2018-11-2 [DMFA #1880] The Sell-Out

[Puyon]

Interesting that remuneration for murder is a normal thing here! Like wen Hizell almost-murdered Abel, Kria was offered a payment and noted that Hizell could pay the same price had he actually murdered Abel. I guess for demons it's like a courtesy. Which, I'm with Biggs on this one, it's messed up. Like you could say "hey it's better than giving them nothing at all", but I'm sure the better alternative is just... not murdering. I think this is an interesting law(?) that's being introduced to us, and not to mention, adds a personal depth to Biggs's motives

[The One Guy]

While its connection to Biggs and Wildy's situation is new to us, this is not the first time we've been introduced to this "law."

[Puyon]

That... is ancient but yeah, that's absolutely what happened huh. I wonder if being mad rich is like... a requirement for demons if this is standard practice.

[Cassi-kun]

That... is ancient but yeah, that's absolutely what happened huh. I wonder if being mad rich is like... a requirement for demons if this is standard practice.

In the flashback about Dan's first conflict with Aliph, Aliph laments how much paperwork is involved in being evil.

[AzureEdge]

No Bigs, no. You got it all wrong. Friendship isn't Stupid. Friendship Is Magic. And it comes with Magical Rainbow Laser Beams.

[Eidolon]

One wonders if demons (and possibly other creatures) have such a thing as "rampage insurance."

Pay a premium every month, and if/when you go on an impromptu murder spree, the company will pay out the necessary weregild to the next-of-kin of your victims (after you pay the deductable, of course).

One also wonders if there are different standard payments for different categories of victims, which would be an additional point of contention, i.e. if the remuneration expected for a being is less than that expected for a creature--I suppose it's possible that remuneration is only a creature-killing-beings sort of thing, but I'd think it would also be possible for there to be be some tradition of paying a blood-price rather than entering a blood-feud for creatures killing creatures (or even beings killing creatures, although when beings judge beings, the standard seems to often be "make the default assumption that the being was acting in self-defence and let them off scot-free"), at least in some areas of Furrae.

Going off on a bit of a tangent, one way different payouts might be justified by whoever's writing the laws is by considering the potential future lifespan of the victim--i.e., however many years the victim likely had left to live is the amount of years that were "stolen" from them by their killer, with the penalty being shifted to suit the crime. Such a system would benefit any of the longer-lived creature species over beings, and would massively benefit the ridiculously long-lived dragons (dragons consider 57,822 to be young!) to the point that, basically, a person who kills a dragon would have no hope of ever paying any legally-defined remuneration... not that dragons seem much inclined to accept blood-prices over blood in any case. But all of that is just wild speculation, of course. (It would certainly give Biggs an extra reason to have a grudge against dragons, if their lives were viewed as basically priceless, in comparison with his mother's own already-established price-tag.)

[Tapewolf]

Even in our world there are places where a blood price can be paid to the bereaved in a murder case. The family may decline it though, in which case the murderer tends to be executed.

Lifespan might be a factor in determining a blood price in Furrae, rarity might be another, and is arguably a fairer measure from a conservation point of view

[keybounce]

No Bigs, no. You got it all wrong. Friendship isn't Stupid. Friendship Is Magic. And it comes with Magical Rainbow Laser Beams.

Rapid fire by twirling the tale.

[Eidolon]

Lifespan might be a factor in determining a blood price in Furrae, rarity might be another, and is arguably a fairer measure from a conservation point of view

Fairer from a conservation point of view--but naturally, it still favors Creatures over the more-populous Beings. (There are always going to be more predators than prey--and predators need prey more than prey need predators, especially when the prey are self-aware enough not to overpopulate and wind up starving. Though Being-eating Creatures can choose not to eat beings; some of them just seem to prefer to have Beings on the menu, even if they aren't the only thing on the menu.)

It would be interesting if that idea applied not just to species, but to divisions within a species... i.e., cubi clans. If that were the case, as a member of a clan of two-plus-leader, Dan would have a very high blood-price indeed. (Not that Hizell would be swayed at all by the prospect, or that Cyra would be at all likely to accept.)

More interesting questions this topic raises: How would the blood-price rule apply to Undead? If a being is murdered, but comes back as an Undead, would the murderer still be required to pay a blood-price? (On the one hand, the victim is still around... but on the other, their life as whatever-they-were-before is over.) And if an undead is destroyed, would that call for a blood-price payment? (On the one hand, they were already dead... but on the other, they still had a sort of "life" they had taken away.) Would there be any sort of double jeopardy ruling that you only need to pay a blood-price once for a particular victim (which could come into play both for Undead and for people who fake their own deaths)?

Lawyers and legislators in Furrae clearly have a lot of work cut out for them.

[Somebodyelse]

Even in our world there are places where a blood price can be paid to the bereaved in a murder case. The family may decline it though, in which case the murderer tends to be executed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weregild

[e_voyager]

I suppose it's a good thing someone else started this rather than me. Keeping with the ferret thing I probably would have called it something like loving ferret rage. Or the Rage of ferret friendship.

[keybounce]

Oh no! A full moon! It's turning into a gild :-)

[llearch n'n'daCorna]

Oh no! A full moon! It's turning into a gild :-)

... it seems to be plated.

[GreenReaper]

Biggs' mother was already paying with her life to support him. Most of the things she did have a monetary value; I imagine that was the basis for the settlement. He essentially chose the opt-out clause. Which is fine, if you think you have a good enough case, and the team to extract greater compensation. (Few do.)

The problem is he really seems to have wanted specific performance (which is understandable), but that's impossible now - even if they could bring her back to life, it wouldn't roll back the years lost. So essentially, he's taking the law into his own hands and carving out his own vengeance, demon-style. Good luck with that.

We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be.

[FairWage22]

The intensity and depth of the emotions involved here ALSO explain why Biggs has the secretary he does.   

And why neither he nor his secretary are dead.

[Cassi-kun]

Being part of Zinvth's leading families is probably what saved Regina's neck after the incident, but I'm guessing what happened in regards to the payout was that the very first offer was accepted with no questions or complaints.

[Reeves_Dove]

I'm guessing what happened in regards to the payout was that the very first offer was accepted with no questions or complaints.

Possibly. We're only getting about half the story here, and I doubt either Biggs or Wildy would have been privy to the negotiations (if any) that took place. And there's definitely some cultural clashing going on, too - for demons (and other Creatures), weregild is normal and just Part Of How Things Are if you don't want to deal with kicking off a revenge cycle. (Plus, a lot of Creatures don't see Beings as real people, which is its own different problem.)

But for Beings (certainly, for Biggs), being offered money in exchange for the death of a loved one is...it seems tacky, at best, like the murderer thinks that enough money will wash their hands clean. Like the person offering the weregild thinks that a large enough sum can possibly make you whole, after such a loss.

Sorting out that cultural disconnect, and trying to even the playing field, is going to take some work.

(Regina being related to much more powerful demons is definitely the only reason why she's still alive right now, though. With how much Wildy, Biggs, and Dan all hate her? If they'd been able to track her down and take her out, they would have a long time ago. I suspect that Kria had barely been letting Regina out of the house, considering that Wildy and Biggs hadn't had any idea of where Regina was.)

[Kazy]

It's cold, but it's also the sort of thing that happens every day in the real world.