup drinking from a straw in the second one. It's just a little amusing detail that completes the picture for me.

[Chairtastic]

My my!  Someone's been a busy bee!   In the Sweet Revenge image, what is Chair doing with his hands?   My memory is a bit fuzzy.  Dossie's little smirk in the eclair incident makes me giggle.   See?  Bravo, Danman.

Also, the beret in the third was an excellent touch.

[VAE]

Vladim 2.0  (making him look a bit more up to date) facial expressions part I

This might help a bit if anybody else wants to do sketches for the IC Apples&Apples game... KTHX to Liatai for whacking my head over with the idea that the shoulderpads he had up to now were a relict from when i had no scanner by drawing them properly...
(yes, i have found out about a meme, and within two hours had to do at least a part of it... that's just me...)

Also, it seems that threshold-ing a drawing that is not to be coloured doesn't make it look better, just the opposite in fact
Edit: hmm, this looks way  worse today in the morning...

[GabrielsThoughts]

I don't know, his angry face seems more gleeful than angry, his sad face seems more appropriate for a confused expression, his pleased face seems to be the only one that actually matches the expression you were attempting to generate, and the happy face makes him look like he's plotting total global domination.  

I would recommend watching silent movies and "Lie to me" Tv series, but I think there are books that cover illustrated facial expressions as opposed to physical ones.

the six main expressions are Happy, Sad, Anger, Disgust, Confusion, Shock/fear, and Tired/relaxed. In theory, everything else is a mixture or exaggeration of these expressions although the first five seem more important than the last.  

[VAE]

Thanks!
I will be  redoing this anyway (actually have done a better first two while procrastinating from mechanics and thermofluids study)
You are right ... i am quite bad at faces so far...
Just a minor detail... plotting total global domination is pretty much his job description so that one seems appropriate
Shows how bad  i am... the pleased face i thought was done the worst

[VAE]

Because of the need to have a better image for the cast page which will eventually be linked into the mess of pages there are, i did a (hopefully) better line art of Vladim yesterday, while looking at an actual lynx picture, and decided to colour it today.
It also replaced my avatar.
Twiddling thumbs is fun, regardless of position
Many thanks so far to Tapewolf and WhiteFox, this both took much less time to do (about 2 hours) and does not have white fringes.
I especially liked the colour to alpha method, after some tweaking (i copied the alpha onto another "canvas" and then pasted and merged it on, as many times as needed)
Since i am still a colouring  and drawing n00b, if you have advice/criticism feel free to comment
EDIT: as for that - yes i know there is an error on the fingers, and the ears lack internal colouring.. i will deal with it later tonight
Edit2: Done that while in bathroom

(To Meany and Liatai if they will read... The clothing improved a bit too, perhaps due to certain ms. Crystal Felarion... it will be such fun if he ever finds out she is police agent )
 

[Chairtastic]

I like this version of Vladim.  It makes him seem older, less "I just got out of college"-y.  While those shoulder-pads do look nice, don't they snag the cape when he turns quickly?  Shame you didn't let him keep the fangies, though.    All in all, a nicely done picture; kudos.  Quick question,  does he always wear the robe, or will we occasionally see him on 'casual Fridays' around the base?

[VAE]

I like this version of Vladim.  It makes him seem older, less "I just got out of college"-y.  While those shoulder-pads do look nice, don't they snag the cape when he turns quickly?  Shame you didn't let him keep the fangies, though.    All in all, a nicely done picture; kudos.  Quick question,  does he always wear the robe, or will we occasionally see him on 'casual Fridays' around the base?

Firstly, he should have looked this way even before, just that my drawing was too sucky to actually pull it through.... this is sort of the way he should look... just now to actually figure out how his face should look n'all...

Second, the cape is tucked under on the back, so it should not tear.

Third... hmm, that gives me an idea... running out of robes... you see , clothing bill isn't exactly the biggest part of the budget, i think it took several hours for him to actually find the cape

Fourth: Fangs are generally visible only if he opens his mouth...