10/12/12 [DMFA #1360] - Zero Search Results

[Eli_In_Chains]

Now, a Dragon would have a LOT of motive (killing off the last of Cyra's clan), and they have a LOT of power, particularly the older ones. However, their power tends to be more blunt and direct... along the lines of "damn near impossible to kill, breath weapon which will fry anything, claws and teeth capable of puncturing YES..." while they are cunning and crafty plotters, and do love to take their time holding a grudge, not many dragons would be capable of manipulating an Oracle like that. Not without causing one heck of a ruckus.

I think they could and would.  If we look at page 841, Rose says that Dragons and Fae are in the Furrae universe because it doesn't matter if they break it.  So it looks to me like Dragons have some serious cosmic-level power.  It would not surprise me if they were the ones who created some of the races, such as 'Cubi, Angels and Demons as some kind of experiment.

If that's the case, then how did the Cubi not get annihilated in the Dragon-Cubi wars?

Again, Dragons might have the power, but they tend to use it less subtly. Less "Xanatos Roulette" and more "ROFLSTOMP".

If you have any examples that prove dragons are unsubtle stompy-stompy brutes, you're free to share them. I, for one, have a perfect example of a well-wrought plan and very subtle power play by a dragon: M'Chek, the dragon killed by Cyra. He was harvesting the souls of those who died in the city of Hishaan to increase his own power, while masquerading as the city's guardian. If making people think you're on their side while you're secretly annihilating their very essence to feed your power isn't subtle, I don't know what is.

You may be pulling a lot of your information on dragons from non-Furrae universes. From what I know of it, your definition of a dragon fits the dragons in D&D to a tee. I can't think of any evidence to show that dragons in Furrae are anything like the brutes you're describing them as, while there seems to be a fair amount of evidence suggesting they're cosmically powerful and just as subtle as an Angel can be.

[Tapewolf]

If that's the case, then how did the Cubi not get annihilated in the Dragon-Cubi wars?

Again, Dragons might have the power, but they tend to use it less subtly. Less "Xanatos Roulette" and more "ROFLSTOMP".

The 'Cubi very nearly did get annihilated.  To be sure, most of the Tri-wings and in many cases their entire clans were, even the inoffensive ones.  In DMFA now there are less than 30'000 individuals surviving (number subject to change at Amber's whim) and although there were supposedly less than 200 ascended 'Cubi ever, there are only about a dozen surviving.

The advent of SAIA and [the actions of] Taun were instrumental in saving the race, not least by providing somewhere off-plane and inaccessible for their youth to hide and be nurtured.  And I believe they did a lot of things to try and lure 'Cubi out of SAIA to their deaths - for instance, they seem to have murdered Siar and her entire clan for the sole purpose of trying to draw out Destania (being Aniz' girlfriend at the time) so they could destroy her and locate Cyra using Destania's link to her.  Which they will also do to Dan if they get the chance.

As others say, you may be relying on non-DMFA stereotypes too much, it's not clear that they are as overtly brutal as that in DMFA.  The vibe I'm getting is that they are very manipulative.  I could be wrong but my understanding is that they painted the 'Cubi as an entire race of deceivers and murderers with an in-built ability to devour souls, so that the other races would do the dirty work of wiping them out for the Dragon race and leave their own hands clean.  Now granted that at the start of the war the 'Cubi weren't saints, but from what Amber's been saying a lot of black propaganda has been seeded about them, most of which simply isn't true.

I will admit that I'm not sure why they didn't simply alter the universe so that 'Cubi can no longer exist there, but it's possible that they have to work in concert to pull off something on that scale and they didn't have a consensus.
EDIT: Or it may simply be that the Fae - even one of them, say Mab - threatened to start killing Dragons off if they pulled a stunt like that.  Because Dragons can die, and Fae can't unless they decide to.

[MT Hazard]

Compounding the issue* is the fact we have seen very few on 'screen'.

Pyroduck is something of an anomaly in that he is young and raised by Phoniexs, there was one dense red dragon mostly used for comedy, and one panel of Pyros father. Can't remember any others off the top of my head.

Could be a matter of upbringing, like cubi. Some might enjoy living as dumb animals for a few hundred years, just like fey act like ditzes.

If Prroul is thinking of D&D dragons, they range from just animals (white and black dragons) to potential masterminds (red, silver and gold dragons), meaning they are capable of stomping and scheming.


*Just how capable/smart/ powerful are DMFA dragons?

[ChaosMageX]

Compounding the issue* is the fact we have seen very few on 'screen'.

Pyroduck is something of an anomaly in that he is young and raised by Phoniexs, there was one dense red dragon mostly used for comedy, and one panel of Pyros father. Can't remember any others off the top of my head.

Could be a matter of upbringing, like cubi. Some might enjoy living as dumb animals for a few hundred years, just like fey act like ditzes.

If Prroul is thinking of D&D dragons, they range from just animals (white and black dragons) to potential masterminds (red, silver and gold dragons), meaning they are capable of stomping and scheming.


*Just how capable/smart/ powerful are DMFA dragons?

You might be right about that, as there have been very few dragon appearances, and I've been keeping track of them all (mostly to try to figure out the general dragon anatomy, especially whether or not their legs are digitigrade or plantigrade by default).

Hizell is probably the most powerful dragon we've seen appear 'on screen', and some speculate that he is Pyroduck's father.

M'Chek was certainly a powerful dragon, given what he was doing in Hishaan and that Cyra was able to use his soul to ascend.

Balorie is another seemingly powerful dragon we've seen from the Demonology 101 page on the species.

If we're counting Demo 101, there's also the elephant dragon, although she might have just been for demonstration purposes and not canonically exist in the DMFA universe.

Pyroduck, seen in full form here, here, here, and here, is a rather young dragon, but if his time travelling is indeed canon and not just a joke, he could be older and much more powerful than he appears.

Shanna the Amazon is probably one of the very young dragons who either hasn't grown into the bulk of her powers yet or is unaware of them and how to use them.

The Red Dragon Dan owed money might have just been used for comedy, but he was still a dragon, though definitely one of the younger, less powerful and/or more ignorant ones.

A Cyan Dragon destroyed the last of the vampire species.

A dragon named Burasi is mentioned but not shown.

There was a brown dragon that crushed a pinto and a blue and yellow dragon proprietor of a mall bookstore, although they might have been mythos since it was never directly stated that they were dragons.

Two creatures that might have been dragons appeared in the Demo 101 Fashion arc, although they too might have been mythos or they were just for demonstration purposes and don't canonically exist.

And finally a pink dragon's foot was seen during the non-canon arc, but it too is likely non-canon.

Altogether, that's 13-14 unique dragons that we've seen or heard of, of which 8-9 are definitely canon dragons (the ranges barring whether or not Hizell and Pyroduck's father are the same dragon).

I'm not sure whether or not Pyroduck's mother is also a dragon, but considering what we've seen of Pyroduck's father's attitude, she likely is one as well, which would increment the above totals.  I vaguely remember Amber stating something about her in the forums, but I can't remember if it was about her race.

Still, these numbers are absolutely no indication of their total canonical population.  We can't assume any steady ratio of total unique individuals appearing in the canon pages of the main comic and side-comics to total current population of their race.  I'm assuming if that were the case, we would have seen A LOT more demons in the comics by now.

[joshofspam]

I'm not sure whether or not Pyroduck's mother is also a dragon, but considering what we've seen of Pyroduck's father's attitude, she likely is one as well, which would increment the above totals.  I vaguely remember Amber stating something about her in the forums, but I can't remember if it was about her race.

I've actually come to wonder if it might be possible that Pyroduck's mother might be of Fa'lina's lost clan.

In fact, has it ever really been mentioned that Hizell killed Fa'lina's entire clan?

All that I can remember is that it says he took her entire clan. That's kind of vague on the details.

[YawnPB]

Fairly sure it's canon that Falina's entire clan is gone, and there is no way to bring them back.

Are we sure that the battle with M'chek was what ascended Cyra?  From the sounds of it the act of killing him backfired all the energy into him causing the "event".  If it all did that how would she use it to ascend?  Plus to even fight a dragon let alone an ancient in the first place she'd pretty much already need to be a tri-wing to stand a chance.  Imho it was just the fact that a Cubi actually killed a powerful dragon that made them go "they are a threat, wipe them out".

[Lying Foo]

The word Aniz used was "genocide."

...how old is Pyroduck, though?  It seems likely Dimanika wouldn't have given her a dragon unless it were after, but...

[joshofspam]

Are we sure that the battle with M'chek was what ascended Cyra?  From the sounds of it the act of killing him backfired all the energy into him causing the "event".  If it all did that how would she use it to ascend?  Plus to even fight a dragon let alone an ancient in the first place she'd pretty much already need to be a tri-wing to stand a chance.  Imho it was just the fact that a Cubi actually killed a powerful dragon that made them go "they are a threat, wipe them out".

From the sound of what has been said and the story that Cyra said already. It does sound like that that it was the energy being forced into her by the damaged spell M'chek was using to gather spells which Cyra didn't know about.

As for killing dragons, remember Ducky didn't get the upper hand of Abel unless he was in his dragon form. Killing a dragon does sound doable, just have to be smart about how you do it. Oddly enough, cubi probably have the best chance at killing dragons because they can use their natural abilities to get a dragon to think their not a threat and skewer them with tentacle wings while their guard is down. Ouch.

[Alondro]

There is another possibility.  The fact that this oracle cannot even see what happened could indicate that someone is directly altering fate, warping it to such a degree that the oracles cannot pierce the mist of uncertainty.

But who...

(At the same moment, in the Zybach Empire, Issac Newton cackles in triumph, "At last I have perfected the Fate Alteration Engine!  MUWAH HA HA HA!!)

Do the laws of quantum physics apply in Furrae?

What does quantum physics have to do with Escaflowne?  ;D

[AmigaDragon]

What does quantum physics have to do with Escaflowne?  ;D

Gangnam physics?

[D'ymkarra]

Just something I thought of, to throw in the mix.

Merlitz was interested in finding humans, or at least proving their existence. And he did so, at one point, when a human stumbled from his own dimension to Merlitz's dimension. It's possible that similar circumstances have taken place. Merlitz might not be on Furrae anymore and may, in fact, be in another dimension. Perhaps with Aliyka, which would explain her absence from the current speculation as well.

Not to muddy the waters of speculation any further, but more to clarify: iirc, isn't Aliyka herself a Phoenix?

[YawnPB]

There are 2 types of phoenix, one being the oracles and the others being avian beings iirc. 

[joshofspam]

Just something I thought of, to throw in the mix.

Merlitz was interested in finding humans, or at least proving their existence. And he did so, at one point, when a human stumbled from his own dimension to Merlitz's dimension. It's possible that similar circumstances have taken place. Merlitz might not be on Furrae anymore and may, in fact, be in another dimension. Perhaps with Aliyka, which would explain her absence from the current speculation as well.

Not to muddy the waters of speculation any further, but more to clarify: iirc, isn't Aliyka herself a Phoenix?

No, I think she's a Gryphon (A) actually...

Though the Demonology page for Pheonix (B)'s says they can turn into a regular (Usually Feline) Being. Though I think Amber mentioned Gryphon (A) change into that hulking form that Aliyka had when she chased after Dan and friends in Dan's first meeting of DP.

[SUPAHsirus]

you know... a few of my favorite comics have died/hiatus recently, i deep down hope this isn't the abyss of comic over, that they cant see past..........

[Mao]

That's a pretty 'doom-and-gloom' thing to say to a comic that's been going pretty strong for 10+ years. XP

I'm pretty sure Mab will give us plenty of heads up when the end of the story is coming.