Heya, folks.
Those of you smaller than the bigger countries in the alliance have something to offer.
Apparently, there's this guy who has been screwing up enough that he's been ZI'd and is on numerous people's shitlists.
So. Having annoyed Elysium enough to get nailed once, they've come back under a new name and said "hey, ah, I'm not that other guy, I'm a whole new guy, and I want to start up the alliance totally new with the old name. Honest!"
... his IP has been traced, etc etc.
So. Since Tezket asked me to go talk to Elysium and see if they wanted help, mhawk says we can help!
http://www.cybernations.net/stats_alliance_stats_custom.asp?Alliance=Blitzkrieg
The biggest one in the alliance is ~4k strength.
I'm about 24k. Tez is around 30, last time I checked. So we could do some reasonable damage, here. And since the big guys can stand around passing aid down, we can make a pretty mess. And there's all the other folks in Elysium and the Poseidon Treaty who are happy to carry the can if the shit hits the fan. So...
Any of you folks feel like kicking some righteous butt? ;-]
(the Elysium forum has some further details of the conversation, if you're interested go here (http://z15.invisionfree.com/CnElysium/index.php?showtopic=399&st=0&#last)...)
Hmm... I gotta wait to be masked before I can see the details on their forum. Is this a specific person they want downed?
Only our three smallest guys are currently in range to hit any of them them. Ah well, could be good practice, maybe...
The entire alliance, as I understand it.
I can copy/paste the entire conversation with mhawk, if you like.
Well... I haven't been masked yet over there, so that would help. I'd rather like our first proper declaration of war as an alliance to have a casus belli more solid than "there's this guy who's supposedly another guy our friends don't like"... :animesweat
(Not that I wouldn't do it anyway, mind you, but it always helps to at least maintain the illusion of moral high ground in war. >:])
This first bit was in the Elysium channel on Coldfront:
Quote
19:13 * llearch checks for signs of life
19:14 * ImaNewbie[BAPS] tries to not give a reading
19:14 <+llearch> heh
19:15 <+llearch> We was wondering if some help was wanted against FCO.
19:15 <+llearch> chances are not, but we thought we'd be polite and all, and ask. Having just signed a treaty...
19:16 <~mhawk> howdy
And then in PM:
Quote
19:16 <mhawk> we have all our targets anarchied
19:17 <mhawk> so its going pretty well
19:17 <llearch> figured.
19:17 <mhawk> however we do have a target that we are too large to hit
19:17 <mhawk> blitzkrieg
19:17 <llearch> oh?
19:17 <mhawk> http://www.cybernations.net/stats_alliance_stats_custom.asp?Alliance=Blitzkrieg
19:18 <llearch> 3,931.250 (My nation strength is: 24,268.148)
19:18 <llearch> A touch under me.
19:18 <llearch> ;-]
19:19 <mhawk> yeah
19:19 <mhawk> thats the issue we had
19:19 <llearch> I'll ask our smaller countries if they're interested.
19:19 <mhawk> if they want they can hit it
19:19 <mhawk> you are masked as pegasus correct?
19:19 <mhawk> so you can see the CB
19:20 <llearch> should be.
19:20 <mhawk> k
19:20 <llearch> on where? CN forum? or PEACE?
19:20 <mhawk> on the elysium forums
19:20 <llearch> mmkay. Yeah, I should be.
19:21 <llearch> I'll wave it in front of our players.
19:21 <mhawk> ok just updated your masking
19:21 <mhawk> here is the link to the CB
19:21 <mhawk> http://z15.invisionfree.com/CnElysium/index.php?showtopic=399&st=0&#last
19:31 <llearch> mmm.
19:32 <llearch> As I read the Pegasus Treaty, if we attack, we don't get protection. Not that this is likely to be necessary, but I can see some folks getting antsy.
19:33 <llearch> The only exception to this is if we are requested to by the Flag Alliance (running from memory here)
19:34 <mhawk> well this is an opt in thing for you guys
19:34 <llearch> *goes and looks it up*
19:34 <mhawk> we're posting the dow later once we figure out which nations are going in
19:34 <llearch> Hmm. Ok, if you're attacking, we can "opt in".
19:34 <mhawk> you guys dont have to do anything
19:34 <mhawk> yep
19:34 <llearch> "without discussion" is the no-no ;-]
19:34 <mhawk> we're going to hit them tonight or tomorrow
19:34 <mhawk> yep
19:35 <llearch> (hey, we signed it what, last week? Screwing with it this early would be stupid ;-]
19:35 <mhawk> we're just handling the larger war now
19:35 <mhawk> blitzkrieg is a small fry :P
19:35 <llearch> indeed.
19:35 <mhawk> we can always hit them later when we figure out who is going where
19:35 <mhawk> we'll be making a post later tonight
19:35 <mhawk> to coordinate pegasus
19:35 <llearch> My concern is not Blitzkreig, who are larger, numerically than us, although smaller in total output...
19:35 <mhawk> poseidon was notified yesterday
19:36 <llearch> ... it's if they have any friends to bring to the party.
19:36 <mhawk> we got ya covered
19:36 <llearch> neat. I feel much better now. ;-]
19:36 <mhawk> along with 12m in poseidon
19:36 <mhawk> :P
19:36 <mhawk> just check the forum tonight
19:36 <mhawk> there will be a thread for slot sign ups
19:36 <llearch> ... dangit. Our forums are down. :-/
19:36 <mhawk> :P
19:36 <mhawk> hmm
19:36 <mhawk> well check it a bit later and it should be posted
19:36 <llearch> happens every so often. Shared server, takes a kicking from others. Oh, well.
19:36 <mhawk> will be a good little war
19:37 <llearch> yeah.
19:37 <mhawk> thanks for the support btw
19:37 <mhawk> it is appreciated
19:38 <llearch> no worries.
19:38 <llearch> although the fact that BK has grown from 6 to 16 in the last couple of days is... interesting.
20:22 <llearch> I've posted a call to war in our forums. We'll see if anyone responds.
20:22 <llearch> (there are, I think, about 5 people small enough to actually hit these guys, so...)
blitzkrieg alliance, eh? Should I start 'educating' them? Looks like about half of them are pushovers, even for me.
I'll see if there's someone they want us to start with. Sadly, I don't get contact with Elysium in the AM, so we seem to have a day-long cycle between query and response, at best...
Heh.
Quote
08:15 <+llearch> mhawk asked if we wanted to slap down Blitzkreig for him. Know if he had anyone in particular in mind to start with?
08:18 <@Agnu|Away> start with the people that have infra, get rid of that infra
08:18 <@Agnu|Away> find new target with infra, rinse repeat
I have an outstanding request for clarification with mhawk, though.
Quote
08:21 <llearch> morning.
08:24 <mhawk> howdy
08:25 <llearch> our newest member said "ooo. Anyone in particular you want me to start with?"
08:25 <llearch> also: Should we officially declare war somewhere, in order to show good will to the rest of Planet Bob?
08:25 <mhawk> ah
08:28 <mhawk> yes we're going to do an official dow
08:28 <mhawk> I'd like to set the attack time for tomorrow
08:28 <mhawk> you guys know how to do an update quad?
08:29 <llearch> Tez has been on the receiving end, yes.
08:30 <llearch> James probably isn't aware, but he's only been playing for a couple weeks, so he's still pickin things up. Easy enough to manage, though.
08:30 <mhawk> ok we'll conduct the attack tomorrow at update
08:30 <mhawk> ok so essentially
08:30 <llearch> I'll pass that on.
08:30 <mhawk> you attack 10 mins before update
08:30 <mhawk> then immediately at update
08:30 <mhawk> to get 4 attacks in, hence a quad
08:30 <llearch> yah.
Think you can manage that, James? Got enough spare cash to buy troops and tanks? (note: tanks you can buy up to 10% of your troop efficiency rating; this is a good number to have on-hand, as they bulk up your attack solidly.)
Perhaps Tez can offer some advice about ground attacks or something... I haven't actually sent more than one, I think, so it's a bit silly me offering suggestions. ;-]
Edit:
Although I'd push your troops up to 60% effective, myself, when going into war. Particularly since their second biggest has twice your numbers of people and troops...
My current diplomat mask status on the Elysium forums
still won't let me into the thread you linked. :animesweat I posted a request for them to fix that. I'm still rather eager to read the CB on this one. :3
Quote
08:15 <+llearch> mhawk asked if we wanted to slap down Blitzkreig for him. Know if he had anyone in particular in mind to start with?
08:18 <@Agnu|Away> start with the people that have infra, get rid of that infra
08:18 <@Agnu|Away> find new target with infra, rinse repeat
I believe he means: "ZI the lot of them." >:]
It's actually rather difficult for a single nation to accomplish such a feat at that level. It goes fairly quickly with three, though. (If any of you recall the fun we had with those multis way back when our alliance first started.)
Are Joe and Aiyno still lurking here? They haven't posted in a while...
Einsatz (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=211221) looks like the tastiest target within James's range. Some of the bigger ones have that crazy warmonger look about them. :dface
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 13, 2008, 03:33:26 AM
Think you can manage that, James? Got enough spare cash to buy troops and tanks? (note: tanks you can buy up to 10% of your troop efficiency rating; this is a good number to have on-hand, as they bulk up your attack solidly.)
Perhaps Tez can offer some advice about ground attacks or something... I haven't actually sent more than one, I think, so it's a bit silly me offering suggestions. ;-]
Edit:
Although I'd push your troops up to 60% effective, myself, when going into war. Particularly since their second biggest has twice your numbers of people and troops...
I've only done a few update quads, myself. A quick look at my offensive casualties will give you an idea of how long ago
that was. :animesweat
I'll put together a war guide to post sometime later today.
Real troops levels should normally go to 79.9% of civilian pop. Max tanks as well. With the introduction of solider efficiency last year, there's no reason to be any lower than that in a war. Heck, I carry almost that much military in peacetime. >:]
I hope James still has a fair bit of cash left on hand. He used up his last aid slot on some kind of "trade misunderstanding", :B and we won't be able to help him for several days yet. Income often goes down to nothing during wartime. Depending on how much support Elysium and friends can muster, he could take rather heavy damage from the battles. At the very least, he's probably going to have a steady stream of missiles flowing his way.
Dropping some improvements and replacing them with missile defence would be worthwhile, or not?
Naw. Not at his size. Besides, look at it this way: CMs don't inflict significant military casualties. They just drop infra, and maybe a bit of tech and a tank or ten. No matter what damage he takes, it will all go away in a few days when one of us drops $3 million on him.
Up in our range, I'd highly recommend buying/swapping for a full set of Guerilla Camps--they're essential equipment in our league of play--but I don't think that will help James much.
I'm more worried about him not having the cash to support several days of war at this time.
Sorry. The boot drive of my main PC crashed this morning, so I had more important things to worry than writing that CN war guide I'd planned.
Quick guide:
An update quad is a double assault where you attack both before and after the game update (12AM CST--I believe that's 11PM where you are). Be ready by 15 minutes before the update.
BEFORE THE UPDATE:
Go DEFCON 1. Do this before buying soldiers and tanks, since it reduces the purchase price. Ordinarily, you'd collect taxes first, but you've already done so today.
Buy as many troops as you can afford. Start by maxing out your soldiers. Then buy tanks. I don't know if you'll have enough money for Cruise Missiles. They cost $18k each since you have Lead, and you can fire two per day (up to $72k total).
Pick a target a little over half your size. You can only attack nations within 50%-200% of your own Nation Strength. There are a few enemies (http://www.cybernations.net/allNations_display_alliances.asp?Alliance=Blitzkrieg) within range. I'd recommend only doing one on your first try.
Deploy Troops. The ground strike equation changed significantly last November. I don't know what the new values are. For the time being, assume that 1 tank = 15 soliders, 1 infrastructure = 2 soliders, and that relative combat strength is improved by their ration of tech to your tech. For the smaller ~1.5k NS nations, assume a defensive capability of around 3000 soliders, so aim for a little more than that. Not too much more, since the difference in DEFCON ratios will give you a large efficiency buff. Don't deploy more than half your real soldier count. Make up the difference in tanks (assume 1 tank = 12.5 soldiers when attacking).
Declare War on your target 5-15 minutes before the update. You don't have to indicate a reason. I still don't know what the official casus belli is in this case, since my mask on the Elysium forums hasn't been fixed.
Fire Missiles if you have them.
Perform 2 Ground Strikes. Don't worry if you win or lose. The point here is to destroy as much of his military as possible so that you can anarchy him on the second round after the update.
AFTER THE UPDATE:
Collect taxes. Don't bother paying bills. You'll probably need the cash and can go 2 days without paying bills, which should last you until you have an aid slot open.
Rebuy/redeploy troops. You'll probably need much less force on the second day, but your currently deployed numbers may be too high or too low. Check your current success ratio by opening the ground attack dialog first (but go back rather than attacking if your success rate isn't optimal). You need more than 5% but less than 95% success probability in order perform a ground strike. Obviously, you want to be above 50%, but don't aim too close to the max success percentage, since that might prevent you from doing a second strike.
Fire Missiles again if you have them and perform another two ground strikes.
You should be able to defeat/anarchy your enemy after the quad is complete. :kittydevious
Ya, no more aid can be given for a few days, so should I hold off a a few days? I have $76,303.92 right now, so I could get a few thousand more solders and max my tanks at 150.
Um... I was under the impression that this was supposed to be a coordinated multi-alliance strike. So you'll be only one of several nations attacking these guys tonight.
Also remember that your military purchase prices drop a fair bit when you go DEFCON 1. You should have enough for a decent attack. Maybe skip the cruise missiles, though, though I think you might be able to afford a few.
Struck Einsatz, winning both my ground battles. He lost about 30 infra levels or so by my hand.
Anarchied him even without a proper quad? Gratz! :mowcookie
Hmm... seems nobody else showed for the party. Makes it look kinda like you tech raided him. :animesweat
Now I'm quite curious to know how the politics of this will play out. That guy was sitting on 100 tech that he theoretically owed to a Realm of Titans member. :dface Maybe llearch can shed some light on things out when he gets on.
Man... I gotta reinstall Windows. Totally not looking forward to that... :mowsad
Heh. James jumped the gun a bit - not to worry, though, we're covered.
Quote from: mhawk
09:35 <mhawk> target lists are posted in pegasus
09:36 <llearch> neato.
09:36 <llearch> on the peace forum?
09:37 <mhawk> http://z15.invisionfree.com/CnElysium/index.php?showforum=107
09:37 <llearch> ah.
09:38 <mhawk> under joint mil command we have the CB as well as the initial target lists
09:39 <mhawk> we've recieved poseidon approval to commence operations
09:39 <mhawk> target is set for thursday update
09:39 <llearch> heh.
09:39 <llearch> James jumped the gun a little.
09:39 <mhawk> lol
09:39 <mhawk> its ok
09:39 <mhawk> they might just think its a tech raid
09:39 <llearch> one hopes so.
09:41 <llearch> they're listed as a Realm of Titans protectorate.
09:43 <mhawk> they aren't
09:44 <mhawk> RoT gave them a fake protectorate to gather intel
09:44 <llearch> heh. That's a load off my mind. ;-]
09:44 <mhawk> they turned it over to u
09:44 <mhawk> us
09:44 <mhawk> right now they think we are to busy with FCO
09:44 <mhawk> thats where pegasus will catch them
He also pointed out #pegasus and #elysium on irc.coldfront.net, and noted that you got masked yesterday, Tez.
Edit:
According to the forum listed in there, our targets are:
Quote
Do not tell the attackers until 15 min before update on thursday night, so we can insure the safety of this operation. Thank you.
...
2) Defensive Mutually-Friendly Alliance - Blut und Ehre (http://cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=217346)
3,716.523 NS, 939.22 Infra, 129.50 Tech, 0 Nukes, War Mode
3) Defensive Mutually-Friendly Alliance - Perplakistan (http://cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=172431)
3,529.212 NS, 1,081.46 Infra, 12.30 Tech, 0 Nukes, War Mode
You guys happy with that?
Oops. :animesweat Chalk it up to communication error, I suppose. I'm still not properly masked to view their war boards.
I don't personally have a problem with our target list, but we haven't heard from Joe or Aiyno yet. I don't think it would be fair to make the commitment until our attackers are on board. Both of those guys look a bit heavy for James at the moment.
Quote from: Tezkat on May 14, 2008, 01:30:29 PM
Oops. :animesweat Chalk it up to communication error, I suppose. I'm still not properly masked to view their war boards.
I suspect that that's "diplomat masking" rather than "random visitor from other alliance" masking, if that makes sense. Since they'd be wanting to keep this fairly close to their chest for the moment - hence "don't tell nobody" note - I suspect that's why you're not in there. And since they've had 4 ringers so far this year alone, I grant them that much allowance.
And you wouldn't be involved in hitting anyone anyway... you're just the most communicative of the other players on here. ;-]
Quote from: Tezkat on May 14, 2008, 01:30:29 PM
I don't personally have a problem with our target list, but we haven't heard from Joe or Aiyno yet. I don't think it would be fair to make the commitment until our attackers are on board. Both of those guys look a bit heavy for James at the moment.
I've nudged Aiyno. I don't see Joe online at all...
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 14, 2008, 01:51:33 PM
I suspect that that's "diplomat masking" rather than "random visitor from other alliance" masking, if that makes sense. Since they'd be wanting to keep this fairly close to their chest for the moment - hence "don't tell nobody" note - I suspect that's why you're not in there. And since they've had 4 ringers so far this year alone, I grant them that much allowance.
And you wouldn't be involved in hitting anyone anyway... you're just the most communicative of the other players on here. ;-]
Hmm... fair enough. I guess I'll have to stay out of the military coordination aspect, then, to avoid a repeat of our last mistake. Makes us look like we don't have our stuff together. :animesweat
I am here! Sorry, yeah I fail at forum tracking, anyway.. my economy on CN is just over a infra crisis with 73,004.28 or so money left after bills each day , so aid will be verily much required if we go through with this, I will follow Tezzies guide as much as i can but I hope for great aid in return :B since 3 days of taxes means a deathlock with tax/bill ratio for me... darned CN :U
Quote from: Aiyno on May 14, 2008, 02:00:04 PM
I am here! Sorry, yeah I fail at forum tracking, anyway.. my economy on CN is just over a infra crisis with 73,004.28 or so money left after bills each day , so aid will be verily much required if we go through with this, I will follow Tezzies guide as much as i can but I hope for great aid in return :B since 3 days of taxes means a deathlock with tax/bill ratio for me... darned CN :U
Seriously... taxes at 28%. You're totally gimping your economy otherwise. :dface
Oops. I can't send aid until I pay my bills, which I wasn't planning on doing until tonight's update. Can you wait until then?
Also, will you be available for the strike tomorrow at midnight?
Hmm. What is James up to with Ch3ddar (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=193318)?
Dunno. Maybe he got yelled at for cancelling a bad trade and wanted to make up? :3 All his outside foreign aid transactions are certainly hindering our ability to twink his nation. :animesweat
I have to go to work tomorrow at 8:00 am, so I don't think I should attack anybody tonight. I can send my details to somebody in a pm so somebody else can attack for me.
In my opinion, that would be... unwise.
Since it'd mean the person who did that could no longer pass you any aid, or fight on your side, or anything else with your country, either. It would hamper things significantly.
Particularly many months down the track when we forgot. ;-]
Edit:
Hmm. The Elysium forum has the likely answer:
Quote
To perform this operation successfully there are a few military tactics you need to understand fully. One of them is a Quad.
A Quad - A Quad is an update attack in which you get 4 rounds of attacks on your opponents. The order of attacks should be as follows
- Cruise Missile x2
- Aircraft Attack x2
- Ground Attack x2
Update
- Cruise Missile x2
- Aircraft Attack x2
-Ground Attack x2
If you carry this out successfully, you will most likely anarchy your opponent or, deplete his forces.
A Stagger - A Stagger is enforced to keep the opposing nation out of peace mode;
In order to do this, 2 people declare before update the third person declares after update when the first two wars expire, you have people redeclare. Then another the next day.
Keeps people from sneaking into peace mode when all 3 wars expire at once.
(slightly edited to correct spelling and spacing and suchlike, for ease of reading)
On that basis, I'd say James and Aiyno hit prior to the update, in just less than 31 hours from now, and Joe chimes in after the update, when he next gets back online - that way James and Aiyno take the quad, and Joe takes the stagger.
Work for you three?
Quote from: Tezkat on May 14, 2008, 02:13:23 PM
Dunno. Maybe he got yelled at for cancelling a bad trade and wanted to make up? :3 All his outside foreign aid transactions are certainly hindering our ability to twink his nation. :animesweat
Yep, that's pretty much what it was. ^_^;
For future reference, James, while we're trying to do the mass tech trade stuff, it'd be an idea ot let the rest of us know before doing that sort of thing; we can pass over the tech for you, because we've got larger aid allowances due to upgrades; 5 for me and Kasarn, 6 for Tez, I think - if he has the wonder for that.
Not that we're complaining, but it makes it hard to pump you up. ;-]
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 14, 2008, 05:46:09 PM
On that basis, I'd say James and Aiyno hit prior to the update, in just less than 31 hours from now, and Joe chimes in after the update, when he next gets back online - that way James and Aiyno take the quad, and Joe takes the stagger.
Work for you three?
Okay... I
finally got a proper mask on their forums. :3
I'm gonna dump some moneys on Joe and Aiyno tomorrow. Don't spend too much of it at once, guys, since you're already very close to being too big to hit our targets. On the other hand, it probably
is a good idea to spend most of it (probably on infra/improvements/military) after declaring war, since losing a ground strike will inadvertently give the enemy a lot of reconstruction money otherwise.
We only have one real target, since the primary offender (Blut und Ehre (http://cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=217346)) is hiding in hippie mode at will likely remain so after the Blitzkrieg blitz tomorrow night.
Aiyno/Joe... If possible, get on tomorrow night and declare war against Perplakistan (http://cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=172431) for an update quad around 11:50 PM CST on Thursday. Follow the same attack pattern I gave James (though if you have aircraft, use them after your missile strikes). I wouldn't suggest that James join in until after the target's been tenderized a little, since he is still a bit smaller than the guy.
James... since you've done your attacks for today, just ignore any responses or peace offers from Einsatz and attack with everyone else at around 11:50 PM CST on Thursday. Buy a bunch of missiles to use this time, you'll be getting aid soon enough. Once you're done with your quad, declare war on Perplakistan
only if Aiyno and/or Joe were able to pull of their attacks on time. He might be soft enough by then to ground strike even at your size, but if not, just lob missiles at him. He's never going to have enough tech to buy more missiles of his own, although he still has 10 left.
Anyone have scheduling conflicts or other concerns?
Is that 10:50 Eastern time?
That might just be possible.
Nope. CN time is 1 hour behind EST. So the update happens at 1 AM for you, 11 PM for James, and 5 AM for those of you on Zulu time.
Can you still make it?
Ya, Perplakistan is still too big for me, so I hit my other target again, destroying about 40 infra levels this time. :3
Oh, and two of my aid slots opened up. I'll be wiser about using them in the future.
Only concern with that plan, Tez, is the lack of a stagger. Unless you're suggesting James wait until after update, ie Friday morning?
I'll stagger around 6:00 am on Friday.
1:00am is still kinda late for me.
Quote from: James StarRunner on May 15, 2008, 01:25:29 AM
Ya, Perplakistan is still too big for me, so I hit my other target again, destroying about 40 infra levels this time. :3
Nice. Did you use missiles this time? :mowdan
I did ask you to wait in my last post, though. :animesweat Einsatz is the "official" leader of the alliance, although he may have unofficially ceded power back to their supposedly banished leader (the guy in hippie mode who started this mess). They must have contact with each other on IM/chat/etc. Your attack yesterday could have been written off as a tech raid. (Did he offer peace?) Now that he knows you have it in for him, they can alert the rest of the alliance. Some of them might bulk up or hit hippie mode before tonight's update as a result.
Ah, well... It probably won't matter for such small fries, which is why this little military exercise is good practice for us. :3 For an example of what happens to uncoordinated attackers in the big leagues, take a look at FreakSafari's war stats (http://www.cybernations.net/search_wars.asp?Page=1&searchstring=Declaring_Alliance,Receiving_Alliance&search=FreakSafari.com). They tried to blitz TOOL at update the night before last, but they had more counterattackers than attackers before it was over. And we're talking about the space of an hour or so here. A day later, half the alliance is in anarchy (and the rest are in peace mode).
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 15, 2008, 03:20:45 AM
Only concern with that plan, Tez, is the lack of a stagger. Unless you're suggesting James wait until after update, ie Friday morning?
I suggested hitting him "after" Aiyno/Joe finished their attacks, whenever that may be. James isn't big enough to make the opening assault, at least not while already occupied with Einsatz. In any event, staggering the guy is irrelevant unless we're passing him on to another alliance with smaller members. Coordinated attacks from three people should do ~100 infra damage a day at that size, and he's not going to grow while in anarchy, so even James probably won't be in range to re-declare by the end of the week.
I sent off some aids to our fighters.
Do not spend it until after declaring war. (Well, James can spend his, since he's already at war. :3) These guys are already barely in NS range to attack. As it is, Joe may have to decomission troops and/or destroy infra in order to be in range to hit this guy if Ainyo attacks first.
Incidentally, before you attack, set your defcon to 1.
Once peace breaks out, set it back to 5.
It gives you a whole bunch of advantages - better attack strength, cheaper troops, better defence; and a bunch of disadvantages - more expensive bills, mostly, but also more unrest and less taxes...
Yup. Don't fight a war without DEFCON 1. It makes a huge difference in combat strength. But I think you guys knew that already. :3
Oh, and Aiyno? Please raise your taxes! You don't want to be fighting a war with a gimped economy. :animesweat
Ya, I had mine on 1 for the attack, thought I'd switch it back to 5 for taxes, then go back to 1 after. Didn't know about the day cooldown though...
And I thought you meant to wait on Perplakistan, not Einsatz (whom I did pelt with missiles). He didn't ask for peace yet. But I'll ask this now then, what should be my course of action?
Ah, sorry I wasn't more clear. Well, since you've already done your attacks for the day, just continue as we planned. Hit Einsatz again tomorrow with everything you've got, and attack Perplekistan once the others have softened him up for you.
Go back to DEFCON 1 as soon as possible and stay there for the rest of the war.
Going DEFCON 5 in the middle of a war is actually kinda mean, I think... It sends your opponent a message that he's not even worth fighting at full strength. >:] Be careful though. I'd spend a lot of that cash I sent you on infra and improvements. Buy a dozen or so missiles. If he catches you at DEFCON 5 and lands an all out attack while you still have $3 mil in the bank, he's gonna have a LOT of funds to rebuild his nation. :dface Maybe keep a couple hundred k on hand for the battle. If you run into financial trouble, just holler and we can send you more aids. :3
Wot he said.
I'm saving up for another wonder, so I've got just over 20 million standing by, and YC said he'd be happy to cough up 15 million if necessary. Since that's 5 separate max-pays, that's a big chunk of change - still, let's not waste it, mmhmm? ;-]
erk.
Should I throw these 3 million Kyats into army already?
...I don't even know who to attack yet :B
of course if I don't have to I could boost infra... *cough*
Hmm... I fail at conveying information. :animesweat
Okay... here's the problem:
Perplakistan is only 3.6k NS, and whoever attacks first is gonna knock a few hundred NS off of that. That means that the first attacker can have no more than 7.2k NS and the second will probably need to be under 6.6k NS.
That means you really can't afford to build yourself up before declaring war. Once you declare war, then you can go on a spending spree with all the shiney moneys I sent. :3
You need around 50 points worth of bombers to do full damage on an airstrike, so it's probably not worth it to buy them at your level. Just spend it on troops, tanks, missiles, and the usual infra/improvements.
tl;dr Declare war first, then buy stuff.
ATTACK ORDERS:
:gun1 :chainsaw
AIYNO
Target: Perplakistan (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=172431)
I think update is around 7 AM your time. (CN update is at midnight CST.) If possible, declare war and attack ~15 minutes before then and get in a second round right after the update.
:gun1 :chainsaw
JOE
Target: Perplakistan (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=172431)
Scheduled for ~6 AM EST Friday.
If Aiyno attacks first, you may have to disband some military in order to drop your NS low enough to declare war. (You can't be over twice his NS.) You may even have to drop a bit of infra. Just use the cash I sent you to replace it after you declare.
:gun1 :chainsaw
JAMES
Target: Einsatz (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=211221)
Continue attacks as usual.
Target: Perplakistan (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=172431)
Attack after at least one of the others has softened him up for you.
:gun1 :chainsaw
WHAT TO DO FIRST... (These are in order for a reason.)
1. Colect Taxes/Pay Bills.
2. Go DEFCON 1 and stay there for the rest of the war.
3. Declare War.
4. Buy shiney things.
5. Attack!
:gun1 :chainsaw
ATTACK CYCLE
1. Deploy troops.
2. Fire 2 Cruise Missiles.
3. 2 Bombing Runs (if available).
4. 2 Ground Attacks.
5. Replace troops.
Well found out who my target's tech partner was: http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=184813
Quoteyou attacked my friend and tech deal partner. If you don't cease attacks and pay him reperations you're costing me 3million $. I dont want to have that cash go to waste so send peace and reps immediately
Yeah, we know about him...
Don't reply. We'll handle the diplomatical end after the op goes officially live.
EDIT:
GLU had a chat with RoT leadership on our behalf. That guy shouldn't give you any more trouble. :3
Quote from: Tezkat on May 15, 2008, 07:10:10 PMGLU had a chat with RoT leadership on our behalf. That guy shouldn't give you any more trouble. :3
Ah, good. I didn't know what to say since I didn't intend on paying him back.
Anyways with my attack on Einsatz tonight, I seem to have killed off over a quarter of his infra and tech in total these past 3 days.
Has Perplakistan been softened up yet? He still looks pretty formidable to me. There's no way I can wage a lasting war alone with him in my condition (and with being spread out fighting my other guy).
Not yet. It looks like we missed the start of the war.
Incidentally, if you have a look at the row of icons in the Alliance Affiliation box on Viewing your nation, there's Statistics, Rankings, Map, Wars, Aid, Spies, in that order. If you hit the Wars one, it lists all the wars being fought either for or against your alliance.
Which means it's easy to find out that you're the only one currently fighting. I suspect either someone got lost, or we confused which day it was we were supposed to be attacking...
In fact, there's only 3 wars currently on for that alliance... which suggests that pretty much everyone is doing much the same...
Nice job, Joe. :mowcookie Perplakistan dropped by like 100 infra in one round.
He's soft and squishy for you to attack now, James. Just be careful... he usually logs in around lunch time CST, so he might be sharp and pointy again soon. Regardless, he probably won't be in a position to counterattack with anything but missiles against a three way assault.
In case any of you were curious as to why we're hitting these guys, the official DoW (http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=22836) is up. In a nutshell, the ex-leader of Blitzkrieg provoked a war with Elysium and was added to the perma-ZI list as a result. Since it seemed to be mostly his fault, they spared the rest of the alliance. Blitzkrieg repays the generosity by reinstating him as an alliance leader under a new identity a few weeks later. His first official act under the new name? Trying to trick Elysium into granting them a protectorate status. :animesweat The jerk's currently sitting in peace mode while his alliance takes the fall for him. Again. Maybe they'll learn this time?
Going forward, since the war is now official, you guys might want to reference them being enemies of Pegasus in your war declarations, just so these guys know what they're dealing with.
Nice sig image, there, Tez. Lovely flag and claw.
Thanks. Been using it in all my CN-related forum sigs.
(http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/3690/dmfaflagclawzs6.jpg)
I adapted some of my kitty macro photoshop collection to the new DMFA flag. It makes our new flag look pretty sexy. :3 I still need to colourize the foreground, but I do like the effect.
Is it just me, or is there some correlelation betwen the fact that this guy is called barbarossa, and Operation Barbarossa was when Hitler betrayed Stalin? AND that this guy's alliance is called blitzkrieg?
Hmmmmm...
And by the way, I've been having a lot of fun reading all this. In the beginning, the chats you posted and the things you said sounded almost like you guys are part of some shadow conference trying to take over the world xD
Jeez, this whole thing is almost bona-fide TV quality entertainment :boogie
... join in, why don't you? :-P
attack before 7 AM....
Holy frig.. 7 in the morning :B
I think I'll just attack this evening as late as possible.
we all know Aiyno needs his sleep, otherwise Aiyno not perma-sleepy but perma-not-there-at-all-sleepy
Heh. Actually, it was supposed to be 7 AM
this morning. However, since the update blitz opportunity has already passed, and he already has one attacker on him, there's no military reason to hold off for the quad now. He's sharp and pointy again, though, so James can't hit him yet.
He's also begging for mercy: :animesweat
QuoteI was attacked by a member of your alliance, I see that you are a protectorate of Elysium, an alliance who recently ass#$*@d me. (Never did find out why.) I'd like to prevent that from happening again, please tell Joe3210 to call off the attack.
What do you guys think? Should we keep hitting him or give him a day to plead his case? Einsatz is obviously complicit in the stupidity that got his alliance into this mess and deserves to donate as much tech as possible to our cause, >:] but I'm not a fan of punishing the little guys for their leaders' deeds.
EDIT:Heh... turns out we were right after all (http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=22894). It's a pretty speech, although the crux of his argument remains "Please trust me, I'm a liar!" :animesweat
However, unless there are any objections, I'm going to call a temporary ceasefire until we figure out how this should play out. So now new DoWs for now. (But those of you already engaged don't need to declare peace just yet...)
Quote from: Tezkat on May 16, 2008, 03:57:14 PM
Heh. Actually, it was supposed to be 7 AM this morning.
Other obligations, aka: work practicums
I will obey the ceasefire.
I enquired with Great_Lakes_Union, since mhawk wasn't around.
Quote
22:06 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> What's up?
22:06 <llearch> ah... been some conversation between Perplakistan or whatever his name is...
22:06 <llearch> and Tezkat.
22:06 <llearch> and there's Hanz's post in the CN forum.
22:07 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> Perplakistan?
22:07 <llearch> http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=22894
22:07 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> I saw, and just responded
22:08 <llearch> mmm.
22:08 <llearch> The rest of the details:
22:08 <llearch> Said nation sent this message to Tez:
22:09 <llearch> I was attacked by a member of your alliance, I see that you are a protectorate of Elysium, an alliance who recently ass#$*@d me. (Never did find out why.) I'd like to prevent that from happening again, please tell Joe3210 to call off the attack.
22:09 <llearch> and as Tez says of Hanz's little speech, 'It's a pretty speech, although the crux of his argument remains "Please trust me, I'm a liar!"'
22:09 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> Exactly
22:10 <llearch> the question remains: Do we keep hammering the rest of his alliance, or do we let them off?
22:10 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> As I said, we tried playing nice the first time and got burned for it
22:10 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> Keep hitting
22:10 <llearch> right you are. Official word: Stomp flat.
22:10 <Great_Lakes_Union|Elysium> :D
The guy I attacked sent me this:
Quote
Wanna tell me why you attacked me? Its not like I have any tech...
Any more orders?
I wrote him a fairly detailed explanation for our attacks against him yesterday. He hasn't logged on to read it yet.
Regardless, you may continue attacking until further notice. SOAP's hitting both of our targets now as well. :animesweat
Will do. :mowwink
QuoteYou cannot attack Perplakistan at this time because their battle odds are at 1% and are not high enough to fight your forces. The government of Perplakistan has just been sent into Anarchy due to their lack of security forces. Riots engulf the nation of Perplakistan as your soldiers relax and enjoy their victory.
Quote from: Joe3210 on May 17, 2008, 07:58:57 PM
Will do. :mowwink
QuoteYou cannot attack Perplakistan at this time because their battle odds are at 1% and are not high enough to fight your forces. The government of Perplakistan has just been sent into Anarchy due to their lack of security forces. Riots engulf the nation of Perplakistan as your soldiers relax and enjoy their victory.
Victory! Now to attack something myself...
okay... maybe that is quite impossible.
If you can declare on someone, you can start throwing missiles at them, at least...
Quote from: Tezkat on May 17, 2008, 07:00:47 PMRegardless, you may continue attacking until further notice. SOAP's hitting both of our targets now as well. :animesweat
So many SOAP's are hitting our targets now that it won't let me hit Perplakistan. :P
Heh... you guys were too slow. :mowtongue If any slots open up, you're authorized to strike if you want.
I was surprised to see this guy (http://www.cybernations.net/nation_drill_display.asp?Nation_ID=170484) on Blitzkrieg's roster today. He's either got balls of steel or brains of mush, joining a micro alliance that's currently at war with an entire bloc. :3
Heheh... What happened was, I was an an anime con and concert the past few days and the net at the hotel barrrrrely worked.
With my targets being occupied methinks it's time to find someone new on that alliance that I can attack.
Update: Elysium has called for PoW status for anyone from Blitzkrieg who wants to surrender...
Quote from: Young Caesar
So one day mhawk came to me and said im feeling very generous today, and gave me such a proposition. This proposition said that any nation of the alliance of Blitzkrieg willing to abide by these terms will be granted peace. He gave me such terms:
1) Switch AA to Pegasus POW
2) Register on the Elysium forum
3) Stay in Pegasus POW until conclusion of the war
4) resign from Blitzkrieg in the alliance resignation thread
To this proposition i replied, "these are very fair terms sir, dont you want to punish them a little for what they have done?" He replied "people should have a second chance in life." I agreed with this statement.
The resignation thread is here: http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=213
... for those of you who get sent messages from the targets, and don't read the Elysium forums. ;-]
Actually... the surrender terms have changed slightly. Blitzkrieg gets to stay together as an alliance.
In any event, congrats on a good job, guys! We won! :mowcookie
You may stand down now.
But what happens to that Barbarossa/Heinz guy who started all this?
Hmm... he gets to wallow in his own failure as a person? :3 He's on our perma-ZI list, which basically means he'll be attacked on sight should he ever poke his head out again.
If I may quote my post on the CN forums:
Quote from: TezkatHeinz/Barbarossa/DLK/whatever can reroll as many times as he likes. Of course nobody can stop him. It's his own pride, arrogance, and (one can only assume) stupidity that prevents him from letting go.
Most likely, he'll delete his current nation and try to pull this crap again somewhere else. I'm sure we haven't heard the last of thing.
Blitzkrieg members must register on Elysium's forums where we can keep track of them, and they'll be assigned a viceroy to oversee their new government. One hopes that they'll learn their lesson this time. If not, we'll be visiting them again in a month, I guess. >:]
Well, as mentioned earlier, the war with Blitzkrieg is now over. If you haven't already, please send peace offers to your opponents.
There's an official victory announcement (http://forums.cybernations.net/index.php?showtopic=23259) up on the CN forums, if any of you are interested.
So... now it's time for feedback. How'd it go? What went well? What didn't go well? What information or resources would you liked to have had?
I think you all did very well. :mowcookie We were fortunate to have "safe" opponents for our first military outing. James did a great job for only having played a week. I was impressed by how much damage Joe was able to do. I guess bombers aren't quite as useless at that level as I thought. SOAP stole Aiyno's targets, but I'm sure he would also have done well given the chance.
I noticed that there were some communication difficulties regarding targets and timing. What could we have done to make it more clear?
Organizing quads is apparently rather difficult for us due to time zone issues. How many of you would be able to make a midnight attack (10 pm PST, 1 am EST, 5 am GMT) in the future?
More importantly... was it fun? :kittycool Elysium and the Poseidon alliances are rarely short of opponents for long, so we'll have a chance to do it again in the future.
Ya, it was fun. Sometimes it's hard to plan an attack right before the update due to work (I get off usually just as the update happens), but I can see how that can benefit on the first day of war especially.
My own overuse of aid slots made it hard for me at first, but now that I know better, it shouldn't be an issue any longer. I did well though since I was so well funded and merely followed instructions. ;)
The only thing I'm still unsure of is the term quad...
Quote from: James StarRunner on May 21, 2008, 06:16:42 AM
Ya, it was fun. Sometimes it's hard to plan an attack right before the update due to work (I get off usually just as the update happens), but I can see how that can benefit on the first day of war especially.
The only thing I'm still unsure of is the term quad...
That's simple enough.
You can make two attacks per day (for each type and battle front). A CN day ends at midnight CST. So... if you attack right before and right after the update, you can get in four attacks of each type before your opponent has a chance to respond--hence the term
quad. A properly executed quad will usually thrust the target into anarchy. Without a warchest to keep them going, an opponent in anarchy often won't have enough income to fund their war effort, so a first strike
update blitz (multiple nations executing quads simultaneously against all the strong nations in an alliance) can cripple an alliance and goes a long way towards determining the victor.
Thus,
warchests are a very good idea. Everyone should make an effort to have at least a few days collection on hand in case of war (or dramatic changes to game mechanics like the one Kevin pulled on us this week). Personally, I'm now making an effort not to let my bank balance go below $50 million, so I'll always have cash on hand for aids and warfare.
Incidentally, quads only really matter at the outset of the war. After the initial attack, you can attack at almost any time of day so long as you keep the damage flowing.
(Note, however, that time of day does actually affect battle outcomes, depending on relative technology levels.)
There's a warning out that we should be alert this weekend - all pegasus nations, for some reason.
You may want to bounce your defcon up to 1 for the weekend. I'm still trying to get hold of someone to find out what it's about.
Ah.
Diplomacy.
Quote
22:13 <~mhawk> some folks tried to aggresively merge with some pegasus alliances
22:13 <~mhawk> we're currently hitting the leader that was trying it
Also, Joe, you might want to offer peace to Perplakistan, if you haven't already...
Done.
He kinda quit the game though.
Thinned their numbers out then. I'm still half expecting them to retaliate.
Can I spend my 3 million warchest for random stuff?
Cause I failed to attack I have all.... of it.. still.
Quote from: James StarRunner on May 24, 2008, 11:40:50 PM
Thinned their numbers out then. I'm still half expecting them to retaliate.
Oh, I think they've learned their lesson. :3
It's kinda sad when people quit over wars, though. War is such a large part of the game...
Quote from: Aiyno on May 25, 2008, 03:34:06 AM
Can I spend my 3 million warchest for random stuff?
Cause I failed to attack I have all.... of it.. still.
Well, it's always a good idea to have some money in the bank. Warchest = Good, especially if we're still on alert. But it's probably safe to redirect it towards growth.
And, seriously, Ainyo...
RAISE YOUR TAXES TO 28%!!! :dface
Quote from: Tezkat on May 25, 2008, 11:48:24 AM
And, seriously, Ainyo... RAISE YOUR TAXES TO 28%!!! :dface
How the...
ugh, never mind .. they're 28 again... wacky thingies..