Oh... wow. Aniz was Destania's student? You know... did anyone ever raise that idea? I don't think I've ever seen it. Is it possible Aniz snapped because of what he saw and learned there?
But I will say this about Destania: she's being honest about her job. Is she trying to offer Abel the chance to learn everything she taught Aniz so that Abel could potentially pay Aniz back for what he did to his son? Or is this some chance for Destania to get revenge on an old student/failure of hers?
Quote from: Jairus on March 12, 2009, 01:03:13 AM
Oh... wow. Aniz was Destania's student? You know... did anyone ever raise that idea? I don't think I've ever seen it. Is it possible Aniz snapped because of what he saw and learned there?
But I will say this about Destania: she's being honest about her job. Is she trying to offer Abel the chance to learn everything she taught Aniz so that Abel could potentially pay Aniz back for what he did to his son? Or is this some chance for Destania to get revenge on an old student/failure of hers?
I know I sure wasn't expecting that, especially not with Destania apparently wanting to make Abel destroy him--I guess I considered the possibility that it was personal, but I guess I didn't realize Destania was so much...OLDER than Aniz....
Wow, I wonder where this is going to go now....
What I noticed about this page is that, despite the fact that she is talking about pain and terror, that she taught Aniz.. Abel has spoken more to her now than he has since he woke up - And, really, his first coherent speech.
One wonders if this meeting wasn't engineered by Fa'Lina to get him interested, instead of simply sitting there mute. Sure, on the last page(#47), it would seem as if Destania showed up of her own accord, but with Fa'Lina controlling things, the last panel may have simply been a show for Abel's benefit.
Just my 2c.
I guess it's easy to say that this comic (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_811.php) comes back to mind...
Quote from: techmaster-glitch on March 12, 2009, 01:42:42 AM
I guess it's easy to say that this comic (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_811.php) comes back to mind...
Oh... oh... I did not think of that. Now
that is a good reason for Abel to despise Destania. Dang. Just... dang. Good catch, techie.
Also...
QuoteI lied!
There are no rants! NOOOOONE!
All there is is Zule!
-Amber
I lol'ed.
Quote from: Jairus on March 12, 2009, 01:44:31 AM
Also...
QuoteI lied!
There are no rants! NOOOOONE!
All there is is Zule!
-Amber
I lol'ed.
*plays the end keys of the piano* They hate you when you do that...
Quote from: Jairus on March 12, 2009, 01:03:13 AM
Oh... wow. Aniz was Destania's student? You know... did anyone ever raise that idea?
I don't think I've ever seen it. Is it possible Aniz snapped because of what he saw and learned there?
She teaches at the Academy, Aniz was a student there. Is it so surprising that he might have taken her courses?
QuoteBut I will say this about Destania: she's being honest about her job. Is she trying to offer Abel the chance to learn everything she taught Aniz so that Abel could potentially pay Aniz back for what he did to his son?
Unlikely because she went and invaded his dreams. Looks to me like she already had the agenda and saw Abel as an opportunity. I still think it's an inter-clan thing.
QuoteOr is this some chance for Destania to get revenge on an old student/failure of hers?
Most unlikely. Dee's been at the Academy for about 7000 years. Aniz cannot have been the first student who didn't meet the mark, and if she systematically destroyed (or had destroyed by proxy) all students who flunked her course, she'd:
1. Create a very bad diplomatic situation for her clan if not an outright war
2. Probably be killed herself by Fa'Lina since the idea is to nurture young 'Cubi not snack on them
3. Stop clans from wanting their children to study at the Academy at all
It can also be argued from 713 that
Abel failed her, most likely by not carrying out her will regarding Aniz IMHO.
An interesting point is that in AS 95 and 96 (93 & 94), Aniz says that having a fear of blood would be a disadvantage if 'she' is involved. At the time there was speculation as to who that was - I'm thinking it's probably Dee.
Going to have to de-lurk on this one because I just had a thought (and forgive me if it's already been brought up) but this comic reminded me back in #527 when Ink was bugging Abel "Here I was thinking you actually cared about his welfare since he happens to be Edward Ti'Fiona's son..." I was always wondering why would he care about an adventurer...
Could it be because he made Destania stop being evil? I mean we saw back then the comics where she simply said it was her laws to kill Edward and next thing we knew, she was married and starting a new life with Dan's birth... but until now, don't think we've ever had a scope of how... can't beat around the bush, just plain evil she is at this point and time.
I find it interesting that Destania (not Dee. Dee is after she has Dan.) is wearing lipstick, here. Comparing it to her in 704 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_704.php), 933 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_933.php), and 936 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_936.php), it's an interesting change...
Other than that, it's all up in the air. And what Amber has done here is an interesting twist - but not massively surprising. We knew Aniz was young (AS2#012 (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_012.php) says 464), and Amber has said Destania's, ah, mature. Experienced. Definitely not old - at least, not within her hearing. ;-] Over 7000. We presume much of that has been spent at the Academy, teaching, but we really don't know.
Incidentally, taking Tapewolf's commentary on 713, it can also be argued that her plans for Aniz changed with the birth of Dan. Or that Aniz was killed by an adventurer - Edward, possibly, given Ink's commentary (thanks, Royden. I was just typing this and you had to chime in. ;-] ) to Abel. We have no real information either way, though, so it's all just speculation...
So I guess Aniz was the one that's hot for teacher?
Quote from: Michael Chandra on March 12, 2009, 07:20:27 AM
So I guess Aniz was the one that's hot for teacher?
doubtful, if anything Destania would scare him, something tells me that Aniz has a few marbles left in his skull to know to not tick off things that could hang his pelt above a fireplace without batting an eyelid.
wonder if dan hears all this he would kill his mom. he probbably didnt take abels seriously because he thought Abel wass evil.
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 12, 2009, 04:30:19 AM
QuoteOr is this some chance for Destania to get revenge on an old student/failure of hers?
Most unlikely. Dee's been at the Academy for about 7000 years. Aniz cannot have been the first student who didn't meet the mark, and if she systematically destroyed (or had destroyed by proxy) all students who flunked her course, she'd:
1. Create a very bad diplomatic situation for her clan if not an outright war
2. Probably be killed herself by Fa'Lina since the idea is to nurture young 'Cubi not snack on them
3. Stop clans from wanting their children to study at the Academy at all
It can also be argued from 713 that Abel failed her, most likely by not carrying out her will regarding Aniz IMHO.
An interesting point is that in AS 95 and 96 (93 & 94), Aniz says that having a fear of blood would be a disadvantage if 'she' is involved. At the time there was speculation as to who that was - I'm thinking it's probably Dee.
I didn't quite mean failure in the sense of a student flunking her courses. More the kind of failure that goes beyond that, though how someone who teaches Pain and Terror could find someone going beyond the pale into the arena where they feel like killing that person raises other questions. Maybe because he started using those techniques on his own family. Destania never seems to have used those techniques on her own family, so Aniz might have violated some sense of standard she has (though where someone who wanted to use children and infants gets off having
standards is beyond me).
But yeah, inter-clan rivalry makes sense too. As for the fear of blood, I'm sure there are lots of techniques that involve no bloodshed whatsoever.
Quote from: RedMoonAi on March 12, 2009, 10:27:00 AM
wonder if dan hears all this he would kill his mom. he probbably didnt take abels seriously because he thought Abel wass evil.
Dan seemed... a little shaken by what Abel told him, and offhand he didn't dismiss it entirely because Fi then backed up what Abel had said. Dan went to the Twink Territories to confront his mom on her old activities, and has just gotten a little side-tracked.
Quote from: RedMoonAi on March 12, 2009, 10:27:00 AM
wonder if dan hears all this he would kill his mom. he probbably didnt take abels seriously because he thought Abel wass evil.
No - Fi backed him up. I think Dan believes that his mother is (or at least,
was) evil. You've also got Aary's report from the Oracles about how her (old) life ended, though precisely how that information was imparted to Dan is unclear.
Finally, the whole current arc appears to have kicked off because Dan went to the Twink Territories to confront his mother about her evil past.
On a less weighty matter, it seems that Abel and Destania are around the same height. For some reason, I always thought of Destania as being taller than most. (although, I suppose if one can shapeshift, height isn't something locked in stone)
Hmm, evil Destania. That outfit doesn't really suit her.
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on March 12, 2009, 11:47:53 AM
On a less weighty matter, it seems that Abel and Destania are around the same height. For some reason, I always thought of Destania as being taller than most. (although, I suppose if one can shapeshift, height isn't something locked in stone)
You have to remember that she managed to pass herself off as Biggs (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_873.php). So it's quite obvious that her height can change.
Actually, that's probably why. Most of the time we see her in her "base" form, she's standing next to biggs, and consequently appears tall.
Quote from: Zedd on March 12, 2009, 03:49:24 AM
Quote from: Jairus on March 12, 2009, 01:44:31 AM
Also...
QuoteI lied!
There are no rants! NOOOOONE!
All there is is Zule!
-Amber
I lol'ed.
*plays the end keys of the piano* They hate you when you do that...
What a lovely singing voice you must have.
And maybe this explains a little of why present-day Abel thinks Dee is evil?
Time to boggle our minds: Destania was May all along for the sake of stringing along Aniz and put him deeper into his madness.
As to how she managed to simultaneously teach, I suggest that she had a doppelganger fill in.
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on March 12, 2009, 01:32:48 PM
Most of the time we see her in her "base" form, she's standing next to biggs, and consequently appears tall.
And in the panels where she's sitting or standing next to Alexsi, they seem to be fairly close in height.
Incidentally, did anyone else read a non-existent "not" in the middle of Destania's second speech bubble in the top panel? Had to read it a couple of times before I realised what sounded so odd about her statement.
Is Destania calling this floor HAPPY HAPPY JOY JOY FLOOR?
Falina did say that they seem to group in a certain way. Is it their affinity to a certain emotion that usually makes the school group.
Destania is certainly straightforward here -- rather creepily so. She's probably correct about Aniz -- at that time, Aniz hadn't been out of SAIA all that many years, and probably was still largely "going by the book". But how he was applying it, why, and to whom was kinda effed up though.
BTW, I forget sometimes how large Fa'lina is. I seem to remember a picture showing Fa'lina in full triwing mode. Would anyone have that handy?
Of course there's always the possibility that she's lying to cause Abel pain and despair.
"Go for the pain! I taught you that!"
So that would now be two old and powerful cubi responsible for the death of his friend? At the very least she might be exaggerating, or claiming credit where none is due.
And why exactly does Fa'Lina allow such things in her academy?
Because it's natural for many cubi?
Quote from: ANTIcarrot on March 12, 2009, 05:52:26 PM
And why exactly does Fa'Lina allow such things in her academy?
Short answer: clan politics. Why would a clan with a pain or fear affinity send their kids to a school that taught nothing about their most basic cubi capabilities? So the curriculum must cover the full spectrum of cubi affinities for SAIA (and thus Fa'lina) to get the support of all clans.
Longer answer: Fa'lina's *really* long range plans for the future. By having *all* the cubi children at SAIA, they get exposed to each other, to the wide range of courses, and to all the different ways of life of each clan and the variations of each individual student. Perhaps in hopes of "deprogramming" some of the students a bit from their particular upbringing and clan indoctrination. (At least this is how I understand what she's up to.)
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 12, 2009, 10:32:12 AM
Quote from: RedMoonAi on March 12, 2009, 10:27:00 AM
wonder if dan hears all this he would kill his mom. he probbably didnt take abels seriously because he thought Abel wass evil.
No - Fi backed him up. I think Dan believes that his mother is (or at least, was) evil. You've also got Aary's report from the Oracles about how her (old) life ended, though precisely how that information was imparted to Dan is unclear.
Finally, the whole current arc appears to have kicked off because Dan went to the Twink Territories to confront his mother about her evil past.
Mmm, considering 874 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_874.php), I'm not so sure of that:
Fi: Ugh...did you...find your mom?
Dan: No! But this might be better! *snip* Smacking some baddies is just what I--
And it was Alexsi's flashback that really explained about Destania's change of heart, and consequent starting a new life.
Quote from: SpottedKitty on March 12, 2009, 02:50:08 PM
Incidentally, did anyone else read a non-existent "not" in the middle of Destania's second speech bubble in the top panel? Had to read it a couple of times before I realised what sounded so odd about her statement.
Yep, I made that mistake myself.
Quote from: Tycoon on March 12, 2009, 02:47:41 PM
Time to boggle our minds: Destania was May all along for the sake of stringing along Aniz and put him deeper into his madness.
As to how she managed to simultaneously teach, I suggest that she had a doppelganger fill in.
That would make Dan and Able half-brothers, and Able full-blooded 'Cubi. Which is not consistant with his appearance. No, I don't buy it.
Quote from: Royden on March 12, 2009, 05:10:59 AM
Going to have to de-lurk on this one because I just had a thought (and forgive me if it's already been brought up) but this comic reminded me back in #527 when Ink was bugging Abel "Here I was thinking you actually cared about his welfare since he happens to be Edward Ti'Fiona's son..." I was always wondering why would he care about an adventurer...
Could it be because he made Destania stop being evil? I mean we saw back then the comics where she simply said it was her laws to kill Edward and next thing we knew, she was married and starting a new life with Dan's birth... but until now, don't think we've ever had a scope of how... can't beat around the bush, just plain evil she is at this point and time.
Yeah, the gulf between Destinia and Dee is huge. Though it is largely a matter of changing who she cares about, and how much. The Dragons are going to regret hauling Dee back into the vendetta by capturing Edward.
Quote from: SpottedKitty on March 12, 2009, 02:50:08 PM
(snip)
(snip)
Incidentally, did anyone else read a non-existent "not" in the middle of Destania's second speech bubble in the top panel? Had to read it a couple of times before I realised what sounded so odd about her statement.
I read it right. It's an accurate statement about her work and what she thinks of it. Nothing odd about it. :kruger
With regards,
Ted
Does anybody besides me really not like Destania? Not in the sense that she's handled poorly or a badly-done character, but in that she just comes off as really vile and despicable?
I kinda thought that was the point.
Isn't that the reason for liking Destania? That she's a horrible genocidal bitch?
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 12, 2009, 08:04:08 PMQuote from: Tycoon on March 12, 2009, 02:47:41 PM
Time to boggle our minds: Destania was May all along for the sake of stringing along Aniz and put him deeper into his madness.
As to how she managed to simultaneously teach, I suggest that she had a doppelganger fill in.
That would make Dan and Able half-brothers, and Able full-blooded 'Cubi. Which is not consistant with his appearance. No, I don't buy it.
How so? While I find the "May was really Destinia all along" theory to be unlikely, I don't know of anything in Abel's apperance that someone with both parents being cubi couldn't have.
Quote from: Azraelle on March 12, 2009, 10:00:47 PM
I kinda thought that was the point.
Quote from: Pagan on March 12, 2009, 10:01:05 PM
Isn't that the reason for liking Destania? That she's a horrible genocidal bitch?
:B I like how these two responses come like seconds after each other.
I'm still on the fence. I get the impression that she knows she's being watched and plays each character she interacts with for a desired reaction. I dislike the manipulation, I like the subtlety. I still haven't seen anything I would consider conclusive as to her "real" motives, and until I do, I'm going to reserve judgement.
Quote from: Tipod on March 12, 2009, 09:59:03 PM
Does anybody besides me really not like Destania? Not in the sense that she's handled poorly or a badly-done character, but in that she just comes off as really vile and despicable?
Junker officer vs SS officer. With Abel in the middle. :erk
With regards,
Ted
Quote from: Royden on March 12, 2009, 05:10:59 AM
Going to have to de-lurk on this one because I just had a thought (and forgive me if it's already been brought up) but this comic reminded me back in #527 when Ink was bugging Abel "Here I was thinking you actually cared about his welfare since he happens to be Edward Ti'Fiona's son..." I was always wondering why would he care about an adventurer...
Could it be because he made Destania stop being evil? I mean we saw back then the comics where she simply said it was her laws to kill Edward and next thing we knew, she was married and starting a new life with Dan's birth... but until now, don't think we've ever had a scope of how... can't beat around the bush, just plain evil she is at this point and time.
I dunno. I'm thinking any initial interest Abel would have in Dan's casefile, so to speak, would be spurred by the apparent similarities between the two.
Think about it:
- both are the product of...relations...between a Being and a Cubi;
- both grew up unaware, initially, of their Cubi heritage;
- both had their Cubi parent in their lives, growing up;
- both grew up in communities that tolerated Creatures to an extent;
- and, most importantly from Abel's perspective, both Aniz and Destania lived as Beings while their kids were growing up (or at least, that's probably how Abel would've seen it to start with - Dee might've been willing to admit that she was a Cubi if anyone asked, but I wouldn't be surprised if she went out of her way to make sure the subject never came up);
- and one last point: neither Aniz nor Destania ever told their kids that they had the potential for Cubi heritage.
And, with this in mind, remember that Abel's casting info tells us that he
really, really doesn't like people who hide behind secret identities, especially if they're pulling shenanigans like Aniz did.
Then consider how Dee's actions might look, from Abel's perspective. Consider what his initial reaction would be.
I'm thinking, he would've been willing to at least keep an eye on Dan to try and make sure that Destania didn't pull the same shenanigans Aniz did, and go all "surprise, you're a Cubi! Oh, and also, I shall kill your loved ones, threaten the survivors, and then teleport you to a new location, and threaten your surviving loved ones some more."
Also, Tipod, that...really is the point to Destania, at least before she leaves SAIA. Frankly, it's the point to any Cubi who was taught by her, and to any Cubi who feeds off of anger, fear, misery, or pain: they are terrible, rather sociopathic bastards who are willing to do whatever they feel it takes to get them the emotions they find tastiest. Abel said it himself, when Dan was worrying over his own apparent racism: Cubi, by and large,
are not nice people. Some of them feed off of the happy, fluffy emotions - just as many don't, and they're willing to make people bleed, scream, and die in agony if that's what it takes to get their delicious dark chocolate protein smoothie of emotion.
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 12, 2009, 08:04:08 PM
Quote from: Tycoon on March 12, 2009, 02:47:41 PM
Time to boggle our minds: Destania was May all along for the sake of stringing along Aniz and put him deeper into his madness.
As to how she managed to simultaneously teach, I suggest that she had a doppelganger fill in.
That would make Dan and Able half-brothers, and Able full-blooded 'Cubi. Which is not consistant with his appearance. No, I don't buy it.
That's even more ridiculous than the Aniz is Edward (http://dmfa.wikia.com/wiki/Edward-Aniz_Theory) theory.
I should have thought of this earlier, but I've been a bit slow today.
Initial assumption. Destania, for her morality or lack of it, is smart, and disciplined. Everything she says or does is calculated to get those around her to think, do, feel, or say something that should be beneficial to her.
If we work from that though, we get some odd findings. The way she's saying it, she seems to be taking credit for turning Aniz into what he is now. Considering that she's peeked into Abel's dreams and knows of his antipathy towards his father, that's going to leave Abel with some rather ugly sentiments towards her, once he gets out of his current shock state. (I'm making a secondary assumption that Abel shares the oft-seen ability in comic books and whatnot to recall what everyone says with perfect clarity forever, despite any factors which would diminish recall or information storage)
But I can't think of any reason for Destania to antagonize Abel, unless it's to be one of those "see how pointless anger is, be a manipulative bastard like me and work from the shadows" after she pushes Abel into some destructive fit of rage and snaps him out of it.
I need more data. I can't make bricks without clay. At times I feel like asking (whining) for DMFA to be put on hold indefinitely and just have Abel's story. :P
Quote from: Psy-Kosh on March 12, 2009, 10:16:16 PM
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 12, 2009, 08:04:08 PMQuote from: Tycoon on March 12, 2009, 02:47:41 PM
Time to boggle our minds: Destania was May all along for the sake of stringing along Aniz and put him deeper into his madness.
As to how she managed to simultaneously teach, I suggest that she had a doppelganger fill in.
That would make Dan and Able half-brothers, and Able full-blooded 'Cubi. Which is not consistant with his appearance. No, I don't buy it.
How so? While I find the "May was really Destania all along" theory to be unlikely, I don't know of anything in Abel's appearance that someone with both parents being Cubi couldn't have.
Citing Cubi Hybrid Genetics (http://www.missmab.com/Demo/HG02.php)
Quote
A kid born of a Cubi and non-Cubi parent will almost always resemble the non-Cubi parent physically.
Abel looks like May, except for the wings and his eye color, What you'd expect from a Cubi and non-Cubi pairing. If Abel's mother was Destania, you'd expect his coloring to reflect either Aniz or Destania, or both. And Abel would be Cyra clan, like Dan, because Cyra clan is stronger than Aniz's near-extinct clan.
So it's not what is in Abel's appearance, it's what
isn't there. There's nothing of Destania there. Whereas with Dan, Dan was not only born with wings,
they were the same color as his mom's. That Dan's eyes are the same color as Destania's may or may not be indicative, we don't know the eye colors on Edward's side, there could have been green lurking in there too.
From the flashbacks, Destania never bothered to hide her headwings until after Dan was born,
and from the circumstances of how she and Edward met, it would have been common knowledge that she was a Succubus. But after she started hiding her headwings, and became just the wife of the innkeeper and former adventurer, there would seldom have been any reason for anyone to mention it, nor for anyone to inquire about it. So, for most of the younger generations, Dan was just a boy with wings, like his mom. And it was a more tolerant time and place than Abel experienced.
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on March 12, 2009, 10:45:29 PM
I need more data. I can't make bricks without clay. At times I feel like asking (whining) for DMFA to be put on hold indefinitely and just have Abel's story. :P
Sometimes you just have to recognize that we don't have enough information to even speculate.
Quote from: AndersW on March 12, 2009, 10:35:56 PM
That's even more ridiculous than the Aniz is Edward (http://dmfa.wikia.com/wiki/Edward-Aniz_Theory) theory.
Oh yeah, about that. Has anyone called attention to the fact that in panel 3 of 297 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_297.php), Edwards left arm is visible enough that it's clear he's wearing nothing that would cover Aniz's clan mark?
funnyI would have thought Aniz was a special kind of cruel all his own... she may have showed him one or two techniques but I doubt Destania had anyhing to do with the finished pr0duct.
because the rule of @$$holes always applies to ass40735 ... and It's not that everyone has one.
I believe the saying goes "if your a (bung)hole on the internet, you're a (poop)hole in real life.
Therefore Aniz's demonstrated talent for being an 5#!7head in the outside world reflects his talent for being despitefully cruel and malicious in the school setting. You can't teach something like that, it may be learned but there was something there before Destania's influence.
Dan likely knew what Dee is. He just never really cared all that much. He also insisted that he didn't take after her by saying the ONLY thing he got from her was wings. What he ment he also didn't get was Cubi-ness.
I took that to mean the only thing there was of her that he could (and did) get was her wings, not that he got only part of her cubi heritage, but that he believed she was just a being.
Well I half expected this but hey if all fingers should be pointed is mostly the one who did the sin in the first place...
inuhanyo: ah, okay, fair enough then. So the main point is more "he doesn't look like either Aniz _or_ Destinia, and he should have looked like at least one of them if both of them were his parents"?
Quote from: Psy-Kosh on March 13, 2009, 06:07:03 AM
inuhanyo: ah, okay, fair enough then. So the main point is more "he doesn't look like either Aniz _or_ Destinia, and he should have looked like at least one of them if both of them were his parents"?
Exactly.
Quote from: Pagan on March 12, 2009, 10:01:05 PM
Isn't that the reason for liking Destania? That she's a horrible genocidal bitch?
*Charline nods* That's the same reason to like me! >:3 It also makes one ponder the emotion behind Abel's surprise at hearing that Dan was a Ti'Fiona from the venomous Dr. Ink. Did he already know who married Dan's dad back then?
Quote from: Alondro on March 13, 2009, 09:00:04 AM
Quote from: Pagan on March 12, 2009, 10:01:05 PM
Isn't that the reason for liking Destania? That she's a horrible genocidal bitch?
*Charline nods* That's the same reason to like me! >:3 It also makes one ponder the emotion behind Abel's surprise at hearing that Dan was a Ti'Fiona from the venomous Dr. Ink. Did he already know who married Dan's dad back then?
wait all this time and I finally realise something... Alondro do you have a disassociative identity or multiple personality disorder?
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 12, 2009, 11:33:50 PM
Quote from: AndersW on March 12, 2009, 10:35:56 PM
That's even more ridiculous than the Aniz is Edward (http://dmfa.wikia.com/wiki/Edward-Aniz_Theory) theory.
Oh yeah, about that. Has anyone called attention to the fact that in panel 3 of 297 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_297.php), Edwards left arm is visible enough that it's clear he's wearing nothing that would cover Aniz's clan mark?
His left arm is behind his back enough that it could just be that we can't see it. Every shot we have of Edward has his left forearm off-panel, covered, or in an inconvenient spot. If we had a clear shot of his left forearm we could finally kill this theory dead. (unless there is a clan marking there)
Quote from: AndersW on March 13, 2009, 10:49:04 AM
(snip)
His left arm is behind his back enough that it could just be that we can't see it. Every shot we have of Edward has his left forearm off-panel, covered, or in an inconvenient spot. If we had a clear shot of his left forearm we could finally kill this theory dead. (unless there is a clan marking there)
It would mean Edward is a incubus and of the same clan as Aniz. It would not prove Edward is Aniz. Of course, if we get a flashback at a tattooist. "I saw this adventurer with a really cool tattoo and I want to get one just like it." "You old enough, kid?" "Sure thing, here's my driver's license." "OK, kid. It's your money." "I'm going to be an adventurer, too." "Huh-uh. Just sit down there."
With regards,
Ted
Quote from: Ted Schiller on March 13, 2009, 11:45:57 AM
It would mean Edward is a incubus and of the same clan as Aniz. It would not prove Edward is Aniz.
The position of the mark is unique to individuals. While I guess it's possible that two clan members have the mark in the same place I would guess that's vanishingly improbable.
Quote from: Ted Schiller on March 13, 2009, 11:45:57 AM
Quote from: AndersW on March 13, 2009, 10:49:04 AM
(snip)
His left arm is behind his back enough that it could just be that we can't see it. Every shot we have of Edward has his left forearm off-panel, covered, or in an inconvenient spot. If we had a clear shot of his left forearm we could finally kill this theory dead. (unless there is a clan marking there)
It would mean Edward is a incubus and of the same clan as Aniz. It would not prove Edward is Aniz.
If the clan mark is in the same spot it is reasonable to assume that they are the same person. Because the chances of another cubi of the same clan that has there clan mark in the exact same spot as Aniz is extremely unlikely.
Edit: ninjaed by Tapewolf
Quote from: AndersW on March 13, 2009, 10:49:04 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 12, 2009, 11:33:50 PM
Quote from: AndersW on March 12, 2009, 10:35:56 PM
That's even more ridiculous than the Aniz is Edward (http://dmfa.wikia.com/wiki/Edward-Aniz_Theory) theory.
Oh yeah, about that. Has anyone called attention to the fact that in panel 3 of 297 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_297.php), Edwards left arm is visible enough that it's clear he's wearing nothing that would cover Aniz's clan mark?
His left arm is behind his back enough that it could just be that we can't see it. Every shot we have of Edward has his left forearm off-panel, covered, or in an inconvenient spot. If we had a clear shot of his left forearm we could finally kill this theory dead. (unless there is a clan marking there)
A bracer wraps around the forearm. In panel 3 enough of Edwards forearm is visible to show that it is
uncovered, if he was Aniz his clan mark would be exposed. A risk Aniz would not take.
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 13, 2009, 11:53:01 AM
Quote from: Ted Schiller on March 13, 2009, 11:45:57 AM
It would mean Edward is a incubus and of the same clan as Aniz. It would not prove Edward is Aniz.
The position of the mark is unique to individuals. While I guess it's possible that two clan members have the mark in the same place I would guess that's vanishingly improbable.
You made me think something weird. Would identical twin 'Cubi have clan marks on the same spot? (Do identical twins exist in Furrae at all?)
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 13, 2009, 10:28:57 PM
A bracer wraps around the forearm. In panel 3 enough of Edwards forearm is visible to show that it is uncovered, if he was Aniz his clan mark would be exposed. A risk Aniz would not take.
Why not? No-one in Lost Lake is liable to have heard of his crimes, or remembered them if they did. May is the only witness of his clan-mark and she may not have grasped its significance since she doesn't know what 'Cubi are.
If Edward is a 'Cubi, he's been going around wingless (else the guys in the first panel would have strung him up first) and everyone thinks he's a Being. If he has a clan-mark - especially on his wrist - people who don't recognise the symbol (and Aniz' clanmark is rare enough) are going to write it off as a tattoo, just like May did with Abel's.
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on March 13, 2009, 10:36:39 PM
You made me think something weird. Would identical twin 'Cubi have clan marks on the same spot? (Do identical twins exist in Furrae at all?)
Amber would have to answer that, I think.
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 14, 2009, 07:28:27 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 13, 2009, 10:28:57 PM
A bracer wraps around the forearm. In panel 3 enough of Edwards forearm is visible to show that it is uncovered, if he was Aniz his clan mark would be exposed. A risk Aniz would not take.
Why not? No-one in Lost Lake is liable to have heard of his crimes, or remembered them if they did. May is the only witness of his clan-mark and she may not have grasped its significance since she doesn't know what 'Cubi are.
If Edward is a 'Cubi, he's been going around wingless (else the guys in the first panel would have strung him up first) and everyone thinks he's a Being. If he has a clan-mark - especially on his wrist - people who don't recognise the symbol (and Aniz' clanmark is rare enough) are going to write it off as a tattoo, just like May did with Abel's.
And Aniz kept his clan mark covered all the while he was being Cid. He only uncovered it to show Abel when he dropped the masquerade.
In panels 1 & 2, Edward is standing right in front of Destania, with his back to her. Incredibly risky if he were Aniz, Destania would be all to likely to get at least a glimpse of his clan mark and that would be enough to make her want to check it. Cover blown.
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 14, 2009, 09:27:56 AM
And Aniz kept his clan mark covered all the while he was being Cid. He only uncovered it to show Abel when he dropped the masquerade.
On the other hand, Cid didn't have the tattoo. May didn't seem to approve of Abel getting his so she might not have liked the idea of 'Cid' getting one either. Also, Aniz knew full well that if his plan succeeded, Abel would get the mark himself - the same mark as his father's - which would have screwed things up somewhat.
QuoteIn panels 1 & 2, Edward is standing right in front of Destania, with his back to her. Incredibly risky if he were Aniz, Destania would be all to likely to get at least a glimpse of his clan mark and that would be enough to make her want to check it. Cover blown.
Very much so,
if Aniz was expecting Destania to show up (for simplicity I'm assuming this is Aniz). But he wasn't.
IMHO the only reason she was likely to encounter him at all is if she comes looking for him and if that's the case - if she knows where he lives - hiding his clanmark is probably not going to help against the likes of her.
**EDIT**
Other possibilities include that he's just decided to stop running and confront her where Destania is concerned. It is also possible that the reason she found his location at all is because he grew careless about the mark and word made its way to Biggs' family.
I have an interesting theory on the whole Edward/Abel relationship....
What if Abel is really the great(x5) uncle of edward?
Provided Abel's mom wasn't capped, it's not entirely difficult to belive that she found another man (a few years later, granted, but still), and got a normal being child from that? And given that it's been 330 years or so in events....well, the family tree grew bigger.
Thus, Edward Ti'Fiona might be the nephew to Abel, who married the mentor of Abel's Father. Thus histories collide.
It would also explain the reaction Abel gave to Dr. Ink; "Don't Talk about my (great)nephew!" (maybe?)
Quote from: Draken on March 14, 2009, 08:25:37 PM
Provided Abel's mom wasn't capped, it's not entirely difficult to belive that she found another man (a few years later, granted, but still), and got a normal being child from that?
She was getting on in years, though I suppose it's not entirely impossible. She was, after all, supposedly a somewhat loose woman in her youth...
Quote from: GabrielsThoughts on March 13, 2009, 09:45:01 AM
Quote from: Alondro on March 13, 2009, 09:00:04 AM
Quote from: Pagan on March 12, 2009, 10:01:05 PM
Isn't that the reason for liking Destania? That she's a horrible genocidal bitch?
*Charline nods* That's the same reason to like me! >:3 It also makes one ponder the emotion behind Abel's surprise at hearing that Dan was a Ti'Fiona from the venomous Dr. Ink. Did he already know who married Dan's dad back then?
wait all this time and I finally realise something... Alondro do you have a disassociative identity or multiple personality disorder?
A little bit of column A, a little bit of column B, and a whole lot of chemicals from lab work.
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 14, 2009, 09:48:26 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 14, 2009, 09:27:56 AM
And Aniz kept his clan mark covered all the while he was being Cid. He only uncovered it to show Abel when he dropped the masquerade.
On the other hand, Cid didn't have the tattoo. May didn't seem to approve of Abel getting his so she might not have liked the idea of 'Cid' getting one either. Also, Aniz knew full well that if his plan succeeded, Abel would get the mark himself - the same mark as his father's - which would have screwed things up somewhat.
Do we know the timing between Abel's mark showing (May noticing it) and Cid/Aniz coming home and revealing himself? If it were at least a number of days, if not weeks, Aniz would have had opportunity to see it himself and would then be
expecting the upcoming sprouting of headwings. Otherwise, he was still only
hoping for an incubus son. What was Cid's job? Would he be home nightly or less frequently?
Regarding May meeting somebody after the episode with Aniz beating her up, there is always the type of scenario as the following.
Aniz suffers from multiple personalities (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_031.php).
The Cid personality is actually caring and loving.
The Aniz personality is even more of a bastard than the normal cubi.
*****
The Cid personality loves May and Abel and is a good father and husband.
The appearance of the second set of wings on Abel triggers the Aniz personality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_81.php). The Aniz personality kills Hennya, beats up May and Abel, and then takes Abel to SAIA.
The Cid personality returns while he is at SAIA, and the last meeting between Fa'lina and Aniz represents the Cid personality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_018.php). Upon leaving SAIA, he adopts the identity of Edward Ti'Fionia and befriends May. Since he is once again loving and protective, he takes care of May for the rest of her life, promising to protect her from that bounder Aniz if he ever shows up.
******
Of course, some other comments in this forum would have you believe that Devin's father was a third personality of Aniz.
*****
Once you get past this point, the idea becomes rather convoluted and hard to believe. When discussing this topic, I feel a little bit like Ink (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_527.php) (In itself, that is a disturbing thought.).
Quote from: Naldru on March 15, 2009, 01:30:51 PM
Regarding May meeting somebody after the episode with Aniz beating her up, there is always the type of scenario as the following.
Aniz suffers from multiple personalities (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_031.php).
Of course, some other comments in this forum would have you believe that Devlin's father was a third personality of Aniz.
If you meant Devin, I'm starting to think his father was an Angel, given the problems they have siring more Angels.
QuoteOnce you get past this point, the idea becomes rather convoluted and hard to believe. When discussing this topic, I feel a little bit like Ink (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_527.php) (In itself, that is a disturbing thought.).
Oh yes. It's possible to push anything too far - the trick is to try and find the happy medium.
Remember: the improbable is not the impossible. Devin's resurrection should have taught us that :P
Quote from: AmigaDragon on March 15, 2009, 01:39:27 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on March 14, 2009, 09:48:26 AM
Quote from: inuhanyo on March 14, 2009, 09:27:56 AM
And Aniz kept his clan mark covered all the while he was being Cid. He only uncovered it to show Abel when he dropped the masquerade.
On the other hand, Cid didn't have the tattoo. May didn't seem to approve of Abel getting his so she might not have liked the idea of 'Cid' getting one either. Also, Aniz knew full well that if his plan succeeded, Abel would get the mark himself - the same mark as his father's - which would have screwed things up somewhat.
Do we know the timing between Abel's mark showing (May noticing it) and Cid/Aniz coming home and revealing himself? If it were at least a number of days, if not weeks, Aniz would have had opportunity to see it himself and would then be expecting the upcoming sprouting of headwings. Otherwise, he was still only hoping for an incubus son. What was Cid's job? Would he be home nightly or less frequently?
May noticed Abel's clan mark in 28 (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_28.php), but Abel said it had showed up two years earlier. That would have been when Abel was 22.
#28 was the start of a sequence with Abel's family sitting down do breakfast, and "Cid" was present. Abel got the letter notifying him of Cindy's death and her funeral the next Friday. It was during the trip back that Abel's head wings popped.
Quote from: Naldru on March 15, 2009, 01:30:51 PM
Regarding May meeting somebody after the episode with Aniz beating her up, there is always the type of scenario as the following.
Aniz suffers from multiple personalities (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_031.php).
The Cid personality is actually caring and loving.
The Aniz personality is even more of a bastard than the normal cubi.
*****
The Cid personality loves May and Abel and is a good father and husband.
The appearance of the second set of wings on Abel triggers the Aniz personality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_81.php). The Aniz personality kills Hennya, beats up May and Abel, and then takes Abel to SAIA.
The Cid personality returns while he is at SAIA, and the last meeting between Fa'lina and Aniz represents the Cid personality (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_018.php). Upon leaving SAIA, he adopts the identity of Edward Ti'Fionia and befriends May. Since he is once again loving and protective, he takes care of May for the rest of her life, promising to protect her from that bounder Aniz if he ever shows up.
******
Of course, some other comments in this forum would have you believe that Devin's father was a third personality of Aniz.
*****
Once you get past this point, the idea becomes rather convoluted and hard to believe. When discussing this topic, I feel a little bit like Ink (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_527.php) (In itself, that is a disturbing thought.).
Actually, I was thinking that she met up with a NORMAL Being person (not aniz at all), and through the centuries, Edward ended up being her great(multiple)grand son. Thus leaving Dan to be related to Abel on his mother's side only.
Hmm, I skimmed through the replies, and if I'm not mistaken, this (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_019.php) page hasn't been brought up. I might be wrong, though.
Looks like Aniz doesn't have much respect for his old teacher.
So, hmm. I wonder what Destania did to upset him. Probably something malicious, as the case seems to be with her.
Quote from: Kittastrophe on March 15, 2009, 02:59:05 PM
Hmm, I skimmed through the replies, and if I'm not mistaken, this (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_019.php) page hasn't been brought up. I might be wrong, though.
Looks like Aniz doesn't have much respect for his old teacher.
Judging from Destania's later behaviour, I'd say that
she was pissed at him. Though we have no clue why.
Destania stated that she wants revenge on Aniz because of the pain he caused Fa'lina. (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_047.php)
Aniz is sorry because of something that his clan did to Fa'lina. (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Ab_018.php) Presumably, the fact that he was involved in his clan's activities is the reason for his period of banishment.
The point is that both Aniz and Destania are unhappy because of the pain experienced by Fa'lina. My gut feeling was as follows:
Destania dislikes Aniz because of his actions. Aniz dislikes Aniz because of his actions. Aniz can't bear to be with Destania because of how it reminds him how it hurt the people at SAIA. Destania hates Aniz's clan , but her dislike for Aniz is personal because Destania feels betrayed. I think Destania and Aniz really like each other, but their feuding clans have pushed them apart.