Well looks like both Kria and Fa'Lina know some important things about the other.
Hooboy. I'd forgotten all about this. So there was more behind the attack than just "Rampage Training 101"...?
Kria has to know that, really, she's hopelessly outpowered. She can't wipe that smug grin off Fa'lina's muzzle. Do Demons pop blood vessels out of sheer pique?
Ain't that always the way with evil people? No trust on either side so they can only work together by getting the goods on each other and using that as blackmail.... :P
I am curious, however, to learn what both of them are talking about....
I believe TVTropes has an entry that I don't want to say :?
And yes, both of them are putting their cards on the table, seeing who will sweat more.
Quote from: Madd the Sane on January 05, 2010, 04:13:56 AM
I believe TVTropes has an entry that I don't want to say :?
And yes, both of them are putting their cards on the table, seeing who will sweat more.
Um...why don't you want to say...?
Quote from: Baal Hadad on January 05, 2010, 04:18:43 AM
Quote from: Madd the Sane on January 05, 2010, 04:13:56 AM
I believe TVTropes has an entry that I don't want to say :?
And yes, both of them are putting their cards on the table, seeing who will sweat more.
Um...why don't you want to say...?
Because it's like a Rickroll, except it takes all day to find your way out.
Quote from: Baal Hadad on January 05, 2010, 04:18:43 AM
Quote from: Madd the Sane on January 05, 2010, 04:13:56 AM
I believe TVTropes has an entry that I don't want to say :?
And yes, both of them are putting their cards on the table, seeing who will sweat more.
Um...why don't you want to say...?
Because of the terminology (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MagnificentBastard).
Edit:
The function is there for this purpose. Theenk of the cheeeldrun!
-- llearch
I can hear that saccharine voice of malice now.
Touchè to both of them.
With the difference being that Fa'Lina anticipated this and came prepared with an answer.
This power play may come with a high price, for both of them. Looks like Aniz still continues to ruin the relationship between Cubi and Zinvth. If I were Fa'Lina, I would have avoided to play that card unless absolutely necessary. But being who she is, her pupils are more important to her.
Quote from: Dard on January 05, 2010, 05:26:05 AM
Looks like Aniz still continues to ruin the relationship between Cubi and Zinvth. If I were Fa'Lina, I would have avoided to play that card unless absolutely necessary. But being who she is, her pupils are more important to her.
Fa'Lina can foresee things. It may be that Aniz still has some important part to play, and that's why she didn't simply kill him or turn him over to Zinvth. Or maybe she simply believes he can somehow redeem himself.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 05:39:25 AM
Fa'Lina can foresee things. It may be that Aniz still has some important part to play, and that's why she didn't simply kill him or turn him over to Zinvth. Or maybe she simply believes he can somehow redeem himself.
Fa'Lina's vision outside SAIA is limited, and I think it is highly unlikely that Aniz is still at SAIA.
I alwas had the impression that Fa'Lina had some sort of still unexplained deal with Aniz. One that she can't back down from. Which put her into an awkward situation both when it comes to Abel and Zinvth.
Quote from: Dard on January 05, 2010, 06:37:49 AM
Fa'Lina's vision outside SAIA is limited, and I think it is highly unlikely that Aniz is still at SAIA.
Point. However, it looks like she was able to foretell that Aniz would not kill May, and neither of them were at SAIA. It's possible she had a contact in Zinvth of course - to tell her that May would soon be passing on - though the way things are going between her and Kria makes that look a little less likely.
The reason why Fa'Lina isn't being helpful in disclosing information is already mentioned previously (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_009.php).
Quote from: Psaakyrn on January 05, 2010, 09:09:07 AM
The reason why Fa'Lina isn't being helpful in disclosing information is already mentioned previously (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_009.php).
I'd say it was more a tantalising glimpse.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 09:12:04 AM
Quote from: Psaakyrn on January 05, 2010, 09:09:07 AM
The reason why Fa'Lina isn't being helpful in disclosing information is already mentioned previously (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_009.php).
I'd say it was more a tantalising glimpse.
I was quite interested about that myself. What would have been the repercussions with Clan Taun, and why?
Was Clan Taun an ally of Clan Siar? Or do they just have something against giving up cubi to demons?
It's possible Taun's Clan wouldn't like any 'Demon Town' helped in any way, and it's a big enough force in SAIA to cause problems-but that's just my guess.
Quote from: tikitori on January 05, 2010, 11:11:57 AM
It's possible Taun's Clan wouldn't like any 'Demon Town' helped in any way, and it's a big enough force in SAIA to cause problems-but that's just my guess.
Or it could just be that the Taun Clan was nothing more than a plot device put there to stop Aniz from meeting his end and making the remaining Abel's Story a lot more anti-climactic.
Only Amber truly knows the answer.
And maybe the Jin clan was planning on building the children's hospital for the morbid purpose of feeding on the childrens' pain as they slowly die from cancer and other things. >:3
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 09:12:04 AM
Quote from: Psaakyrn on January 05, 2010, 09:09:07 AM
The reason why Fa'Lina isn't being helpful in disclosing information is already mentioned previously (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_009.php).
I'd say it was more a tantalising glimpse.
There are other glimpses. Here (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_058.php) for example, in the 1st sentence of the 3rd panel. And also in the first few sentences of Fa'lina's monologue in this one. (http://missmab.com/Comics/Ab_031.php)
It would seem that, politics aside, once Aniz left SAIA, Fa'lina quickly lost (fore)sight of him.
Quote from: candide on January 05, 2010, 11:35:59 AM
It would seem that, politics aside, once Aniz left SAIA, Fa'lina quickly lost (fore)sight of him.
Those only seem to be about the limits of Fa'Lina's foresight, not about why she let Aniz carry on his merry way, which is arguably the more interesting topic :B
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 11:39:15 AM
Quote from: candide on January 05, 2010, 11:35:59 AM
It would seem that, politics aside, once Aniz left SAIA, Fa'lina quickly lost (fore)sight of him.
Those only seem to be about the limits of Fa'Lina's foresight, not about why she let Aniz carry on his merry way, which is arguably the more interesting topic :B
Yeah, it is quite interesting indeed. I mean, Fa'lina's banishment of any further children attending SAIA wouldn't even guarantee a prevention of him having another child, since he could very well train the child himself until the ban was lifted.
I'm assuming that's what cubi who can't easily find SAIA do as well.
Also, who knows what else that psychopath does in his spare time? He could be a cubi version of Jack the Ripper for all we know, especially after seeing the way he slaughtered Hennya and how seemingly easy it was for him to do so.
Quote from: ChaosMageX on January 05, 2010, 11:54:15 AM
Yeah, it is quite interesting indeed. I mean, Fa'lina's banishment of any further children attending SAIA wouldn't even guarantee a prevention of him having another child, since he can train the child himself until the ban was lifted.
I'm assuming that's what cubi who can't easily find SAIA do as well.
Yes, but SAIA has the advantage of the wisdom of many clans. Someone who isn't SAIA-educated will tend to find it much harder, as I understand it. Though I seem to recall hearing there are some clans who simply don't use it out of spite or pettiness or because they hate Fa'Lina or some such reason.
QuoteAlso, who knows what else that psychopath does in his spare time. He could be a cubi version of Jack the Ripper for all we know, especially after seeing the way he slaughtered that girl and how seemingly easy it was for him to do so.
Actually, that may be what Fa'Lina was saying Dan might do by accident (see
strip 491 (http://missmab.com/Comics/Vol_491.php)). Nothing we've seen says Aniz wanted it to kill Hennya, in fact he was horrified afterwards. It looks like it was just a loss of self-control.
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
Even if she cared about yonder magnificent bastard and/or didn't know about what he would do, Fa'lina can't really intervene in Aniz' plans on her own, short of extreme measures such as killing him herself in cold blood. It wasn't an option, as she says herself, she couldn't find it in her to kill him even after he did something horrifically wrong. He was also so hell bent on re raising a crippled clan, for all the wrong reasons, as to deny her shot at parleying at the end of her discussion.
Leaving her with only one option; Do nothing, let this play out and potentially let Destania or any potential assassins of the more unrestrained of Jin's clan to kill him. It would prevent any more inconveniences such as this from happening while dampening political repercussions from Taun's clan as it is beyond the immediate scope of the Zinvth incident. Bonus points if his death looked like an accident.
Zinvth can then be part of damage control. As long as she can be at a stalemate with Kria and not divulge any information, she would come out on top by default as soon as Aniz dies. None the wiser.
I say all this as I intend to open a more refined and renewed inquiry on top of Tapewolf's own. What was so important about Taun's clan's agenda that Fa'lina was forced to deny Kria and the authorities of Zinvth information about a murder and a domestic disturbance by Aniz no less, whom she would take no better glee than to get rid of?
Quote from: Magic on January 05, 2010, 12:48:58 PM
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
This is true, though I'm kind of curious as to how much time she has to brood on things like that when she has a thousand or so students doing weird and wonderful things 24x7...
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 01:29:25 PM
Quote from: Magic on January 05, 2010, 12:48:58 PM
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
This is true, though I'm kind of curious as to how much time she has to brood on things like that when she has a thousand or so students doing weird and wonderful things 24x7...
That and all the paperwork and political duties that come with being the headmistress/president of what could be considered a private tier-one mega-college.
And yet she found the time and engaged in idle chatter with an unimportant bored little Abel at strips #541 and 542, while preparing a welcome for Mab's party. All the while potentially having these responsibilities you speak of. Mystery of mysteries!
Once a young Cubi gave Fa'Lina a PDA as a gift to show her some of the technological marvels coming up with outside of the Academy.
It self-destructed within minutes. :B
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 05:39:25 AM
Fa'Lina can foresee things. It may be that Aniz still has some important part to play, and that's why she didn't simply kill him or turn him over to Zinvth. Or maybe she simply believes he can somehow redeem himself.
Remember here, that every student at SAIA has been, to some extent, adopted by Fa'Lina. She cares for each and every one of them. Plus add that to the fact that she lost every one of her other students from Siar's clan, past and present. Aniz and now Abel are the final pieces left. If Aniz dies, her failure to their clan becomes as complete as her failure to her own.
Quote from: jeffh4 on January 05, 2010, 04:07:58 PM
Aniz and now Abel are the final pieces left.
I don't think it has been established that Abel is Aniz's only offspring; perhaps just his most current. That ban on enrollment seems to be directed at future offspring. Abel might well have
step half-siblings in the world, or perhaps even currently enrolled in SAIA. I doubt that, but I believe the possibility exists.
edit: I guess it would be nice if I got my terminology correct.
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
Once a young Cubi gave Fa'Lina a PDA as a gift to show her some of the technological marvels coming up with outside of the Academy.
Must... not... ask... what... system software... it ran...
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
It self-destructed within minutes. :B
That'd be the Furrae equivalent of Windows Mobile, then.
Quote from: jeffh4 on January 05, 2010, 04:07:58 PM
Remember here, that every student at SAIA has been, to some extent, adopted by Fa'Lina. She cares for each and every one of them.
I think Fa'Lina tries to plan things so that they turn out for the best for those concerned, even if it doesn't seem that way at the time. (See strip 592). Though again, that seems to tie in with foresight which may not be the applicable to those concerned.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 01:29:25 PM
Quote from: Magic on January 05, 2010, 12:48:58 PM
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
This is true, though I'm kind of curious as to how much time she has to brood on things like that when she has a thousand or so students doing weird and wonderful things 24x7...
You may want to take another look at the two strips that I linked to earlier. In one of them, Fa'lina says, point-blank, that Aniz is so unhinged and, therefore, so unpredictable that she can't really tell what he might do next.
So, I'm going with Tapewolf's reply to my earlier comment: we know why Fa'lina can't track Aniz very well after
she let him go. It's her reason
why she let him go that's the interesting subject. :)
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 04:41:22 PM
I think Fa'Lina tries to plan things so that they turn out for the best for those concerned, even if it doesn't seem that way at the time. (See strip 592). Though again, that seems to tie in with foresight which may not be the applicable to those concerned.
In the context of the story then, the annihilation of Siar's clan may have been foreseen by Fa'Lina because of her foresight. Not foresight of Siar, but of Siar's clanmembers at SAIA. However, it was likely that the war was either
1) Too big for Fa'Lina to stop
2) Inevitable because Fa'Lina could not influence Siar or Hazell enough to stop it
Perhaps Fa'Lina foresaw the deaths of Siar's clan, but decided not to interfere, even to save a single one of them because of politics or other reasons. Guilt from that decision could be influencing her subsequent actions with Aniz and Abel.
Quote from: jeffh4 on January 05, 2010, 05:20:14 PM
In the context of the story then, the annihilation of Siar's clan may have been foreseen by Fa'Lina because of her foresight. Not foresight of Siar, but of Siar's clanmembers at SAIA. However, it was likely that the war was either
1) Too big for Fa'Lina to stop
2) Inevitable because Fa'Lina could not influence Siar or Hazell enough to stop it
Or alternatively, she wasn't able to foresee it clearly because it hinged too much on events external to SAIA. It's not clear how well her foresight is able to cope with external dependencies.
Heck, it's possible that something as powerful as Hizell might be able to
block her foresight.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 04:41:22 PM
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
Once a young Cubi gave Fa'Lina a PDA as a gift to show her some of the technological marvels coming up with outside of the Academy.
Must... not... ask... what... system software... it ran...
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
It self-destructed within minutes. :B
That'd be the Furrae equivalent of Windows Mobile, then.
Oh, I dunno. I'm not sure that Symbian would cope much better with being in three different places at once.
And then merging back into one.
And then splitting again, so she could go spend time with someone else...
I'd think the merging would be the difficult part.
I've often wondered how Triplicate Girl (of the Legion of Superheroes) manages that...
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on January 05, 2010, 06:07:32 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 04:41:22 PM
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
Once a young Cubi gave Fa'Lina a PDA as a gift to show her some of the technological marvels coming up with outside of the Academy.
Must... not... ask... what... system software... it ran...
Quote from: Amber Williams on January 05, 2010, 03:37:42 PM
It self-destructed within minutes. :B
That'd be the Furrae equivalent of Windows Mobile, then.
Oh, I dunno. I'm not sure that Symbian would cope much better with being in three different places at once.
And then merging back into one.
And then splitting again, so she could go spend time with someone else...
Wait, since when does she split to be in several places at once? I mean, it's not out of the realm of possibility, this being Fa'Lina, after all. But I don't recall seeing it in the comics.
Quote from: Arcblade on January 05, 2010, 08:28:16 PM
Wait, since when does she split to be in several places at once? I mean, it's not out of the realm of possibility, this being Fa'Lina, after all. But I don't recall seeing it in the comics.
Maybe its something Cubi can do?
Kria questions Fa'Linas loyalties...
I thought that her loyalty were well known:
To the Cubi race, in all its forms.
To Abel the cubi.
To Aniz the cubi.
To every other cubi.
Under the circumstances she might have decided to sacrifice Aniz for the greater good, but saving Aniz from the consequences of his actions is also perfectly in line with her general cubi loyalty.
Shouldn't Kria know this?
Quote from: Stig Hemmer on January 05, 2010, 08:42:40 PM
Shouldn't Kria know this?
Probably not, Cubi (from what I can tell), tend to have a rather dubious reputation. They revel in deceit and secrecy, and as such, any apparent motive can just as easily be another fabrication. Plus, Fa'Lina keeps SAIA tucked away from the rest of the world, which means that only speculation exists as to what goes on in there. I wouldn't be surprised from Kria's comments if she thought the place was something Fa'Lina was using to try and maximize her personal power by creating an army of willing servants.
A combination of ignorance coupled with very few, but consistent facts can easily generate such a view-point.
Fa'lina just handed Kria a very serious problem, an "I saw what you did there" involving Abel both as a witness and a victim. Depending on Kria's response, this tea party could go to DEFCON 1 and put Abel in deadly danger. Since this is a flashback, we know it didn't go THAT far... I can only wonder if they managed to part peacefully, and if so - how?
Kria's only nonviolent way out seems to be "proving" Abel was brainwashed.
Nice moment-o-tension there, Amber!
What's interesting is that Zvinth isn't quite the forward-thinking community of friendly neighborhood demons it makes itself out to be. It's actually a rather vicious expansionist city state, if this interpretation is correct.
Unless we end up with a moment akin to when Kria met Jyrras's mother ... and they start complimenting eachother on how evil they both are.
Remember, Fa'Lina = Evil Succubus.
Quote from: ChaosMageX on January 05, 2010, 01:52:08 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 01:29:25 PM
Quote from: Magic on January 05, 2010, 12:48:58 PM
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
This is true, though I'm kind of curious as to how much time she has to brood on things like that when she has a thousand or so students doing weird and wonderful things 24x7...
That and all the paperwork and political duties that come with being the headmistress/president of what could be considered a private tier-one mega-college.
You assume that she doesn't have people under her to deal with those things. If she did everything, she would go insane.
Unless, of course, she can be in two places at once.
It wouldn't surprise me if sometimes one of Fa'lina's helpers tried to imitate her.
Quote from: Madd the Sane on January 05, 2010, 11:50:48 PM
Quote from: ChaosMageX on January 05, 2010, 01:52:08 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 05, 2010, 01:29:25 PM
Quote from: Magic on January 05, 2010, 12:48:58 PM
No.. no. It may not even be from being able to foresee things. Everyone seems to forget that what Fa'lina doesn't see with her foresight she can probably think about and analyze, you know with having a brain and all?
This is true, though I'm kind of curious as to how much time she has to brood on things like that when she has a thousand or so students doing weird and wonderful things 24x7...
That and all the paperwork and political duties that come with being the headmistress/president of what could be considered a private tier-one mega-college.
You assume that she doesn't have people under her to deal with those things. If she did everything, she would go insane.
Unless, of course, she can be in two places at once.
It wouldn't surprise me if sometimes one of Fa'lina's helpers tried to imitate her.
According to her cast page, Fa'Lina just might be able to be in two places at the same time.
Also, with the aility to predict a good deal of what happens around her, she'll be able to catch most of it before it gets difficult to handle, thus making the least of something that would be a big deal for others to handle.
I mean, how often don't you think "oh, if only i had done that instead of that, things would have been *so* much easier!" ??
Well, Fa'Lina *can* do that with her foresight.
Also, being able to teleport around can cut down on travel time.
And she doesn't need to sleep.
And many of the trouble makers will keep themselves in check, simply because of her fearsome reputation of knowing when they are up to no good!
And she probably have people helping her out as well.
Well with that said it would probably be better for Abel to stay at the academy. :<
With him being a credable witness, even though Kria might want to protect him he might be a target for the person who was ordering Kria around. :erk
Then again could this be a plot to silence Abel once they get their hands on him? :paranoid
Quote from: The1Kobra on January 05, 2010, 09:00:18 PM
I wouldn't be surprised from Kria's comments if she thought [SAIA] was something Fa'Lina was using to try and maximize her personal power by creating an army of willing servants.
That would be a fair assumption to a demon, seeing as how they treat power as the biggest and best qualifier.
Quote from: Anker Steadfast on January 05, 2010, 11:11:05 PMRemember, Fa'Lina = Evil Succubus.
Has it actually been established that she's evil? Some of what I've seen of her could be interpreted as good, she can be pleasant or helpful (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_580.php), other could be seen more as neutral. There's more than just the good-evil scale, there's other possible scales to add more dimension to the characters: (borrowing from D&D) lawful-chaotic, ... I'm coming up at a loss to present others right now, but perhaps you get my point.
She seems good, and she's got a code of ethics. (see also: when Aniz dropped off Abel.) However, she is willing to kick butt in the name of "You've really pissed me off!" Which is deffinitely not a 'good' quality. She's not capricious or overly whimsical, and she doesn't seem to want to destroy lots of things. She's also not subversive (in the classically evil sense at least).
I would rate her Lawful Neutral.
Quote from: Shachza on January 08, 2010, 02:18:26 AM
I would rate her Lawful Neutral.
People who make the laws do tend to end up enforcing them. I'm still thinking about if that makes them lawful or not...
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on January 08, 2010, 04:28:46 AM
People who make the laws do tend to end up enforcing them. I'm still thinking about if that makes them lawful or not...
It sure does.
Chaotic people may come up with rules, but they're willing to forgoe them if it seems like a better idea than continuing to follow them.
Quote from: Shachza on January 08, 2010, 11:13:53 AM
It sure does.
Chaotic people may come up with rules, but they're willing to forgoe them if it seems like a better idea than continuing to follow them.
Enforcing the rules doesn't mean you're not chaotic. It just means you're taking advantage of the rules to screw people. If you later change your mind...
(I'll admit I'm still thinking this position over; it's possible that the term I'm thinking of is correct...)
Quote from: Shachza on January 08, 2010, 02:18:26 AM
However, she is willing to kick butt in the name of "You've really pissed me off!" Which is deffinitely not a 'good' quality.
'Good' does not have to be 'nice'. Moreover, as headmistress of SAIA with all that entails Fa'lina pretty much
has to demonstrate that she's nobody's doormat every so often; that says nothing about her personality (although I'm willing to forgive her for enjoying it every so often ;)), it just comes with the job. Take the conversation this thread is about, for example: At a glance, could you tell me how much of what we see is her true self, and how much is just her talking to a demon -- creatures who respect power first and foremost, after all -- on a level that the latter will 'get'?
At this point, I don't consider Fa'lina 'evil' and it would take a fairly shocking reversal to make me change my mind about that -- we've simply never seen her
do anything that would honestly qualify. Whether she's truly 'good' in a meaningful sense is somewhat harder to make out and so the jury's still out on that as far as I'm concerned, but I'm willing to go out on a limb and hereby state that if I had a choice in who I'd rather run into in a dark alley at night, I'd pick Fa'lina over Kria anytime. At least that way I might
live to have nightmares afterwards. :animesweat
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 03:55:49 AM
At this point, I don't consider Fa'lina 'evil' and it would take a fairly shocking reversal to make me change my mind about that -- we've simply never seen her do anything that would honestly qualify.
Well, you've got the whole 'founding a school that teaches people to eat other people's souls' :B
I don't really know what her actual take is on that, she might view it a necessary evil. With Fa'Lina it's very difficult to tell because she tends to assume different personalities depending on who she talks to (see her cast page). E.g. when talking with Aary, she joked about killing Beings, when dealing with Abel she's more sympathetic.
QuoteI'm willing to go out on a limb and hereby state that if I had a choice in who I'd rather run into in a dark alley at night, I'd pick Fa'lina over Kria anytime. At least that way I might live to have nightmares afterwards. :animesweat
If you were a Being and you did something that irritated her, like being in her path, I wouldn't stake your life upon it. If you were 'Cubi, then you'd probably do okay.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 09, 2010, 08:28:34 AM
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 03:55:49 AM
At this point, I don't consider Fa'lina 'evil' and it would take a fairly shocking reversal to make me change my mind about that -- we've simply never seen her do anything that would honestly qualify.
Well, you've got the whole 'founding a school that teaches people to eat other people's souls' :B
I don't really know what her actual take is on that, she might view it a necessary evil. With Fa'Lina it's very difficult to tell because she tends to assume different personalities depending on who she talks to (see her cast page). E.g. when talking with Aary, she joked about killing Beings, when dealing with Abel she's more sympathetic.
Cubi eat souls (when they do) more or less naturally, so it's not as though she was deliberately instigating it. I
will concede that we don't know much about where she stands with regard to Beings -- most people we've seen her relate to to date were cubi, with the occasional other Creature thrown in. That uncertainty is one of the remaining reasons I haven't just filed her under 'good' yet.
QuoteQuoteI'm willing to go out on a limb and hereby state that if I had a choice in who I'd rather run into in a dark alley at night, I'd pick Fa'lina over Kria anytime. At least that way I might live to have nightmares afterwards. :animesweat
If you were a Being and you did something that irritated her, like being in her path, I wouldn't stake your life upon it. If you were 'Cubi, then you'd probably do okay.
Well, I
do know that if I was a Being,
Kria would probably kill or eat me for no better reason than being there and have all but forgotten about it five minutes later. That's the way she's been pretty consistently portrayed. Compared to that...nope, I'd still take my chances with Fa'lina. :P
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 08:56:59 AM
Cubi eat souls (when they do) more or less naturally, so it's not as though she was deliberately instigating it.
Actually, I think you'll find it's something they
have to be taught (http://clockworkmansion.com/forum/index.php?topic=746.msg18019#msg18019), as opposed to a reflex ability.
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 09, 2010, 09:05:03 AM
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 08:56:59 AM
Cubi eat souls (when they do) more or less naturally, so it's not as though she was deliberately instigating it.
Actually, I think you'll find it's something they have to be taught (http://clockworkmansion.com/forum/index.php?topic=746.msg18019#msg18019), as opposed to a reflex ability.
Hmmm. Raises the question (independent of the 'natural'/'magical' distinction made in that thread) of whether it's
(a) a trick that
anybody, including non-cubi, could potentially learn, or
(b) something cubi-specific that only they can pick up but still need to practice to realize their potential, or
(c) something all cubi
can in fact do by default but not all
choose to.
Also, to get back to my original point, the Academy is probably not the only place where cubi who want to learn all about this soul-devouring bit can do so. Presumably, they do usually get some sort of basic education by their clan before they're sent to SAIA (Dan and Abel being exceptions for the obvious reason -- they didn't even
know what they were until their headwings popped out).
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 09:38:15 AM
Hmmm. Raises the question (independent of the 'natural'/'magical' distinction made in that thread) of whether it's
(a) a trick that anybody, including non-cubi, could potentially learn, or
(b) something cubi-specific that only they can pick up but still need to practice to realize their potential, or
(c) something all cubi can in fact do by default but not all choose to.
It's certainly not restricted to 'Cubi, because Angels and Demons can also do this. It might be that they have to use a spell and 'Cubi don't, but I'm not convinced.
Personally, the way I've been approaching it for RP and writing is that it's probably a spell which
anyone can cast, if they know how to. What might be different is that 'Cubi can utilise the energy in ways that Demons and Angels may not be able to. Either way, I'm open to corrections.
QuoteAlso, to get back to my original point, the Academy is probably not the only place where cubi who want to learn all about this soul-devouring bit can do so. Presumably, they do usually get some sort of basic education by their clan before they're sent to SAIA (Dan and Abel being exceptions for the obvious reason -- they didn't even know what they were until their headwings popped out).
Agreed. In any case, since Fa'Lina's ultimate goal seems to be to protect her race, it's possible that she considers soul-stealing to be part of the price of doing that. As I understand it, while it has other uses, soul-eating is the main way 'Cubi power themselves up if they wish to attempt to become tri-winged. It also seems to extend their lives even if they don't go for broke. Keeping the right 'Cubi alive might be the difference between success or failure.
Anyhow, my contention is that she's neutral.
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 08:56:59 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 09, 2010, 08:28:34 AM
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 09, 2010, 03:55:49 AM
I'm willing to go out on a limb and hereby state that if I had a choice in who I'd rather run into in a dark alley at night, I'd pick Fa'lina over Kria anytime. At least that way I might live to have nightmares afterwards. :animesweat
If you were a Being and you did something that irritated her, like being in her path, I wouldn't stake your life upon it. If you were 'Cubi, then you'd probably do okay.
Well, I do know that if I was a Being, Kria would probably kill or eat me for no better reason than being there and have all but forgotten about it five minutes later. That's the way she's been pretty consistently portrayed. Compared to that...nope, I'd still take my chances with Fa'lina. :P
Kria can be pleasant when she wants to be, whether it's for a job (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_24.php) or with someone she already knows (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_67.php) (
from that job in this case). So if she likes you, I'd say you're fairly safe in that dark alley with her.
BTW, I'm wondering (and forget whether it had been addressed) if Kria realized Abel was a cubi before she first saw his headwings (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Abel_66.php).
Quote from: Tapewolf on January 09, 2010, 09:49:55 AM
Personally, the way I've been approaching it for RP and writing is that it's probably a spell which anyone can cast, if they know how to. What might be different is that 'Cubi can utilise the energy in ways that Demons and Angels may not be able to. Either way, I'm open to corrections.
So what you're saying is that even beings could devour souls to extend their life spans, if they knew the right spell? :mwaha
Quote from: ChaosMageX on January 09, 2010, 01:30:24 PM
So what you're saying is that even beings could devour souls to extend their life spans, if they knew the right spell? :mwaha
Using it to extend their lifespans is the bit which might possibly be 'Cubi-specific, since it is known that 'Cubi are energy-feeders. However, you could no doubt devise some kind of spell to extend the life of an Angel, Demon or possibly even a Being using soul energy to drive it. (EDIT: Life-extension is sold in Zinvth and souls can be used to power enchantments, so I think that's pretty much nailed down.)
With Beings, it depends whether they have the magical talent to cast the spell. It's also possible that the techniques involved would take longer than a Being's lifespan to learn.
But! If you were a Being with the right kind of enchanted doodads, I don't see why you could not go around devouring people to extend your own wicked life, a'la Elric of Meliboné and his soul-stealing sword, Stormbringer. (Well, notwithstanding that you'd eventually have a high-powered Creature hired to take you down)
Quote from: AmigaDragon on January 08, 2010, 12:55:13 AM
Quote from: Anker Steadfast on January 05, 2010, 11:11:05 PMRemember, Fa'Lina = Evil Succubus.
Has it actually been established that she's evil? Some of what I've seen of her could be interpreted as good, she can be pleasant or helpful (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_580.php), other could be seen more as neutral. There's more than just the good-evil scale, there's other possible scales to add more dimension to the characters: (borrowing from D&D) lawful-chaotic, ... I'm coming up at a loss to present others right now, but perhaps you get my point.
It's a good point, but I think we can certainly remove
the good option (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_493.php) from the equation.
Offcourse, one species definition of evil, might be radically different from anothers.
As for extending lifespans, I'd reckon that any being / creature with enough magic and knowledge at their command, should be capable of extending their lives. Like, say, a necromancer could drain people for magical energy and use it to extend his own life, (isn't that what Dark Pegasus is doing ? ) while a wizard would have to come up with some other way to gather enough magical force to do the same spell.
Offcourse, not every creature / being are capable of using magic, so those have to rely on others for life extension. Or have very long lifes naturally, like Matilda.
Quote from: Anker Steadfast on January 12, 2010, 04:57:59 AMIt's a good point, but I think we can certainly remove the good option (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_493.php) from the equation.
Actually, no. That strip just conclusively establishes that (a) Fa'lina's
clan isn't one of those mentioned who focus on peaceful activities (we will assume she's telling the truth there) and (b) she, personally, isn't above hitting things to solve her problems just like virtually every other member of the cast at some time or other. That's a far cry from "definitely not good". (In fact, check the following strip for her explanation
why she KO'd Dan like that...whether giving him a headache to spare his feelings is a good idea may be debatable, but at least she tried. ;))
Quote from: A. Lurker on January 12, 2010, 07:49:57 AM
Quote from: Anker Steadfast on January 12, 2010, 04:57:59 AMIt's a good point, but I think we can certainly remove the good option (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_493.php) from the equation.
Actually, no. That strip just conclusively establishes that (a) Fa'lina's clan isn't one of those mentioned who focus on peaceful activities (we will assume she's telling the truth there) and (b) she, personally, isn't above hitting things to solve her problems just like virtually every other member of the cast at some time or other. That's a far cry from "definitely not good". (In fact, check the following strip for her explanation why she KO'd Dan like that...whether giving him a headache to spare his feelings is a good idea may be debatable, but at least she tried. ;))
Since she's a Tri-wing, she's basically the epitome of her clan ... so yes, that pretty much removes the good option I think.
As for having a good reason, doesn't exclude being evil as well.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions and all that.
:)