C&C 3 demo...

[Paladin Sheppard]

Simply WOW...FMV..GDI...NOD...Kane...Orcas...Mammoth Tanks *Drools*

[Arcalane]

Spiffed up version of the SAGE engine, as used in Renegade, Generals, LotR:BfME and others.

Other than that, looking good so far. Though I do wonder how the rest of the story will pan out - and on that subject - whether it will do so well.

I'm personally not a fan of the new Mammoths, although I am rather liking the spin on the Juggernauts - even if their lines are a bit cheesy. ("I'm the Juggernaut!", etc.)

[Cvstos]

Actually I'm fairly sure Renegade does NOT use the SAGE engine, or at the very least if the SAGE engine is based on Renegade's it is DRAMATICALLY modified, and the new game handles spiffy graphics quite well, even on slower machines.

Since my comp can handle it, I've decided to wait on the upgrades to it, though a cheap 8600 may change my mind.

That all having been said... WOW... this is going to be an awesome game!

[Azlan]

The guy who plays Kain doesn't look like he has aged at all...

[Cvstos]

Azlan: Of course he hasn't aged! You can't kill the messiah!!   

[Arcalane]

The guy who plays Kain doesn't look like he has aged at all...

Yeah. It's actually the same guy who played Kane back in C&C1 - and fun fact; he directed almost all of the live action sequences in the C&C games for WestWood. (Although he's not doing any of the directing for C&C3)

The demo is well worth looking at, and I especially recommend watching the "GDI Prologue" section. Gives you a good idea of how the story will go as well as a taste of the live action sequences.

~~

Renegade used the very first iteration of SAGE, AFAIK. Of course, since then, the engine has been upgraded a lot, to take advantage of the new graphical stuff available.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAGE_engine

~~

I have now determined that the most dangerous unit in the demo is the NOD Avatar Battlewalker. Why? It's "Commandeer Technology" ability (destroy a friendly NOD vehicle to gain a new weapon or ability) is not purely restricted to one vehicle at a time. Nosir. But here's what it gains;

Flame Tank = Flamethrower
Stealth Tank = Stealth Generator
Attack Bike = Stealth Detector
Beam Laser = Extra Laser Cannon

The Avatar starts with a fairly powerful laser to begin with, but if it commandeers weaponry from each of those units, it becomes a walking death machine that has maneuverability far surpassing that of the Juggernaut. How? Well, let's see - it now has three weapons - two laser cannons and one extremely, extremely deadly flamethrower. On top of that, it is cloaked whilst not engaged in combat, and should (theoretically) cloak nearby friendly units (if not, no big loss, you'll probably be sending four or five other similarly upgraded Avatars along with it ) as well as be able to hunt down cloaked enemy units.

Did I mention that only NOD get cloaking technology? (Unless the Scrin have some...)

Okay, so the cloak detection is only really good for hunting down hidden GDI snipers (the only GDI unit capable of cloaking, in fact) or when playing against another NOD player (or if you managed to take down but not kill one of these babies as GDI) so...

Following on from that last bracketed comment;

Yeah, you heard that right, actually. All battlewalkers can be taken down without killing them. They will die if fired on too violently (four Orcas is enough to outright kill an Avatar) but if they go down without being destroyed, they turn into Battlewalker Husks. These husks can then be refurbished by your Engineers - although they'll still be heavily damaged, so it's advisable to secure the walker, capture it, then get it back to base ASAP. Walkers cannot use the very useful airdrop options (they're just too damn big!) available to just about everybody else, which is problematic to say the least.

Still, (captured) Juggernauts can seriously turn the tide of battle - five of them will walk straight over just about anything.

[ITOS]

Finlay got around to downloading this huge file. It is great!

Still, (captured) Juggernauts can seriously turn the tide of battle - five of them will walk straight over just about anything.

I really like having artillery that can actually shoot over some distance. Five Juggernauts back at your base that are directed by snipers can take down heavy stationary objects with minimal risk. It's almost too good.

I was, however, a bit disappointed when it came to modding. In the demo there is very little you can mod in the easy ini files.

BTW, anyone tried out the Nod units yet?

[Arcalane]

*points to the mini-essay about the NOD Avatar *

Take in mind that using the Juggernaut's artillery ability decloaks your Snipers temporarily, so use it carefully.

I haven't had much experience with the other NOD units, and at the moment, most of the prices are very unbalanced.

[ITOS]

Compared to the Mammoths knocking on the frontdoor the AI seem to think the snipers are less of a threat... Stupid AI, can't prioritise.

[Arcalane]

Compared to the Mammoths knocking on the frontdoor the AI seem to think the snipers are less of a threat... Stupid AI, can't prioritise.

Actually, if it knocks out your snipers, your artillery has no spotters and can't fire.

[Magic]

Kane is still alive.

Love it.

You can't kill the Messiah.

[Stygian]

Much like you cannot kill insanity? Really...

Nod are awesome in C&C3 anyhow. Easily the best faction, I'd bet. Stealth and speed for the win!

[ITOS]

Nod are awesome in C&C3 anyhow. Easily the best faction, I'd bet. Stealth and speed for the win!

I don't know... GDI gets quite a lot of units capable of detecting stealth after a while, so an ambush is quite hard.
On the other hand, they often discover an assaulting stealth unit quite late, like with the Nod stealth bomber.

[Stygian]

A prevailing strategy of mine in C&C Generals - Zero Hour was to play either the Air general or Stealth general, and use one of two types of units - Flak Tracks or Stealth Bombers en masse in junction with heavy ground hitters. As GLA I would mass out Tracks behind a screen of stealthed missile sites, obviously away from my main base, and constantly spam the newly built with the GPS scrambler, then upgrade those few I could by waving possible incoming assaults and keeping them at my allies' defense sites. Then, I'd come knocking where the enemy's base defenses were strongest with a distractionary force - mostly two SCUDs and a guard unit of six or eight geared against air and armor. I'd attempt to open a hole in the enemy's defenses broad enough that I could get six to ten flaks in, so I could rapidly start taking out buildings and gaining veterancy, and open up a hallway for my other traks to flood in and circle inwards into his base, taking out buildings as they went.
   With the USA and Air I'd build half of my airfleet (a considerable force...) to Raptors for close defense and anti-armor to supplement my SAMs and sniper- and missile trooper-equipped artillery sites. The other half would consist of stealth fighters, and only perhaps a few Auroras, certainly no more than four. I'd set the "defend area" order on the stealth planes right where the outer border of it touched on the enemy's defenses, thus having my stealth bombers continuously spam the enemy's fortifications continuously from maximum range and opening a pathway for my heavy-hitter planes to rip into eventual threats. Slowly, I'd carve holes out of the enemy's base, moving from place to place and aiming to destroy his economy.

Now, the latter strategy I believe could work in Tiberium Wars too, with the use of Nod's bombers.

[Cvstos]

This is it, folks!  Tommorrow we see the release of the game itself!

And me with two major tests the day after tomorrow...  D'oh!!

[EvilIguana966]

I have it.  Very impressed so far.  Game looks excellent and runs flawlessly on my aging machine.  Most importantly, it is a ton of fun to play, although a bit easy in the GDI campaign so far.  One of my favorite elements has been the GDI news wire feature that updates throughout the campaign.  The little news stories are all rather amusing, my favorite so far being the one about the Mammoth Mk. II. 

My favorite unit so far:  Mammoth Tanks.  Boring choice I know, but for me nothing beats the old school thrill of rolling over the enemy with these monsters.  Railgun upgrade is a must of course.  The great part is that while slow, they have armament to deal with every threat they might face.  While theoretically weak against infantry, they can still mow down troops through sheer brute force.  Armor is no match for those guns,  nor are structures, and aircraft are made short work of by those missiles.   If infantry and garrisoned structures are really going to be a problem then just bring some APCs with grenadiers along, otherwise the mammoths will handle it all and quickly rack up veteran levels.  Get em to elite status and they start healing themselves too, another perk with big expensive units. 

[ITOS]

Mammoth is my favourite too. If I only could get the enemy infantry to shout "Run away! Run away!" when they see one.

Wish list for the Mammoth:

• Clear buildings.
• Detect stealth.
• Repair units.
• Heal infantry.
• Garrison infantry.
• A cupholder.
  

Would make it horribly unbalanced, I know, but it really needs a cupholder.

[Janus Whitefurr]

Armor is no match for those guns,  nor are structures, and aircraft are made short work of by those missiles.   If infantry and garrisoned structures are really going to be a problem then just bring some APCs with grenadiers along, otherwise the mammoths will handle it all and quickly rack up veteran levels.  Get em to elite status and they start healing themselves too, another perk with big expensive units. 

Having been playing the NOD campaign, I would like to point out that multiple Obelisks of Light > Mammoth Tank + escorts. At least when GDI is run by the computer. A human is smarter. I don't think there's much that beats the Obelisk's attack range, either...

[Arcalane]

Spotters + Juggernaughts > Obelisks.

[Cvstos]

Armor is no match for those guns,  nor are structures, and aircraft are made short work of by those missiles.   If infantry and garrisoned structures are really going to be a problem then just bring some APCs with grenadiers along, otherwise the mammoths will handle it all and quickly rack up veteran levels.  Get em to elite status and they start healing themselves too, another perk with big expensive units. 

Having been playing the NOD campaign, I would like to point out that multiple Obelisks of Light > Mammoth Tank + escorts. At least when GDI is run by the computer. A human is smarter. I don't think there's much that beats the Obelisk's attack range, either...

A human is indeed different.  For one, I don't send a Mammoth against an Obelisk.  I send 10+ mammoths against obelisks. 

[EvilIguana966]

I finished the GDI campaign and am working on the NOD one.  Despite my predilection towards the good guys, I'm finding a lot to like about NOD.  For one, their base defenses are, in my opinion, far better than GDIs and thus allow me to focus more attention on things beyond defense.  The fact that the turrets regenerate on their own as long as their center piece remains intact is the biggest pro.  Second in line is the fact that the laser turrets, while described as anti vehicle defenses, work almost as well on infantry, especially when deployed in large numbers.  Obelisks are of course pretty self explanatory, and they seem to be more effective than the GDI sonic cannons.  NOD AA also feels far deadlier than the GDI brand. 

I also like the flexibility afforded me by the stealth tanks which allow easy scouting and the ability to make hit and fade strikes on weakly defended targets.  Oh, and the stealthed harvesters are great.  The GDI harvesters supposedly have a gun to make up for that, but I have never actually seen it fire at anything.  On the con side though,  Mammoth tanks are far better than the NOD warmechs.  Better armor, longer range, far greater bang for the buck, can hit aircraft as well.  The amount of time and money spent to make a Avatar as good as a Mammoth is just too high.  GDI's firehawks also make better bombers than their NOD counterpart, being faster and doing more damage.  The sad truth is that the stealth on the Vertigos is nigh on useless when not only is every target they might attack surrounded by stealth detectors, but they must also break stealth to fire, making them completely visible right where they need it the most. 

[Cvstos]

GDI's Sonic Cannons are best to use at choke-points.  Three of them aiming down a narrow path will not only decimate any one thing coming down said path, but will also decimate an entire strike force coming down said path since they damage everything that it happens to be pointing at when it fires, rather than just one unit.

GDI's Firehawks make for excellent anti-air weapons.  Even if a Vertigo manages to drop off it's bomb, a Firehawk with only a small amount of additional AA present will make sure that the Vertigo pays for it with it's life.  Two Firehawks can chew up anything short of the carriers, destroyers, and motherships of the Scrin.  Heck, two are problem enough to be the destroyers and carriers if they don't have shields.  The shielding is the only thing preventing just 2 hawks from quickly knocking them out of the sky, and I wouldn't be surprised if two alone are enough if they launch all their missiles.  And don't even think of sending Stormriders or Venoms to deal with AA Firehawks.  The 'hawk easily outclasses them.

Motherships have a lot of HP so it's best to use about 8 Firehawks if you can.  I mean they've got more HP than damn near anything else in the game.  Even if they fail to destroy it completely the mothership won't have enough health left to survive the journey into any base that has AA.  And if the hawks make it back to base for another run...

[Turnsky]

finished all of C&C3 today, much alluding to sequels and expansions..
and everything seems to run into eachother this time around, no alternate story points, but three facets of the same war.

[ITOS]

Whoever came up with the idea that the Juggernaut should scratch it's driver pod with it's foot, like a dog, deserves a cookie.

[Cvstos]

That's not all!  Keep watching them, they like to peck at the ground like a chicken!

[Arcalane]

Whoever came up with the idea that the Juggernaut should scratch it's driver pod with it's foot, like a dog, deserves a cookie.

So that wasn't just me hallucinating.