Right, not sure if anyone else knew about this, couldn't find any references to it anywhere... but this was too awesome to keep in the dark.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/16/The_Tar-Aiym_Krang.jpg/200px-The_Tar-Aiym_Krang.jpg)
Link to an image with a better view of Alan Dean Foster's Version of Pip (http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0345461592.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tar-Aiym_Krang (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tar-Aiym_Krang) <-- Obligatory wikipedia link
Now this leads me to ask a few questions...
1.) Amber, did you even know about these books?
2.) If not, what do you think are the odds of your pip, and the pip from the series "Pip and Flinx" looking almost identical, and sharing the same name?
edit: A third question appears out of the shadows!.) IS AMBER A TIME TRAVELER! D:
Wow, that's interesting
Quote from: Slowtini on May 17, 2008, 08:32:43 PM
Right, not sure if anyone else knew about this, couldn't find any references to it anywhere... but this was too awesome to keep in the dark.
It has come up before on the old forum. Looks like it was just under 4 years ago:
http://nice.llearch.net/dmfa_forum0657.htm
I wonder whether it was asked again after that because IIRC I didn't join the community until 2005...
Quote from: Tapewolf on May 17, 2008, 08:43:10 PM
Quote from: Slowtini on May 17, 2008, 08:32:43 PM
Right, not sure if anyone else knew about this, couldn't find any references to it anywhere... but this was too awesome to keep in the dark.
It has come up before on the old forum. Looks like it was just under 4 years ago:
http://nice.llearch.net/dmfa_forum0657.htm
I wonder whether it was asked again after that because IIRC I didn't join the community until 2005...
Thanks for answering that one, Tapewolf. -raises Tapewolf's karma for being helpful- ;D
Quote from: Slowtini on May 17, 2008, 08:48:11 PM
Thanks for answering that one, Tapewolf. -raises Tapewolf's karma for being helpful- ;D
Heh. I've read some of that series, so naturally it came to my attention :3
having read a few of these, foster's pip is prettymuch nothing like the DMFA pip.
also, foster's pip is more rainbowy if i recall. and a lot more winged-snakelike than the cover artists make him out to be. it's been a while, though.
Quote from: icarus on May 17, 2008, 09:28:39 PM
having read a few of these, foster's pip is prettymuch nothing like the DMFA pip.
also, foster's pip is more rainbowy if i recall. and a lot more winged-snakelike than the cover artists make him out to be. it's been a while, though.
I wasn't referring to the character per-se, but to the fact that the cover art of the books looks like DMFA's pip, and the name is identical.
Hooray for crazy coincidences.
well, the chances are amber may not have known about pip/flinx books. foster has about ten zillion series and all of them are rather pulpy popcorn scifi reads. bookstores stock a random handful (usually the ones that AREN'T series) and since the flinx books are so old, they're usually left out in favour of, say, spellsinger or that series about the talking dog being kidnapped into space.
frrrrom what i recall in some of the flinx books, pip barely plays an important role. he's just sort of one of those gimmick characters the author is later like 'man, lemme just STORE this guy for a while...'
Pip is Pip's descendant?
In the Pip/Flinx books, Pip is highly venomous and spits the poison which kills in less than a minute and can also eat through steel plate. I had wondered about it myself but figured that it was one of those things that it was better not to know. Pip in the Pip/Flinx series makes Pip in the DMFA universe look downright friendly.
However, here is a comment from Amber (http://clockworkmansion.com/forum/index.php/topic,2439.msg100508.html#msg100508).
Quote from: Naldru on May 17, 2008, 11:04:34 PM
In the Pip/Flinx books, Pip is highly venomous and spits the poison which kills in less than a minute and can also eat through steel plate.
DMFA Pip could probably bite through steel plate if he had a reason(Dan, I assume), and he talks, and one day he'll grow up to be a great ol'
dragon with lots of little Pips of his own :)
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 17, 2008, 11:44:56 PM
Quote from: Naldru on May 17, 2008, 11:04:34 PM
In the Pip/Flinx books, Pip is highly venomous and spits the poison which kills in less than a minute and can also eat through steel plate.
DMFA Pip could probably bite through steel plate if he had a reason(Dan, I assume), and he talks, and one day he'll grow up to be a great ol' dragon with lots of little Pips of his own :)
Yaaaay! :V
...God, Now I know I've been reading this comic too long...
What kind of hellish impossible offspring could result from an unholy union of Pip and Pyroduck?
Errr...actually drakes don't turn into dragons. So someday Pip will grow up to be a great ol' Drake(how big do they get?) with lots of Pips of his own.
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 18, 2008, 12:10:55 AM
Errr...actually drakes don't turn into dragons. So someday Pip will grow up to be a great ol' Drake(how big do they get?) with lots of Pips of his own.
...-pictures dan a thousand years from now, staring down the dreaded "GIGANTO-PIP AND FRIENDS! :mwaha"
Quote from: Slowtini on May 18, 2008, 12:16:49 AM
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 18, 2008, 12:10:55 AM
Errr...actually drakes don't turn into dragons. So someday Pip will grow up to be a great ol' Drake(how big do they get?) with lots of Pips of his own.
...-pictures dan a thousand years from now, staring down the dreaded "GIGANTO-PIP AND FRIENDS! :mwaha"
Don't forget Ms. Pip.
I wonder what part(s) Pip will play in Mab's scheming.
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 18, 2008, 12:24:08 AM
Quote from: Slowtini on May 18, 2008, 12:16:49 AM
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 18, 2008, 12:10:55 AM
Errr...actually drakes don't turn into dragons. So someday Pip will grow up to be a great ol' Drake(how big do they get?) with lots of Pips of his own.
...-pictures dan a thousand years from now, staring down the dreaded "GIGANTO-PIP AND FRIENDS! :mwaha"
Don't forget Ms. Pip.
I wonder what part(s) Pip will play in Mab's scheming.
Hmm...
Knowing how crazy Amber is, probably something quite humorous.
*Pip falls in love with Dan's wing tentacles* ...That would make quite a humorous nightmare sequence actually D:
Amber... doooooooo eeeeeeeeeeet
Quote from: Tapewolf on May 17, 2008, 08:43:10 PM
Quote from: Slowtini on May 17, 2008, 08:32:43 PM
Right, not sure if anyone else knew about this, couldn't find any references to it anywhere... but this was too awesome to keep in the dark.
It has come up before on the old forum. Looks like it was just under 4 years ago:
http://nice.llearch.net/dmfa_forum0657.htm
I wonder whether it was asked again after that because IIRC I didn't join the community until 2005...
it's actually come up on this forum once before as well.
Quote from: Deebs' servant on May 18, 2008, 12:10:55 AM
Errr...actually drakes don't turn into dragons. So someday Pip will grow up to be a great ol' Drake(how big do they get?) with lots of Pips of his own.
Would those be Pipettes? :P
You might want to look at this out of curiosity.
http://cgi.ebay.com/*-LIL-PIP-FLYING-DRAGON-*-HANDMADE-3D-HANGING-STEEL-ART_W0QQitemZ110255448237QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0805231138a16629 (http://cgi.ebay.com/*-LIL-PIP-FLYING-DRAGON-*-HANDMADE-3D-HANGING-STEEL-ART_W0QQitemZ110255448237QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0805231138a16629)
It was once stated that the greatest coincidence would have been if there were no coincidences.
***** *****
Okay, let's get down to mathematics
IIRC Pip/Pippin basically means "my little friend". According to The Free Dictionary (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Pippin) and online etymology dictionary (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=pippin), it is a person or thing that is admired. Characters are referred to as Pip or Pippin in
The Lord of the Rings
Pippin (the Broadway musical)
The Land of Oz by L. Frank Baum (one could see this Pip making a guest appearance in The Wotch)
Great Expectations
The Pippi Longstocking books
The Flinx/Pip books by Alan Dean Foster
A Twilight Zone episode that I believe was named For Love of Pip
Some people and things referred to as Pip or Pippin
Dirk Bogarde (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001958/bio)
a game/multimedia machine released by Apple in 1994 (http://www.theapplemuseum.com/index.php?id=57)
In determining the coincidence level, it is very necessary to check the probability that two of the characters out of the set of characters known as Pip or Pippin would be dragons. As the size of this set increases, the probability that at least two would be dragons increases rapidly.
The other way to look at this would be to look at the set of characters that are small dragon like creatures and determine the probability that at least two of these would be named Pip or Pippin. If the probability of a subordinate character being named Pip is over one percent and there are over one hundred stories where the subordinate character is a small dragon-like creature, the probability that there wouldn't be two characters who are small dragon-like characters named Pip would be ... (If you think I'm going to do the math this late at night, you're crazy.)
Okay, I'm crazy. The probability is thirty seven percent (.99 to the 100th power). This means that there is at least a 63 percent that there would be two small dragon-like subordinate characters in unrelated books due to sheer chance. If I really did the research, I believe that I would find that the above estimates are overly conservative by at least an order of magnitude.
This does not include the possibility of common literary archetypes resulting in non-random association of the characteristics. Such associations would make the occurrences of coincidences even less coincidental.
I may have made some math errors above. I am tired, because of the time of day and because I hate conspiracy theories unless done in fun. It also looks I'm going to miss Anthrocon this year, and that is making me very cranky.
Quote from: Naldru on May 25, 2008, 09:01:19 PM
You might want to look at this out of curiosity.
http://cgi.ebay.com/*-LIL-PIP-FLYING-DRAGON-*-HANDMADE-3D-HANGING-STEEL-ART_W0QQitemZ110255448237QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0805231138a16629 (http://cgi.ebay.com/*-LIL-PIP-FLYING-DRAGON-*-HANDMADE-3D-HANGING-STEEL-ART_W0QQitemZ110255448237QQcmdZViewItem?IMSfp=TL0805231138a16629)
It was once stated that the greatest coincidence would have been if there were no coincidences.
Curiouser and curiouser...
When I first read DMFA and saw Pip, I figured that Amber had read Flinx (good series, BTW) and just decided she liked the name Pip for a drake/mini-dragon. But coincidence works for me too.
Wold it be more or less coincidental to find more planets called "Bob"?
Quote from: Naldru on May 25, 2008, 09:01:19 PM
IIRC Pip/Pippin basically means "my little friend".
Hmm. I was going to say "That explains this strip (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_561.php)", but I misremembered who was the little friend. Nuts. So much for that one...
Oh wow, someone actually dug out my old arse question topic from way back when in the days or yore. Times like this make me smiles :)
Quote from: AmigaDragon on May 26, 2008, 11:59:37 AM
When I first read DMFA and saw Pip, I figured that Amber had read Flinx (good series, BTW) and just decided she liked the name Pip for a drake/mini-dragon. But coincidence works for me too.
Wold it be more or less coincidental to find more planets called "Bob"?
This begins to become complicated. My first reaction is that there is an archetypal basis for Planet Bob. I'm going to have to think about this.
For example, it was the name of Mankind's new home in the film Titan AE. The first thing to research would be whether this was actually the first occurrence of "Planet Bob". If it is, a case could be made that this is the seed of the concept or close to the seed. The film was released in the year 2000.
It is the name of a world in CyberNations (http://cybernations.wikia.com/wiki/Planet_Bob)
There is a planet-bob (http://www.planet-bob.org) web site
There was a movie on diversity named Planet Bob
There is a web site http://www.planetbob.com (http://www.planetbob.com) that promises to tell us how to save the Earth. However, considering that it was supposed to go line early 2007, it appears that it has died.
If there were multiple Planet Bob's out there that were due to coincidence, I would also expect to find Planet John's, Planet Joe's, Planet Henry's, Planet Paul's, Planet William's, etc. The fact that these other variants don't seem to occur would appear to indicate that the multiple occurrences are not coincidental. That's just my instant gut feeling.
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 26, 2008, 02:23:19 PM
Quote from: Naldru on May 25, 2008, 09:01:19 PM
IIRC Pip/Pippin basically means "my little friend".
Hmm. I was going to say "That explains this strip (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_561.php)", but I misremembered who was the little friend. Nuts. So much for that one...
I believe that that is a reference to the movie Scarface (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scarface_(1983_film))
Quote from: Naldru on May 26, 2008, 10:46:17 PM
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 26, 2008, 02:23:19 PM
Hmm. I was going to say "That explains this strip (http://www.missmab.com/Comics/Vol_561.php)", but I misremembered who was the little friend. Nuts. So much for that one...
I believe that that is a reference to the movie Scarface (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scarface_(1983_film))
That, too, but there's no reason it can't be both, right? ;-]
Sorry. When you spend your days listening to questions as bizarre as the ones I hear, it is sometimes difficult to tell when somebody is kidding. (How do I turn it on? Push the button marked "on". , etc.)
I researched Planet Bob a little more. Please note that the fact that something could be a coincidence does not mean that it is.
Apparently the reference to Bob is because of a series of jokes in which Bob is the answer to everything (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=BOB), the name to use when you can't think of a name. For example, the television series Reboot (http://www.mainframe.ca) had a character named Bob while most of the other names were based on computer terms (Phong, Dot Matrix, Megabyte, Hexadecimal, etc.). I saw an interview stating that they just wanted to pick a regular name rather than computer term for the character. (Of course, there is a BOB computer acronym for blitter object.)
There was also a Bob the Lizard in the Grimjack series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_GrimJack_supporting_characters#Bob).
This sounds like British humor. (The people who came up with the idea of the free beer and sex settings on machinery. They sound oh so tempting, but they'll get you in so much trouble later. "Free beer and sex settings" was actually used by a British computer engineer who wanted to emphasize not to push the equipment beyond its design limits.)
Given this history, I see it as possible that there would be another Planet Bob without reference to Titan AE, but I find it unlikely. If this type of semantic pertubation was taking place, I would expect to see other references to geological features named Bob, possibly a Lake Bob located next Lake George or the Bob Mountains.
I really can't believe that I'm doing this. I think this will be the end of my participation in the discussion while I have some sanity left. (I know it's too late.)
You brought sanity in here?! :eek
Don't you read the warnings we give people when they join up?
I seem to recall a Planet Bob in some of the Sci Fi I read when I was younger. I'd be hard pushed to locate it, though; possibly some of the random planets mentioned by David Weber in the Honor Harrington stories, although I don't think so - I'm leaning more towards mention in some of Anne McCaffrey's stories, although that doesn't sound right either...
I suspect I'll eventually remember and go "d'uh!". Oh, well...
I found a mention of a Planet Bob in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy series.
I would be more inclined to think Harry Harrison rather than Harrington.
http://www.subgenius.com/bigfist/FIST2003-1/1churchly_news/X0005_Alan_Dean_Foster-_Su.html (http://www.subgenius.com/bigfist/FIST2003-1/1churchly_news/X0005_Alan_Dean_Foster-_Su.html)
There was also a suggestion that there may be something at Church of the Subgenius (http://www.subgenius.com) although this may be merely the idea of Bob as the answer to everything.
Mention of Church of the Subgenius and Bob (http://www.popmatters.com/film/reviews/t/titan-ae.shtml)
If Church of the Subgenius is the source of the Bob references, this would represent a direct relationship and not coinincidence.
I came across this Freefall strip (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1200/fv01115.htm) that mentions planets being called Bob.
Quote from: LionHeart on May 28, 2008, 02:42:29 PM
I came across this Freefall strip (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1200/fv01115.htm) that mentions planets being called Bob.
Given that the poster in the back is a poster for Titan AE, I would say that the usage here is definitely based on the usage of the term in Titan AE and therefore not coincidental.
Quote from: LionHeart on May 28, 2008, 02:42:29 PM
I came across this Freefall strip (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1200/fv01115.htm) that mentions planets being called Bob.
CURSE YOUUUU...
I read 1,117 strips of that in one sitting...
It's good, isn't it? ;-]
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 31, 2008, 05:22:45 AM
It's good, isn't it? ;-]
It has helped me keep my sanity through excellent advice on such things as
Giving compliments to women (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00210.htm)
Answering questions from women (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00211.htm)
Mealtime etiquette (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff200/fv00192.htm)
Dealing with non-engineers (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00255.htm)
By the way, I did read the warnings before I came here. This is where I go to find my sanity. (When my mind wanders, it goes to strange places.)
Quote from: Naldru on May 31, 2008, 01:02:02 PM
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on May 31, 2008, 05:22:45 AM
It's good, isn't it? ;-]
It has helped me keep my sanity through excellent advice on such things as
Giving compliments to women (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00210.htm)
Answering questions from women (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00211.htm)
Mealtime etiquette (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff200/fv00192.htm)
Dealing with non-engineers (http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff300/fv00255.htm)
By the way, I did read the warnings before I came here. This is where I go to find my sanity. (When my mind wanders, it goes to strange places.)
When my mind wanders, I have trouble finding it again... x-x
Quote from: Slowtini on May 31, 2008, 06:54:41 PM
When my mind wanders, I have trouble finding it again... x-x
Mine wandered 12 years ago, and I haven't seen it since. :< It sends me post cards though. :3
You do realize that this thread could go a long way before we become unraveled.
***
My mind wanders so much it earns frequent flyer miles.
***
Sorry. My mind wandered.
Do you think that it will ever return?
***
He tried writing a train of consciousness novel, but the train derailed.
***
That is the end of my puny puns on this topic.
I haven't lost my mind - it's backed up on tape around here somewhere.
Quote from: llearch n'n'daCorna on June 01, 2008, 05:51:17 AM
I haven't lost my mind - it's backed up on tape around here somewhere.
But do you have anything that can read the tapes. I have some old 2400 foot 800 dpi tapes (The kind you used to see in all the movies.), but I don't know where I would find anything that would read them.
Quote from: Naldru on June 01, 2008, 11:08:17 AM
But do you have anything that can read the tapes. I have some old 2400 foot 800 dpi tapes (The kind you used to see in all the movies.), but I don't know where I would find anything that would read them.
http://www.m4data.com/ - the 9914 looks like it will do what you want, assuming you have buckets of money >:3
You've been able to get desktop 9-track drives with a SCSI interface for a while now - though admittedly I didn't know they were still being made. If you were sufficiently curious you could probably get one on ebay, though it would probably be better just to find someone who does format conversion.