The Clockwork Mansion

The Grand Hallway => The Outer Fortress => Topic started by: Unbeknownst on July 27, 2009, 07:24:46 PM

Title: Games you lurve
Post by: Unbeknownst on July 27, 2009, 07:24:46 PM
Post in this topic your fave games,
Mine would be:

Dawn of war II
Prototype
World of warcraft
Crysis
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: rabid_fox on July 27, 2009, 07:26:15 PM

Monopoly
Scrabble
Ludo
Articulate
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Sunblink on July 27, 2009, 08:00:37 PM
Fallout 3
Team Fortress 2
Soulcalibur III and IV
Assassin's Creed (I CANNOT WAIT FOR THE SEQUEL)
Super Mario Sunshine
Luigi's Mansion
Most of the hand-held system Pokemon games
Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time and WindWaker
Paper Mario and Paper Mario 2
Phoenix Wright
Final Fantasy X and IX

I'll think of some more later; I think I'm missing a few Nintendo 64 games. Right now Fallout 3 and Team Fortress 2 are my obsessions.

Quote from: rabid_fox on July 27, 2009, 07:26:15 PM

Monopoly
Scrabble
Ludo
Articulate

I lol'd
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kenji on July 27, 2009, 09:58:54 PM
Playing currently:
Star Ocean First Departure
Star Ocean Second Evolution
World of Warcraft

(Does the drinking game count?)

Beaten already and not playing currently:
Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess
Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time
Legend of Zelda Oracle of Ages & Seasons
Klonoa Door to Phantomile/ Klonoa Wii
Klonoa 2 Lunatea's Veil
Super Mario World 2 Yoshi's Island
Super Mario World Yoshi's Island 2
Gauntlet Dark Legacy
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Ryudo Lee on July 27, 2009, 10:02:27 PM
System Shock 2
Stonekeep
Metroid 2
Super Metroid
Super Mario World
Starcraft
Diablo 2 (which I have recently rediscovered)
Kirby's Adventure (or Kirby Nightmare in Dreamland for GBA)
Kirby Superstar Ultra
Earthbound
Mother 3
Warcraft 3
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Teh_Hobo on July 27, 2009, 11:08:28 PM
Anachronox (it saddens me so much that there will never be a sequel. :<)
Fallout 1, 2, and Tactics
Half Life 1 & 2
Baldurs Gate 2
Star Ocean
Front Mission
Elona
Audiosurf
X-Com: UFO Defense
just about anything off of Popcap Games
Serious Sam
if mods count, then Half Life 2: SMod
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Corgatha Taldorthar on July 27, 2009, 11:23:42 PM
Didn't we have a thread for this already? Ahh, it probably died anyway.


For me

Chess
World in Flames
Master of Magic
Age of Empires 2
Planescape Torment.
Heroes of Might and Magic 3
Heroes of Might and Magic 5
Ultimas 4-7
Ultima Underworld 1 and 2
X-Com Ufo Defense
Wing Commander 3

If we're counting mods and fan made stuff we have
The Alcritas Arc. (Series of Blades of Exile scenarios)
Fall from Heaven (Civ 4 mod)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Zina on July 28, 2009, 12:56:11 AM
Hide and seek.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: TheDXM on July 28, 2009, 02:25:38 AM
Chess,
Devil May Cry 1, 3, and 4,
Deus Ex,
Ultima 7 TBG&SI, ( I wish my 64 bit OS didn't have such a problem with it )
Thief 1, and 2, ( sigh, incompatibility... Deus Ex didn't do this to me! )
Left 4 Dead,
Team Fortress 2.

At least those are the ones I don't see myself setting down for a long time.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 04:31:20 AM
Quote from: The DXM on July 28, 2009, 02:25:38 AM
Ultima 7 TBG&SI, ( I wish my 64 bit OS didn't have such a problem with it )
Ultima 7 is essentially its own OS, at least where memory management is concerned.  It's been a problem ever since Windows 95 (Windows 3.1 you could get rid of when you wanted to do stuff)
Run it inside DOSbox with EMS switched off and it should be happy as Larry.  If you want, I can give you the config file I use.

QuoteThief 1, and 2, ( sigh, incompatibility... Deus Ex didn't do this to me! )
So far, so good, though I'm still running those in W2K at the moment, I haven't tried them in W7-64 (Deus Ex worked).
I hear Thief and SS2 are getting a bit finicky in terms of graphics cards, tough.  Or rather, the manufacturers are getting lazy and dropping support for the video modes they use.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: ilpalazzo on July 28, 2009, 05:29:42 AM
The games I tend to play quite a bit

WoW
Metal Gear Online
Resident Evil 2
Bloody Roar 2
Suikoden 2
the whole Fallout series
Street fighter games
King of Fighters
Guilty Gear...

I'll stop there XD
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Dannysaysnoo on July 28, 2009, 09:06:02 AM
Quote from: Ryudo Lee on July 27, 2009, 10:02:27 PM
Metroid 2

Strange, never seen someone say that Metroid 2 is one of thier favorites :S

But anyway, some of my good 'uns.

Metroid Zero Mission
Dead Rising
Alone in the Dark (2008)
Half Life 1 and 2
Ultima 7
Call of Duty 5
Oblivion
Rock Band
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Suwako on July 28, 2009, 10:23:06 AM
Of all time...

Socom: US navy seals II
Rollercoaster Tycoon
Age of empires II
Warcraft III
Global Operations
Unreal Tournament
Heroes of might and magic 3
God of War
War of the Monsters
Dead or Alive 2
Team Fortress 2\
Unreal II: The Awakening

Currectly:

Socom: Confrontation ( Socom fanboyism, ahoy )
Killzone 2
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Vidar on July 28, 2009, 11:24:19 AM
Currently:
Morrowind
Aquaria
Openttd
Oblivion
Dwarf Fortress (gotta love those silly dorfs)

non-computer stuff:
Rubik's cube (solved)
Megaminx (solved)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Ryudo Lee on July 28, 2009, 11:30:06 AM
Quote from: Dannysaysnoo on July 28, 2009, 09:06:02 AM
Quote from: Ryudo Lee on July 27, 2009, 10:02:27 PM
Metroid 2
Strange, never seen someone say that Metroid 2 is one of thier favorites :S

Metroid 2 has always been one of my favorites.  I'm part of that tiny tiny minority that actually enjoys that game.  I got my mother in on it too.  We go back and forth, trying to see who can finish it the fastest.  She's currently in the lead with an hour and eleven minutes.

Quote from: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 04:31:20 AM
I hear Thief and SS2 are getting a bit finicky in terms of graphics cards, tough.  Or rather, the manufacturers are getting lazy and dropping support for the video modes they use.

They are.  I believe that nVidia stopped supporting their graphics features after the version 147 drivers, and any card beyond the GeForce 8500 IIRC.  I can only run those games on my laptop, which is using an ATI Xpress.  The Catalyst drivers don't seem to have a problem with those games.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 11:44:02 AM
Quote from: Ryudo Lee on July 28, 2009, 11:30:06 AM
They are.  I believe that nVidia stopped supporting their graphics features after the version 147 drivers, and any card beyond the GeForce 8500 IIRC.  I can only run those games on my laptop, which is using an ATI Xpress.  The Catalyst drivers don't seem to have a problem with those games.

I wonder why?  I wouldn't have thought that emulating a 16bpp buffer on a native 32bpp display in software would really be all that hard.  Surely you'd just need a 64k lookup table.


Anyway, some of my old favourites:

8-bit
Jet Set Willy (Original ZX Spectrum version)
Monty On The Run (C64 version)
Auf Wiedersehen Monty (Spectrum 128k version)
Alchemist (ZX Spectrum)
Riptoff (ZX Spectrum)
Repton 3, Infinity (BBC Micro)
Citadel (BBC Micro)

PC
Doom, Doom 2, Heretic, Hexen
Simeon the Sorcerer
Monkey Island
Loom
Beneath a Steel Sky
Ultima 6-9
System Shock 1&2
Thief 1&2
Deus Ex
Arx Fatalis
Morrowind
Oblivion

...and probably many more I can't think of right now.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Corgatha Taldorthar on July 28, 2009, 11:51:20 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 11:44:02 AM

Ultima 6-9


Holla, you *liked* u9?  :erk
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 11:53:23 AM
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on July 28, 2009, 11:51:20 AM
Holla, you *liked* u9?  :erk

How can you not like a game which allows you to climb up mountains using a bottle, kill gardeners and children without any penalty at all, and cross oceans on bridges made from loaves of bread?

Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Corgatha Taldorthar on July 28, 2009, 11:55:41 AM
By remembering all the previous Ultima canon that the brutally butchered? I cried when I saw the broken glass in the  museum, from the case that held the runes that were stolen decades ago.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kipiru on July 28, 2009, 11:57:16 AM
UNREAL 2
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 11:57:31 AM
Quote from: Corgatha Taldorthar on July 28, 2009, 11:55:41 AM
By remembering all the previous Ultima canon that the brutally butchered? I cried when I saw the broken glass in the  museum, from the case that held the runes that were stolen decades ago.
The trick is to pretend it's not an Ultima game.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Suwako on July 28, 2009, 12:00:10 PM
Quote from: Kipiru on July 28, 2009, 11:57:16 AM
UNREAL 2

Unreal 2: The awakening!

oh, love love loev.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Dannysaysnoo on July 28, 2009, 01:42:18 PM
Quote from: Tytaj on July 28, 2009, 12:00:10 PM
Quote from: Kipiru on July 28, 2009, 11:57:16 AM
UNREAL 2

Unreal 2: The awakening!

oh, love love loev.

Playing it right now :D
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 01:48:52 PM
I forgot to mention, although I spend an inordinate amount of time depriving Necromancers of their immortal souls in Oblivion (and finishing the anti-walkthrough one day, I promise) I am currently taking Mr. JC 'Joshua' Denton on a tour of New York committing random acts of terror peacekeeping.  Hence the picture that Ren drew.  Or rather, I am currently doing this because of the discussion Ren and I had while he was drawing the picture.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: hapless on July 28, 2009, 01:53:46 PM
Hmm... Doom, Doom ][, first Unreal, first Half-Life, Deus Ex, Wizardry 7 and 8, Jagged Alliance 2, Earth 2150... and that would be it. I haven't played a game since quite a few years.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: TheDXM on July 28, 2009, 04:55:03 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 01:48:52 PMI am currently taking Mr. JC 'Joshua' Denton on a tour of New York committing random acts of terror peacekeeping.

I hope it's almost as good as locking Walton Simons in the closet and putting UNATCO into the state of a functional mad house.

Best wishes, oh Lord and Master of Mischief.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Brunhidden on July 28, 2009, 04:56:50 PM
i miss Dungeon Keeper 2

oh vista, why must you hate my games so?
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Forycles on July 28, 2009, 05:07:49 PM
I 'lurve'(is it rude to put it in quotations?):

Disgaea DS
Soul Calibur II for GC
Wind Waker
Professor Layton
World Ends With You...

A lot of the games I own, I guess.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kipiru on July 28, 2009, 05:27:01 PM
Quote from: Dannysaysnoo on July 28, 2009, 01:42:18 PM
Quote from: Tytaj on July 28, 2009, 12:00:10 PM
Quote from: Kipiru on July 28, 2009, 11:57:16 AM
UNREAL 2

Unreal 2: The awakening!

oh, love love loev.

Playing it right now :D
Bit of a spoiler: I almost cried at the end of this game!
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: bill on July 28, 2009, 08:26:42 PM
this almost almost makes me want to play Unreal II, it was received badly when it was released, if I remember right
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Fibre on July 28, 2009, 09:27:51 PM
Well, here's the ones that have really captured my attention out of the few that I have played:

Quote from: Tapewolf on July 28, 2009, 11:44:02 AM
I wouldn't have thought that emulating a 16bpp buffer on a native 32bpp display in software would really be all that hard.  Surely you'd just need a 64k lookup table.
I'd be very surprised if a 256kB (64k*32b) lookup table would be more efficient than just doing the conversion directly on a current general-purpose CPU, and especially on a GPU which is where I would think that it would be done...
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 29, 2009, 06:44:42 AM

*****
Caution - there now follows a highly technical discussion of low-level graphics manipulation.  I suggest you don't read it.  You have been warned, so don't blame me if reading it does make your head explode.
*****


Quote from: Fibre on July 28, 2009, 09:27:51 PM
I'd be very surprised if a 256kB (64k*32b) lookup table would be more efficient than just doing the conversion directly on a current general-purpose CPU, and especially on a GPU which is where I would think that it would be done...

Maybe.  A lot depends on the formats involved.  16bpp can be coded either as RRRRRGGGGGBBBBB0, or RRRRRGGGGGGBBBBB or sometimes with the R and B reversed.  Assuming the latter and an RGBA target you would presumably have to do something like:

xor edx,edx
mov dx, [16bpp source]

mov eax,edx
shl eax,16
and eax, 0xf8000000  ; R

mov al,dl
shl dx,12; B
and edx, 0x0000f800
or eax,edx

shl edx, 13
and edx, 0x00fc0000
or eax, edx ; G

mov [framebuffer],eax

...I think there may be a few bugs in there, but you'd have to do something like that for each pixel.  Unless I'm much mistaken, MMX and friends don't support packed 16BPP so it would have to be done manually as I have done here.  You would need a different algorithm for each combination of input and output pixel format, and if it was being done on-the-fly you'd also need logic to choose the right algorithm which either means using a function pointer (and more performance hit) or some kind of if-then-else logic which will also be slow.

With a lookup table you can precompute it, and so something like:

xor esi,esi
mov si, [16bpp source]
shl esi,2
add esi,lookuptable
lodsd
mov [framebuffer],eax

...which _should_ be quicker.

If we do have any assembly-heads, optimisations would be welcome.  Does coding belong in the Tower of Art?

EDIT:

Here are the C equivalents:

// bitshifting

unsigned short in16bpp = *inbuffer++;
unsigned long out32bpp = ((in16bpp << 16)&0xf8000000) | ((in16bpp << 12)&0x00fc0000) | ((in16bpp << 13)&0xf800);
*outbuffer++ = out32bpp;

// lookup

unsigned short in16bpp = *inbuffer++;
unsigned long out32bpp = lookup[in16bpp];
*outbuffer++ = out32bpp;


EDIT EDIT:
To get back to your original point, the issue is that the GPU isn't doing this, or at least is doing it in a half-assed manner that gives you about 8bpp worth of colourspace instead of 16bpp, ruining the shadows.   What I'm essentially proposing is software emulation layer to have the game running inside a 32bpp framebuffer.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: hapless on July 29, 2009, 07:40:56 AM
I have to admit that this is the first time I heard of dropping support for 16bpp.
Anyway, that would have to be implemented in form of a patch to the video driver (which manufacturers aren't wanting to do), or to the executable itself, wouldn't it?
Other point to keep in mind is the fact that memory access is relatively expensive, taking "a little" more than one CPU cycle. While a 256KB table would technically fit in the L2 cache of most recent processors, it would be probably fetched from memory anyway. Computation MIGHT be faster. After all it's only a few bit ops... and that's what the CPU's best at.

//h(oping what he said makes some sense)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 29, 2009, 07:48:37 AM
Quote from: hapless on July 29, 2009, 07:40:56 AM
I have to admit that this is the first time I heard of dropping support for 16bpp.
Anyway, that would have to be implemented in form of a patch to the video driver (which manufacturers aren't wanting to do), or to the executable itself, wouldn't it?
Yes, you'd need to patch the EXE.  If memory serves, the Thief engine has DLLs for its output drivers, but I'd have to check.

QuoteOther point to keep in mind is the fact that memory access is relatively expensive, taking "a little" more than one CPU cycle. While a 256KB table would technically fit in the L2 cache of most recent processors, it would be probably fetched from memory anyway. Computation MIGHT be faster. After all it's only a few bit ops... and that's what the CPU's best at.
Yes.  It's the sort of thing you'd need to measure in real-world tests to establish which algorithm works best, and it would probably end up different on different setups.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Fibre on July 29, 2009, 08:02:57 AM
Obviously I should have posted this before, but I actually tried it and with a very naive C implementation saw about identical speeds between direct conversion and a lookup table. GCC4.3 was able to vectorize the loop with MMX, although I didn't look at the details of what it was doing and highly suspect that it could optimized quite a bit more as GCC really doesn't seem to be that good at this type of thing.

Unfortunately I have to run off to work but when I get home this evening I'll post the details and a full reply, and maybe try my hand at a hand-optimized kernel if someone doesn't beat me to it.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 29, 2009, 08:07:50 AM
Quote from: Fibre on July 29, 2009, 08:02:57 AM
Obviously I should have posted this before, but I actually tried it and with a very naive C implementation saw about identical speeds between direct conversion and a lookup table. GCC4.3 was able to vectorize the loop with MMX, although I didn't look at the details of what it was doing and highly suspect that it could optimized quite a bit more as GCC really doesn't seem to be that good at this type of thing.

I stand corrected.  I will have to give this a go, it could be a fun project.  (Writing the conversion layer, that is.  Injecting it into Thief is beyond my ability.)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: TheJimTimMan on July 29, 2009, 12:00:10 PM
Lets see...
Half Life 2
[HL2 mods] Research and Development (Imploding microwaves, anyone?)
               Action Half-Life 2: The Sauce of Death
Deus Ex (I feel guilty for still not having finished this, despite buying it about a year ago)
S.T.A.L.K.E.R. Shadow of Chernobyl (Using STALKER Complete 2009)
Unreal Tournament 2004
Unreal Tournament 3
Half Life 1 (Unfinished)
[HL1 mods] Sven Co-op
               The Specialists
Minecraft
Freespace 2
Mondo Agency
Diablo 2: Lord of Destruction
[D2 mod] Median XL
Cortex Command
[CC mods] Far too many to list, the game practically lives on them... not that thats a bad thing.
Mass Effect
Cave Story
Portal
Plants vs. Zombies (Melon-pults, FIRE!)
As well a whole lot I've probably forgotten somewhere.

Rapid-fire edit: Eve Online and World in Conflict. Might as well toss TF2 in there as well.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Teh_Hobo on July 29, 2009, 12:40:38 PM
GAH How could I forget S.T.A.L.K.E.R.??!? and Clear Sky, for that matter! I'll have to try the Complete 2009 mod.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Ryudo Lee on July 29, 2009, 12:42:53 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 29, 2009, 08:07:50 AM
I stand corrected.  I will have to give this a go, it could be a fun project.  (Writing the conversion layer, that is.  Injecting it into Thief is beyond my ability.)

If someone could inject it into Thief (1 & 2 and System Shock 2) then that someone would be loved by many.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Dannysaysnoo on July 29, 2009, 12:43:43 PM
Ooh, thought of another good un. Tomb Raider 3.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kipiru on July 29, 2009, 03:08:26 PM
Quote from: bill on July 28, 2009, 08:26:42 PM
this almost almost makes me want to play Unreal II, it was received badly when it was released, if I remember right

Yeah, people said it didn't have an intense enough gameplay and a good enough story- none of them I bet had ever actually gotten beyond the first Skaarj in the elevator, otherwise they wouldn't be saying such nonsense. The game is a classic in my book.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Noone on July 29, 2009, 04:25:31 PM
My Favorites are: (well, the ones that crossed my mind anyways)

Neverwinter Nights
Neverwinter Nights 2
Planescape Torment
Baldur's Gate 2
Starcraft
Master of Magic
Chess
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Fibre on July 29, 2009, 08:13:19 PM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 29, 2009, 06:44:42 AM

*****
Caution - there now follows a highly technical discussion of low-level graphics manipulation.  I suggest you don't read it.  You have been warned, so don't blame me if reading it does make your head explode.
*****


Alright, here's what I have so far: http://72.14.179.253/cmf/imgconv-20090729a.tar.bz2

The output I'm seeing is:
c_nat   ok   2.537796
c_tw   FAIL   3.148723
c_tbl   ok   2.567760


It's a bit messy, and slightly incomplete (I need to add alignment support), but it has your conversion function (c_tw), my naive C one (c_nat), and the simple lookup table (c_tbl). Yours says "FAIL" at the moment because it checks against c_nat by default and I think I'm using a slightly different output format than you right now. I'll try to resolve that. If you run it, you'll probably want to adjust the image size in main(); right now it runs on 32768x32768 images which take a total of ~10GB.

The key in optimizing kernels like these tends to be in inter-iteration parallelism. I don't think we'll be able to get much by just optimizing conversion functions for a single pixel. As it is yours runs a bit slower than mine right now because GCC4.3 isn't vectorizing yours for some reason, even though it has two less shifts. At first glance, it looks like GCC is at least doing vectorization with SSE plus maybe software pipelining, so it may be hard to do better. I am going to try to write an SSE3 kernel using GCC intrinsics first, for reference and in hopes that GCC will be able to schedule and software-pipeline it decently. Otherwise, I'll try a full assembly version (AMD64/Intel64 with SSE3).

EDIT: Note that I tried this with GCC 4.2, 4.3, 4.4, and 4.5. GCC4.2 doesn't vectorize the loop, and for some reason 4.4+ have performance regressions compared to 4.3 on this code... If anyone has different compilers handy, it would be interesting to see how they do.

Quote
Unless I'm much mistaken, MMX and friends don't support packed 16BPP so it would have to be done manually as I have done here.
I don't see anything directly supporting RGB565 in MMX/SSE, but it looks quite doable by using the regular SSE instructions to run at least 4-8 iterations in parallel.

Quote
You would need a different algorithm for each combination of input and output pixel format, and if it was being done on-the-fly you'd also need logic to choose the right algorithm which either means using a function pointer (and more performance hit) or some kind of if-then-else logic which will also be slow.
I'm assuming that we have pretty much full control over the image formats...

Quote
If we do have any assembly-heads, optimisations would be welcome.  Does coding belong in the Tower of Art?
I don't know, just tell me where I should be posting. :)

Quote
EDIT EDIT:
To get back to your original point, the issue is that the GPU isn't doing this, or at least is doing it in a half-assed manner that gives you about 8bpp worth of colourspace instead of 16bpp, ruining the shadows.   What I'm essentially proposing is software emulation layer to have the game running inside a 32bpp framebuffer.
OK, I'm not familiar with the games referenced in the original comment. I'm guessing they do all of the rendering on the CPU, then?
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tipod on July 29, 2009, 11:27:03 PM
You know how Call of Duty does scripted events pretty seamlessly and makes them awesome?
Yeah, Unreal 2 kind of went the other way with its scripted events. I know, I played through the entire thing.

To actually contribute, Air Zonk. Old school repping itt
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: M on July 30, 2009, 02:01:57 AM
Hmm, my favorite games? They would probably be these:

Okami
Paper Mario (both original and TTYD)
Klonoa 2
Tail Concerto
Phoenix Wright
Cooking Mama
DDR
Persona 4
Okage
Harvest Moon (ALL OF THEM)
Pokemon
Majora's Mask
Ocarina of Time
Twilight Princess
Final Fantasy IX
Professor Layton and the Curious Village (Can't wait for Diabolical Box)

There are probably more, but I can't think of them. X3
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 30, 2009, 04:26:53 AM
Quote from: Fibre on July 29, 2009, 08:13:19 PM
Alright, here's what I have so far: http://72.14.179.253/cmf/imgconv-20090729a.tar.bz2
Oo, fun.  I have a lot going at the moment but I'll try and play with it tonight.

QuoteYours says "FAIL" at the moment because it checks against c_nat by default and I think I'm using a slightly different output format than you right now. I'll try to resolve that. If you run it, you'll probably want to adjust the image size in main(); right now it runs on 32768x32768 images which take a total of ~10GB.
Yes, I was thinking of multiple iterations of 1024x768 framebuffers.  Mine was targetted at RGBA, but now I think of it, ARGB is more likely so I'll need to modify the shifts and masking accordingly.

QuoteThe key in optimizing kernels like these tends to be in inter-iteration parallelism. I don't think we'll be able to get much by just optimizing conversion functions for a single pixel. As it is yours runs a bit slower than mine right now because GCC4.3 isn't vectorizing yours for some reason, even though it has two less shifts. At first glance, it looks like GCC is at least doing vectorization with SSE plus maybe software pipelining, so it may be hard to do better. I am going to try to write an SSE3 kernel using GCC intrinsics first, for reference and in hopes that GCC will be able to schedule and software-pipeline it decently. Otherwise, I'll try a full assembly version (AMD64/Intel64 with SSE3).

I kind of dropped out of the assembler game after MMX, however if it is possible to do 64-bit shifts and ANDs, that would allow you to do two pixels per iteration.


QuoteI don't see anything directly supporting RGB565 in MMX/SSE, but it looks quite doable by using the regular SSE instructions to run at least 4-8 iterations in parallel.
I will have to look into that.

Quote
I'm assuming that we have pretty much full control over the image formats...
At the end of the day, it's most likely 565->0888.

QuoteI don't know, just tell me where I should be posting. :)
If this takes off, I may move it to the Tower and call it 'prose'...

QuoteOK, I'm not familiar with the games referenced in the original comment. I'm guessing they do all of the rendering on the CPU, then?
I don't really know, and to be honest I don't know enough about DirectX to know how feasible this would be, so at the moment it's more an intellectual exercise.  My basic concept (and I don't know if it's possible) was to hack Thief so that it creates a 16-bit software surface and then insert some kind of hook to new code so that it copies and converts the framebuffer to a hardward 32-bit surface.
This sort of thing has been done before, e.g. the Morrowind Graphics Extender, so it's not wholly impossible.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: RJ on July 30, 2009, 05:01:51 AM
As far as I know, I'm not losing at "Survive Living in Australia". Now that's a fun game.  :)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Fibre on July 30, 2009, 08:06:39 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 30, 2009, 04:26:53 AM
I kind of dropped out of the assembler game after MMX, however if it is possible to do 64-bit shifts and ANDs, that would allow you to do two pixels per iteration.

QuoteI don't see anything directly supporting RGB565 in MMX/SSE, but it looks quite doable by using the regular SSE instructions to run at least 4-8 iterations in parallel.
I will have to look into that.

The algorithm I am thinking of, in rough pseudo-code (hopefully the vector notation makes sense), is:

for(unsigned x = 0; x < pitch; x += 8)
{
v8i16 s = *(v8i16 const *)(src_row + x);
v4i32 s0 = <(i32)s[0], (i32)s[1], (i32)s[2], (i32)s[3]>;
v4i32 s1 = <(i32)s[4], (i32)s[5], (i32)s[6], (i32)s[7]>;

v4i32 r0 = (s0 << rshift) & rmask;
v4i32 r1 = (s1 << rshift) & rmask;

v4i32 g0 = (s0 << gshift) & gmask;
v4i32 g1 = (s1 << gshift) & gmask;

v4i32 b0 = (s0 << bshift) & bmask;
v4i32 b1 = (s1 << bshift) & bmask;

*(v4i32 *)(dest_row + x + 0) = r0 | g0 | b0;
*(v4i32 *)(dest_row + x + 4) = r1 | g1 | b1;
}


All of these vector operations appeared to be supported by at least SSE3, although I haven't mapped out the exact instructions/intrinsics yet. The unpacking/expansion at the beginning may need a few tricks but looks possible. Of course, when lowered this code will need to be intelligently scheduled, software-pipelined, and perhaps unrolled a bit to make full use of the hardware.

Quote
Quote
I'm assuming that we have pretty much full control over the image formats...
At the end of the day, it's most likely 565->0888.

Well, more than the exact pixel format, it would be useful to guarantee the alignment of rows as well as the legality of reading and writing the padding after each row. The above code, as is, requires 16-byte row alignment for efficiency, and must to be able to read the padding in the source and write it in the destination if the width is not a multiple of 8 pixels.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Janus Whitefurr on July 30, 2009, 08:40:53 AM
Quote from: RJ on July 30, 2009, 05:01:51 AM
As far as I know, I'm not losing at "Survive Living in Australia". Now that's a fun game.  :)

Except for the drop-bears.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: M on July 30, 2009, 12:28:52 PM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on July 30, 2009, 08:40:53 AM
Except for the drop-bears.

Don't forget the hoop snakes.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kenji on July 30, 2009, 01:37:51 PM
Quote from: Marmonstein on July 30, 2009, 02:01:57 AM
Hmm, my favorite games? They would probably be these:

Okami
Paper Mario (both original and TTYD)
Klonoa 2
Tail Concerto
Phoenix Wright
Cooking Mama
DDR
Persona 4
Okage
Harvest Moon (ALL OF THEM)
Pokemon
Majora's Mask
Ocarina of Time
Twilight Princess
Final Fantasy IX
Professor Layton and the Curious Village (Can't wait for Diabolical Box)

There are probably more, but I can't think of them. X3

Son of a... how did I forget Tail Concerto...
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: M on July 31, 2009, 01:31:37 AM
Quote from: Kenji on July 30, 2009, 01:37:51 PM
Son of a... how did I forget Tail Concerto...

I can't believe that there's someone else who knows about that game besides my sister and I. XD
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Vidar on July 31, 2009, 02:06:15 AM
Quote from: Marmonstein on July 30, 2009, 12:28:52 PM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on July 30, 2009, 08:40:53 AM
Except for the drop-bears.

Don't forget the hoop snakes.

Not to mention the spiders, crocodiles, scorpions, snakes, insect, grass, and everything else that wants to kill you. Why would anyone want to live in Oz anyway?

Also, Aquaria : buy this game. It's really pretty, and you get to kick the butts of a couple of gods while you explore the place.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: llearch n'n'daCorna on July 31, 2009, 06:32:35 AM
Quote from: Vidar on July 31, 2009, 02:06:15 AM
Not to mention the spiders, crocodiles, scorpions, snakes, insect, grass, and everything else that wants to kill you. Why would anyone want to live in Oz anyway?

Some of the sheep.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 31, 2009, 06:38:39 AM
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on July 31, 2009, 06:32:35 AM
Some of the sheep.

Do you mean that the heep are one of the reasons to live there, one of the many perils or both?  (Now I'm imagining some kind of sheep succubus or something)
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Janus Whitefurr on July 31, 2009, 06:49:34 AM
Quote from: Vidar on July 31, 2009, 02:06:15 AM
Not to mention the spiders, crocodiles, scorpions, snakes, insect, grass, and everything else that wants to kill you. Why would anyone want to live in Oz anyway?

External opinion seems to be that you ALSO get a drop-dead gorgeous accent that turns foreigners (usually of the US variety) into mush just hearing it.

And besides, it's not like we -wanted- to live here. We just adapted after Britain dumped us.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kipiru on July 31, 2009, 06:54:59 AM
I just thought of another underappreciated game I love- Kiss Psycho Circus: The Nightmare Child. It was a really fun game with unique atmosphere and characters. The only game I've played that really felt like you were in a wacky dream.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: hapless on July 31, 2009, 07:53:16 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 31, 2009, 06:38:39 AM
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on July 31, 2009, 06:32:35 AM
Some of the sheep.

Do you mean that the heep are one of the reasons to live there, one of the many perils or both?  (Now I'm imagining some kind of sheep succubus or something)

Quote from:  "The Last Continent" by Terry Pratchett
Death held out a hand, I WANT, he said, A BOOK ABOUT THE DANGEROUS
CREATURES OF FOURECKS -

Albert looked up and dived for cover, receiving only mild bruising
because he had the foresight to curl into a ball.

After a while Death, his voice a little muffled, said: ALBERT, I WOULD
BE SO GRATEFUL IF YOU COULD GIVE ME A HAND HERE.

Albert scrambled up and pulled at some of the huge volumes, finally
dislodging enough of them to allow his master to clamber free.

HMM . . . Death picked up a book at random and read the cover.

DANGEROUS MAMMALS, REPTILES, AMPHIBIANS, BIRDS, FISH, JELLYFISH,
INSECTS, SPIDERS, CRUSTACEANS, GRASSES, TREES, MOSSES, AND LICHENS OF
TERROR INCOGNITA, he read. His gaze moved down the spine. VOLUME 29C, he
added. OH. PART THREE, I SEE.

He glanced up at the listening shelves. POSSIBLY IT WOULD BE SIMPLER IF
I ASKED FOR A LIST OF THE HARMLESS CREATURES OF THE AFORESAID CONTINENT?

They waited.

IT WOULD APPEAR THAT -

'No, wait, master. Here it comes.'

Albert pointed to something white zigzagging lazily through the air.
Finally Death reached up and caught the single sheet of paper.

He read it carefully and then turned it over briefly just in case
anything was written on the other side.

'May I?' said Albert. Death handed him the paper.

' "Some of the sheep," ' Albert read aloud. 'Oh, well. Maybe a week at
the seaside'd be better, then.'
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: llearch n'n'daCorna on July 31, 2009, 08:04:32 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on July 31, 2009, 06:49:34 AM
External opinion seems to be that you ALSO get a drop-dead gorgeous accent that turns foreigners (usually of the US variety) into mush just hearing it.

... and an inability to pronounce "six" correctly. ;-]

Quote from: Tapewolf on July 31, 2009, 06:38:39 AM
Do you mean that the heep are one of the reasons to live there, one of the many perils or both?  (Now I'm imagining some kind of sheep succubus or something)

Perhaps.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on July 31, 2009, 08:27:06 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on July 31, 2009, 06:49:34 AM
And besides, it's not like we -wanted- to live here. We just adapted after Britain dumped us.

I think it was a case of 'go there or be hanged'  :B
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Janus Whitefurr on August 01, 2009, 01:20:14 AM
Quote from: Tapewolf on July 31, 2009, 08:27:06 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on July 31, 2009, 06:49:34 AM
And besides, it's not like we -wanted- to live here. We just adapted after Britain dumped us.

I think it was a case of 'go there or be hanged'  :B

Well, we're all hung as it is, sooo.....

(on topic!)

While my favouritest favourite games flip flop about as I wallow through new games or into nostalgia, a recent release on Steam - Nikopol - Secrets of the Immortals has eaten all my attention. Primarily because being a point and click first person adventure game with an emphasis on neat puzzles that actually make me -think- for once, I'm having the time of my life stretching my brain, given I haven't had a good adventure puzzle in a long time.

Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Kenji on August 01, 2009, 01:29:02 AM
Quote from: Marmonstein on July 31, 2009, 01:31:37 AM
Quote from: Kenji on July 30, 2009, 01:37:51 PM
Son of a... how did I forget Tail Concerto...

I can't believe that there's someone else who knows about that game besides my sister and I. XD

After my brother found the demo on a GamePro disc, when the demo was in Japanese, I bugged the crap out of the local game store until finally it was reservable.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Brownie on August 01, 2009, 04:50:40 AM
Right now?

Red Alert 2: Yuri's Revenge (Mental Omega Mod)
Demi-God (Insatiable vampires FTW.)

That's really it.
When I'm not playing RA2 or on teh interwebz, I'm beating up demi-gods to become the next God.

And Unbeknownst, I'm going to be the first to give you +1 whatever that thing is (I know it doesn't make up for the -4) for actually making a post, let alone topic, that actually had some merit and was (is) worth replying to.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tapewolf on August 01, 2009, 08:49:50 AM
Quote from: The DXM on July 28, 2009, 04:55:03 PM
I hope it's almost as good as locking Walton Simons in the closet and putting UNATCO into the state of a functional mad house.
Sadly I seem to have tapped out most of that kind of stuff.  However I have just discovered that putting barrels on the energy lathes in the Versalife lab has some rather interesting effects.
The poison barrels in particular will drop the frame rate to one frame per second on my dual-core 2.4GHz machine, and create an ever-increasing cloud of evil so intense that it will kill Denton in under two seconds.  Note that the barrel is not destroyed, and the cloud is far in excess of what you'd usually get by damaging the barrel slightly.

(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/tapewolf/games/Shot0003.png)
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/tapewolf/games/Shot0003.png

(http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/tapewolf/games/Shot0002.png)
http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k216/tapewolf/games/Shot0002.png
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Sicill on August 01, 2009, 09:36:21 PM
Games I enjoy?

Alpha Centauri
Avernum 1,2 & Exile 3
Civilization 3 & 4
Deus Ex
Diablo 2 and Expansion
Fallout 3
Marathon 1, Durandal, Evil, Infinity, Red & Rubicon
Myst & Riven
Okami
Pocket Tanks
Warcraft 2 & 3
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: RJ on August 02, 2009, 09:33:53 AM
I forgot to say Eternal Sonata.

It's preeeetty.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Gareeku on August 02, 2009, 05:52:36 PM
-a few Street Fighter games (Street Fighter Alpha 3, Street Fighter III: Third Strike, Street Fighter IV to name some)
-King of Fighters XI (have yet to play XII)
-Capcom vs SNK 2
-Marvel vs Capcom 2
-Blazblue
-Garou: Mark of the Wolves
-Tekken 5: Dark Resurrection (cannot WAIT for Tekken 6)
-Super Mario Galaxy
-Tomb Raider games

So yeah. A bit of a fighting game nut. Oh well.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Tipod on August 02, 2009, 06:24:36 PM
A fighting game nut but no Def Jam? >:[
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Gareeku on August 02, 2009, 06:28:26 PM
um....no.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: ooklah on August 03, 2009, 04:12:33 PM
in non-elemental order:

EvE Online
Guildwars
Audio Surf
DDR
Team Fortress 2
Munchkin  >:3
Odin Sphere
Okami
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Sprocketsdance on August 03, 2009, 05:17:13 PM
Quote from: RJ on August 02, 2009, 09:33:53 AM
I forgot to say Eternal Sonata.

It's preeeetty.

I've wanted to play that one so bad.. I'm a bit infatuated with the guy in the tophat...  >:3 ANYWAYS!

My extensive list of games include:

Kingdome Hearts (1 and chain of memories)
DDR (ultimate favorite)
A tiny bit of Prince of Persia.. although I mostly just watch


... and that's right ooklah.. you like DDR.... I know you do...  >:3
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Succubus_1982 on August 12, 2009, 06:15:00 PM
(Hope this thread is still recent enough that I'm not necroing here)

I've never been a fan of console games and I am usually too broke to afford to buy all the latest new games for the PC so most of my favourite games are really REALLY old-school retro.

Of first person shooters I like the old Doom games, Tomb Raider games, Duke Nukem 3D games and Wolfenstein. Uh Blake Stone also.

Platforms I like.... The old pre-3D Duke Nukem games, Cosmos Cosmic Adventures (cute and fun if v.childish), Lemmings, Jazz Jackrabbit (1 & 2) Hocus Pocus, Alien Carnage (aka Halloween Harry), Bio Menace, Captain Comic (officially the cruddiest platform game ever xD but I loved it), Commander Keen, Monster Bash (This one was one of my FAVOURITES it was so campy and fun!) Prince of Persia (I'm talking about the OLD OLD original version here, though I've seen a friend play the new ones and they do look pretty awesome) um many more like that, that I can't remember....

Adventure games. i.e. the Point & Click variety. Probably my favourite kind of games. I had all the Leisure Suit Larrys (yes I'm a bad dirty girl), Space Quest, Kings Quest, Simon the Sorcerer, The Feeble Files etc.

Aside from that there were one or two racing or flight simulator games that were playable and some card games I liked. I'm also fond of Mahjong.

Would I ever get a console and play new games? Probably not. I've never really liked the way consoles are controlled and a large chunk of the new games just don't hold the fascination for me that the old retro ones do. I guess that's just the way I am. I would quite fancy trying out the new Prince of Persia though if I could afford it for PC.

Oh I forgot..... I also used to play sim games like The Sims and strategy games like AOE.

By the way anyone interested in trying out any of these old games for nostalgia's sake most of them can be downloaded here http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/games/ (http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/games/) You may need to download a patch to make some of them work if your PC doesn't have DOS. http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/ (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/) is another good site for user-made Adventure games (point & click) its where I got the majority of my updated versions of Kings Quest games.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Janus Whitefurr on August 13, 2009, 06:00:06 AM
Quote from: wuffnpuff on August 03, 2009, 05:17:13 PM
Quote from: RJ on August 02, 2009, 09:33:53 AM
I forgot to say Eternal Sonata.

It's preeeetty.

I've wanted to play that one so bad.. I'm a bit infatuated with the guy in the tophat...  >:3 ANYWAYS!

The combat system makes me feel so annoyed I want to EAT KITTENS.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: JackTheCubiWolf on August 13, 2009, 11:29:14 PM
For me? Basically every video game I've ever played. And I've played a lot. Although, right now I'm focusing on the multiplayer for Call of Duty World at War for the Wii.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: RJ on August 14, 2009, 07:14:19 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on August 13, 2009, 06:00:06 AM
Quote from: wuffnpuff on August 03, 2009, 05:17:13 PM
Quote from: RJ on August 02, 2009, 09:33:53 AM
I forgot to say Eternal Sonata.

It's preeeetty.

I've wanted to play that one so bad.. I'm a bit infatuated with the guy in the tophat...  >:3 ANYWAYS!

The combat system makes me feel so annoyed I want to EAT KITTENS.

Really? I have no problems with it... maybe it's just me and the fact I've played it a bajillion times now.
Title: Re: Games you lurve
Post by: Janus Whitefurr on August 14, 2009, 07:55:43 AM
Quote from: RJ on August 14, 2009, 07:14:19 AM
Quote from: Janus Whitefurr on August 13, 2009, 06:00:06 AM
The combat system makes me feel so annoyed I want to EAT KITTENS.

Really? I have no problems with it... maybe it's just me and the fact I've played it a bajillion times now.

EAT. KITTENS. I ended up trading it in because of it, honestly. Don't get me wrong, the plot was intriguing and the music is lovely. But with the seemingly arbitrary timing required on some of the blocking animations and the fact that "you didn't grind up your levels" lead to "new area monsters kill you really easily"... yeah. I liked everything BUT the combat system. :u